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Author Topic:   Replacing Consumerism
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 20 of 89 (643216)
12-05-2011 4:55 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by crashfrog
12-05-2011 4:30 PM


Re: Where do we Take it from Here?
Hi crash,
crashfrog writes:
I think you hopelessly have no idea what you're talking about.
I know I don't know what I am talking about.
I consume less than my income.
But the problem in America is just the opposite, most Americans consume more than their income.
They buy cars they can't afford.
They buy those large houses they can't afford.
They buy all kinds of gadgets they don't need.
They do all these things to keep up with the neighbors.
We have a Government that consumes a lot more that it has income to cover and that is why we have a 15+trillion debt and rising by 4 billion dollars a day.
The cure for the problem is for everyone to live within their means. In other words don't spend more than you make.
There is nothing wrong with consumerism.
The problem is the consumers, consuming more than they can afford.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by crashfrog, posted 12-05-2011 4:30 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by crashfrog, posted 12-05-2011 5:15 PM ICANT has replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 22 of 89 (643222)
12-05-2011 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by Jon
12-05-2011 4:40 PM


Re: Where do we Take it from Here?
Hi Jon,
Jon writes:
but others of us see it as a serious societal problem that needs a solution.
There is no problem as long as you do not spend more than you can pay for out of your income. The problem only exist when people spend money they don't have to spend.
If I want something I simply ask the question, do I have enough money to pay for this item? Then I ask do I need this item? If the answer to both questions is yes, then I purchase the item. If the answer to either one is no, then I do not purchase the item.
But I guess that comes from following the advice of Paul when he said: "without covetousness, content with such things as ye have, for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee".
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by Jon, posted 12-05-2011 4:40 PM Jon has not replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 25 of 89 (643229)
12-05-2011 5:24 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by Jon
12-05-2011 4:32 PM


Re: How much is too much?
Hi Jon,
Jon writes:
Read the chapter in my links. Crushing debt is one of the side-effects of consumerism,
Crushing debt is the product of spending more money than you have income.
The US Government spends 4 billion dollars a day more than they take in. That is why our debt is 15+ trillion dollars and rising.
Our government has a spending problem.
Americans have a spending problem.
The only way to fix either is to stop spending more that you take in, or increase the income.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Jon, posted 12-05-2011 4:32 PM Jon has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by crashfrog, posted 12-05-2011 5:29 PM ICANT has replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 27 of 89 (643247)
12-05-2011 6:26 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by crashfrog
12-05-2011 5:15 PM


Re: Where do we Take it from Here?
Hi crash,
crashfrog writes:
But we're hardly in any sort of position where Americans consume "more than their income."
Do you have any debt? If so you spend more than your income.
Here is the latest figures for debt in America.
quote:
The latest statistics from the Federal Reserve indicate that the total amount of consumer debt outstanding remained fairly steady in 2010. The total amount of consumer debt in the United States stands at nearly $2.4 trillion. Based on the 2010 Census statistics, that works out to be nearly $7,800 in debt for every man, woman and child that lives here in the U.S.
If you're saying to yourself - that that statistic doesn't seem quite so bad - keep this in mind: We're talking about consumer credit, which does not include debt secured by real estate. If you thought that number has debt associated with mortgages, it doesn't.
Source
quote:
Consumer and commercial bankruptcy filings are on pace to reach a stunning 1.5 million this year, according to a report from Automated Access to Court Electronic Records.
Source
6,000 bankruptcies per day is caused by people spending money they did not have and then not being able to procure the money to pay the debt with.
quote:
At face value, the similarities between China and the United States, with respect to relative levels of assets to income, as well as demographics, are remarkable. The level of debt to average income, however, is not. The average US household debt is 136% of household income, compared to 17% for the Chinese. Moreover, if we include federal borrowing, the United States number increases an additional $109,792 per household, to $224,303 per household or 266% of average household income.
It really looks like a huge spending problem to me.
Simple solution is to live within your means. (not spend more than you make) Do you agree or disagree?
crashfrog writes:
They're the group that is overwhelmingly supporting a lavish lifestyle on the public dole. But somehow I guess its only "consumerism" when 25-year-olds spend their own money on iPhones, not when Buzsaw spends my tax dollars to maintain a lavish New York home.
Source
Well your tax dollars would not be going to support Buz or anyone that receives social security had not the government taken the money that was put into social security and spent it. There should be over 3 trillion dollars in the trust fund when there is only IOU'S from the government.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by crashfrog, posted 12-05-2011 5:15 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by crashfrog, posted 12-05-2011 6:43 PM ICANT has not replied
 Message 38 by nwr, posted 12-05-2011 10:32 PM ICANT has not replied
 Message 40 by Artemis Entreri, posted 12-06-2011 9:34 AM ICANT has not replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 28 of 89 (643249)
12-05-2011 6:35 PM
Reply to: Message 26 by crashfrog
12-05-2011 5:29 PM


Re: How much is too much?
Hi crash,
crashfrog writes:
ICANT writes:
The only way to fix either is to stop spending more that you take in, or increase the income.
Or, both.
I inserted my name.
So you believe a person can get out of debt making less than they spend.
How would you accomplish that?
The only way a person can get out of debt is to spend less than their income.
If you have no debt as I do then you can spend everything you make if you desire to without adding debt.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by crashfrog, posted 12-05-2011 5:29 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 30 by crashfrog, posted 12-05-2011 6:47 PM ICANT has not replied

  
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