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Author | Topic: The definition of science: What should it be? | |||||||||||||||||||
crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
Methodological naturalism 'presupposes' that there is no external cause, and that the explanation for the existence of a creature (or organism), the earth, or the cosmos as a whole is found within the creature, the earth, or cosmos itself. You're just making this up. Aren't you? I mean, you didn't actually look up "methodological naturalism" at all before you posted this, right? Here's the first paragrahp from the Wikipedia entry on "methodological naturalism":
quote: Now, how did you get what you posted from that? Why is it that your definition of "methodological naturalism" seems to have absolutely nothing to do with either "naturalism" or "methodology"?
To confuse the issue, there are varying definitions of what methodological naturalism means Not really. There's the real definition, as defined by people who are methodological naturalists; and then there's the definition you posted, which you just made up. That doesn't really "confuse the issue." The only thing confused seems to be your understanding of what words mean. Since you oppose methodological naturalism, could you post a coherent explanation of what "methodological supernaturalism" would be? For that matter, what is the supernatural? There's only one coherent definition that I'm aware of:
quote: Doesn't seem very relevant to science, though. (Courtesy of Bronze Dog.)
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
How does one pursue the supernatural? I dunno. What is it?
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
I'm going to have to do some serious studying, or give up the gig. There's a 3rd option - ask us questions. Ask us to explain things you don't understand. I get that evolution doesn't make sense to you. But surely you recognize that it makes sense to us? Why don't you ask us the questions you need to ask to understand why?
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
Hey crash, is stupidity 'wrong', because you sure 'hate' it? And if the reason is that it has led to so much violence and sufferring, then I have to say it is 'immoral.' Perhaps Hitler had a good plan huh? eliminate the dummies... You are your worst nightmare. So, your response to my suggestion that you ask questions to learn more is to insunuate that I want to herd you into a gas chamber and murder you?
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
This is what could be called "the fallacy of false parity." Other people have hit most of your errors but I thought I'd take this one:
Evolution is the basis of atheism (yes-the BELIEF there is no God). This is demonstratably false. All one needs to do is observe that atheism predates evolution to refute your assertion that evolution forms a basis for atheism.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
Why pursue what is not achievable? Because a half truth is better than an all lie.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
The onlything we should seek is the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. That means science is not the tool... So you say, but here we are using computers to access the internet, you from California and me from Missouri, thanks to the study of physics, chemistry, and mathematics. I'm sure you're nowhere near as old as your avatar (I'm certainly not as green and leggy as mine) but you probably know people who are; they're still alive because of advances in medicine and biology. It certainly wasn't religion that brought us any of those things. The fact that science is the tool for approaching truths and developing models about the natural world is obvious to the most casual observer.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
To take the single line of science in the search for truth, would be to block out other necessary angles. If you say so, but honestly I'm not aware of any area where the basic idea of consensus observation wouldn't work. Maybe you have something in mind?
I think it is those who admit they have a bias and agenda that are the most trustworthy. And I put my trust in those who get results. The results of science are manifest. The results of wooly, spiritual thinking? Bupkis.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
How will you ever know that that's true? Wrong theories don't get much work done.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
Adolf Hitler and Joseph Mengele got results... No, they didn't. And to portray the Holocaust as some kind of atheistic, scientistic investigation carried out with no regard to human sensibilities is absurd, and displays an ignorance of history. The Holocaust was a sectarian conflict between German Christians and Jews, just about any way you look at it. Mengele wasn't a scientist; he was a sadist in a lab coat. A torturer, not an experimenter. And I don't find the testimony of two dead white guys that the culture they grew up in and lived all their lives in was better than everybody else's very compelling. Everybody says that about their own culture. Norman Borlaug used science to save 1.5 billion lives. That's "billion" with a "b." Your religion had absolutely no power to do the same. If not for science, they would have starved to death.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1498 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
We agree! Oh my God! What does that mean? That you, apparently, have a really weird definition of "work." Apparently, you look back over the scientific, medical, and technological achievements of the last 600 years - extending life, conquering diseases and famines, exploring the world of the atom and the far reaches of the solar system - and don't see anything particularly interesting or significant.
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