Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9164 total)
5 online now:
Newest Member: ChatGPT
Post Volume: Total: 916,906 Year: 4,163/9,624 Month: 1,034/974 Week: 361/286 Day: 4/13 Hour: 1/0


EvC Forum ⇒ Science Forums ⇒ Is It Science? ⇒

Philosophy and science

Thread ▼ Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Philosophy and science
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

Normal Thread Display
Message 16 of 100 (575706)
08-20-2010 9:03 PM 		Reply to: Message 15 by Bikerman
08-20-2010 8:58 PM

Re: To be a Table, or not...
One way to see the table is as disturbances in an underlying quantum field. The field curls and kinks and we see this disturbances as particles at the atomic scale and as solid matter at the macro scale.
​
Does it support my glass?
​
From the quantum field perspective there is no mass, no matter, no table. The various fermions we perceive as particles are peturbations in the quantum field rather than 'solid things' and the way they interact is by exchange of bosons which are themselves fields with excitations or peturbations which correspond to the 'particle' nature of the photon (or hypothetical graviton).
​
Can I put my feet up on it?
​
Sooo....at a very basic level there is no table. The table is percieved as such because the quantum field excitations which we think of as 'ourself' interacts with the quantum field excitations which we think of as 'the table' in a predictable manner to produce certain outcomes which we label a table.
​
Not true. I can put my feet up on it and still reach my glass. Therefore it exists.
​
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Bikerman, posted 08-20-2010 8:58 PM Bikerman has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by Bikerman, posted 08-20-2010 9:20 PM jar has replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

Normal Thread Display
Message 18 of 100 (575713)
08-20-2010 9:23 PM 		Reply to: Message 17 by Bikerman
08-20-2010 9:20 PM

Re: To be a Table, or not...
BUT that additional understanding does not negate the fact that my feet and my glass agree that it is a table.
​
Don't confuse philosophy with reality or understanding.
​
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by Bikerman, posted 08-20-2010 9:20 PM Bikerman has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Bikerman, posted 08-20-2010 9:32 PM jar has replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

Normal Thread Display
Message 23 of 100 (575721)
08-20-2010 9:43 PM 		Reply to: Message 21 by Bikerman
08-20-2010 9:32 PM

Re: To be a Table, or not...
I hope not, it was not meant that way. BUT... even the additional things we learn will eventually be judged at the feet and glass level. It is at that level that we as humans live.
​
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Bikerman, posted 08-20-2010 9:32 PM Bikerman has not replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

Normal Thread Display
Message 41 of 100 (575987)
08-22-2010 9:28 AM

I'm sorry but "Professional Philosopher" really does sound like an oxymoron. Who the hell would hire a philosopher?
​
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by Bikerman, posted 08-22-2010 9:44 AM jar has replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

Normal Thread Display
Message 43 of 100 (575990)
08-22-2010 9:47 AM 		Reply to: Message 42 by Bikerman
08-22-2010 9:44 AM

And for a good reason.
​
Want fries with that?
​
Edited by jar, : appalin spallin
​
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by Bikerman, posted 08-22-2010 9:44 AM Bikerman has not replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

Normal Thread Display
Message 72 of 100 (577181)
08-27-2010 12:14 PM 		Reply to: Message 71 by Stile
08-27-2010 12:09 PM

Re: I concede
There is though one infallible test, if your mom says "get you feet off the table" you can be absolutely sure that your feet are in the wrong place. The defense of "But mom, it has drawers!" or even "But mom, they are on the sofa!" simply fails.
​
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 71 by Stile, posted 08-27-2010 12:09 PM Stile has seen this message but not replied
  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004

Normal Thread Display
Message 76 of 100 (577511)
08-29-2010 11:02 AM 		Reply to: Message 74 by Modulous
08-29-2010 7:22 AM

Re: Real philosophy with real world science
Mod writes:
​
Ethics
​
Scientists don't always require ethics (studying, for example, what height birds drop nuts doesn't generally have ethical considerations). But medical ethics, psychology and numerous other areas all require philosophical discussions on ethics.
​
I gotta add to this.
​
IMHO the scientific method is based on a culture of ethics and ethics is important to every stage in science.
​
You cannot exclude data simply because it does not fit your hypothesis.
​
You cannot withhold data.
​
You cannot fudge data or results.
​
You must disclose your process, data and methodology.
​
Those who do not follow those rules of ethics get sanctioned.
​
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
This message is a reply to:
 Message 74 by Modulous, posted 08-29-2010 7:22 AM Modulous has seen this message but not replied
  
Date format: mm-dd-yyyy
Timezone: ET (US)
  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024