Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9164 total)
5 online now:
Newest Member: ChatGPT
Post Volume: Total: 916,909 Year: 4,166/9,624 Month: 1,037/974 Week: 364/286 Day: 7/13 Hour: 0/2


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Evolution of Humans even more complex than thought
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3805 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 1 of 7 (634277)
09-20-2011 12:38 PM


The evolution of human morphology had generally been thought to be one that was more straightforward, with the more gracile forms replacing the more robust forms, such as Neanderthals and the recently discovered Denisovians (with little to no hybridization). Re-analysis of the Iwo Eleru cranium along with other fossils found in the Congo, appears to indicate a more complex picture of human evolution, with archaic features retained among populations living more recently than previously believed.
Additional link to BBC News report for a quick review of the paper.

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Percy, posted 09-20-2011 1:20 PM DBlevins has replied
 Message 4 by RAZD, posted 09-20-2011 3:54 PM DBlevins has not replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3805 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 3 of 7 (634298)
09-20-2011 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Percy
09-20-2011 1:20 PM


It seemed to me that the dominant thoughts about Human evolution were that it was much more 'linear' and it hasn't been until recently that studies have shed some more light onto the complexity of our lineage. Certainly the biggest objection I had had with the identification of some individual hominin fossils as separate species has been the geologically recent bottleneck effect on our variation, which to my mind created a more narrow interpretation of what constituted H. Sapiens. With the inclusion of these recents finds, others in West Africa and the recent findings concerning hybridization among Neanderthals and Denisovians, it appears that there is a stronger multi-regional facet to the OOA hypothesis.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Percy, posted 09-20-2011 1:20 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by RAZD, posted 09-20-2011 4:48 PM DBlevins has replied

  
DBlevins
Member (Idle past 3805 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 6 of 7 (634361)
09-21-2011 12:33 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by RAZD
09-20-2011 4:48 PM


People like to think of species as linear, however when you look at subspecies and variations between populations, it is self evident (imho) that a bushier arrangement is appropriate, maybe even more of a weave when subspecies interbreed and produce hybrids.
I should have been more clear, but I was speaking of the literature and instruction. H. sapiens evolution was considered to be more 'linear' in the sense that it was thought that we evolved from one species, which evolved from a previous one, and so on. Few were advocating either hybridization or a multi-regional type gene flow. It has been a fairly recent development that hybridization and gene flow has been found to have occured during our evolution, and this recent paper helps 'bush' out our evolution from the stricter linear one.
Because it happened during the time H.sapiens was already established as a species. Don't know how it affected the H.neanders (anyone know?) ...
Again, I should have been clearer. I used to be of the impression that the relatively small amount of morphological variation in humans today, was due to the recent development bottleneck. The greater variation in the DNA of previous populations (before the bottleneck) would have been reflected in their greater morphological variation as compared to us today, and these populations should have been thought of as belonging in our species.
Be careful here. Multi-regional, IIRC, was originally about H.sapiens arising independently in several locations (an aspect I have always had trouble with -- such a scenario should result in different species or subspecies not the same one)
Which is NOT what I was taught in College, even in 1988. My understanding, and the textbook from that time that I still have, states that the Multiregional hypothesis posits that enough gene flow occured to allow the populations to evolve together, and NOT that they evolved independently.
I would expect that many hybrid offspring may have been infertile, thus reducing the impact of such individuals on the overall populations. After all some mules are fertile and can produce offspring with horses and donkeys.
As far as H. sapiens is concerned, certainly that is a possibility, but I should point out an example that fits a bit closer to home, so to speak. From a 2001 article by Clifford Jolly:
Another source of phylogenetic uncertainty is the possibility of gene-flow by occasional hybridization between hominins belonging to ecologically and adaptively distinct species or even genera. Although the evidence is unsatisfactorily sparse, it suggests that among catarrhines generally, regardless of major chromosomal rearrangements, intersterility is roughly proportional to time since cladogenetic separation. On a papionin analogy, especially the crossability of Papio hamadryas with Macaca mulatta and Theropithecus gelada, crossing between extant hominine genera is unlikely to produce viable and fertile offspring, but any hominine species whose ancestries diverged less than 4 ma previously may well have been able to produce hybrid offspring that could, by backcrossing, introduce alien genes with the potential of spreading if advantageous. Selection against maladaptive traits would maintain adaptive complexes against occasional genetic infiltration, and the latter does not justify reducing the hybridizing forms to a conspecific or congeneric rank. Whether reticulation could explain apparent parallels in hominin dentition and brain size is uncertain, pending genetic investigation of these apparently complex traits.
(my bold)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by RAZD, posted 09-20-2011 4:48 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by RAZD, posted 09-21-2011 12:59 PM DBlevins has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024