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Author Topic:   Creationist questions from a creationist
zephyr
Member (Idle past 4580 days)
Posts: 821
From: FOB Taji, Iraq
Joined: 04-22-2003


Message 13 of 56 (48014)
07-30-2003 10:07 AM
Reply to: Message 12 by DoesGodExist
07-30-2003 9:56 AM


quote:
I read the blood clotting thing, from "Darwin's Black Box". This is such a complex system.I'm not a scientist so I can't enter in deep explanation, I'm sure you know more than I do.
Last time this came up, someone mentioned that there are organisms with part of the blood clotting system we have. It's not IC.
quote:
The bridge is made by people not by itself. When we study nature we don't expect it to "create" intricate things even in long periods.
However, nature can create structures similar to the bridge via deposition, lithification, and erosion. Haven't you ever seen a natural bridge?
Short on time, I may answer some more of these later today.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by DoesGodExist, posted 07-30-2003 9:56 AM DoesGodExist has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by DoesGodExist, posted 07-30-2003 3:25 PM zephyr has replied

  
zephyr
Member (Idle past 4580 days)
Posts: 821
From: FOB Taji, Iraq
Joined: 04-22-2003


Message 26 of 56 (48059)
07-30-2003 3:24 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by DoesGodExist
07-30-2003 12:25 PM


quote:
That doesn't really help much, because Nature don't know the physical and mechanical laws as well as optical...well i guess.
Nature IS the physical and mechanical and optical... nature is everything we know, including ourselves. Nature is the light, heat, vibrations, colors, and shapes of the world that can kill us or keep us alive. Any sensory capability that allows an organism to track these things (and thereby find food and avoid threats) gives it an advantage. Are you truly claiming that a predator with eyes will eat and mate no better than a blind one?
[This message has been edited by zephyr, 07-30-2003]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by DoesGodExist, posted 07-30-2003 12:25 PM DoesGodExist has replied

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zephyr
Member (Idle past 4580 days)
Posts: 821
From: FOB Taji, Iraq
Joined: 04-22-2003


Message 32 of 56 (48068)
07-30-2003 3:37 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by DoesGodExist
07-30-2003 3:25 PM


I found it. Dr. Tazimus Maximus posted the info here:
http://EvC Forum: Where is the evidence for evolution? -->EvC Forum: Where is the evidence for evolution?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by DoesGodExist, posted 07-30-2003 3:25 PM DoesGodExist has replied

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zephyr
Member (Idle past 4580 days)
Posts: 821
From: FOB Taji, Iraq
Joined: 04-22-2003


Message 38 of 56 (48074)
07-30-2003 4:07 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by mark24
07-30-2003 3:55 PM


quote:
This is precicely where Behe is being disingenuous. No one was making the bacteria mutate, no one was forcing changes at particular places, & no one was forcing bacteria to die at the expense of others. This IS random mutation & natural selection in action. It most certainly could have happened in the wild.
Exactly. It's purposely muddy thinking - implying that being near intelligence makes bacteria mutate differently, or makes the competition somehow artificial. Design advocates seem to make logical stretches like that quite often. Just keep in mind that imperfect replication is a known, undeniable attribute of DNA, and that bringing bacteria from the wild does not make it somehow more likely that they will mutate. The orderly lab environment in this experiment was intended to eliminate uncertainty from the results, not to cause mutations or select for desirable ones.

This message is a reply to:
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