|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
Thread ▼ Details |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: Professional Debate: Scientific Evidence for/against Evolution… “Any Takers?” | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
I am not volunteering, and I don't meet the requirements.
I do have some comments. Neo-Darwinism is a scientific theory. Typically, a scientific theory consists of research guidelines, methods, terminology. Theories are tentative, and are not themselves observed facts. Rather, they are methodologies one follows in order to observe facts. People sometimes talk of the fact of evolution. I don't recall seeing talk of the fact of neo-Darwinism. I am inclined to think that your proposed debate is a non-starter, because it is based on a misunderstanding of the nature of a theory such as neo-Darwinism.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
Eye-Squared-R writes:
It is interesting that you pick that example.While theories are never proven with a 100% confidence level, some have been demonstrated to consistently be true and scientifically validated at such a high confidence level — they’re essentially codified into law. An example is Ohm’s Law (V=IR) continuously applied without a known failure in trillions of applications. When German physicist Georg Ohm submitted his treatise in 1827 describing the relationship observed in his measurements, he probably didn’t realize his work would transition from a hypothesis to a theory to a law. Ohm’s Law is used by thousands in applied science every day and is considered fact for all practical purposes. If Georg Ohm’s discovery of the cause/effect relationship between voltage, current, and resistance were not consistent and reliable, then we would see power plants and distribution transformers blowing up all over the world due to a failure of the relationship Ohm discovered. We don’t. In that sense, Ohm’s treatise is relied on as fact by thousands of engineers - every day, all day. However, due the necessarily tentative nature of real science, there may yet be some situation where Ohm’s law fails to accurately predict results — we just haven’t found one. Regardless, if a physicist PhD or engineer met somebody who claims not to believe in Ohms Law, then an assessment similar to Dawkin’s claim above (assuming ignorance) could be accurately and confidently used to describe the Ohm’s Law unbeliever. I am guessing that you work in electricity or in electronics or a related area, and that your forum name "Eye-Squared-R" is derived from I2R, which is a formula for power. The interesting thing about your example, is that it is wrong. In fact, Ohm's law is the definition of resistance, so its truth is known a priori. For reference, check the Wikipedia page. What Ohm observed, was the approximate proportionality of voltage and current. The Wikipedia page on Ohm's law describes this. Taken as saying that current is proportional to voltage, Ohm's law is false and well known to be false. Take as the definition of resistance, Ohm's law is true by definition and is very useful. Call an electrical circuit linear if the current is exactly proportional to the voltage for that circuit. Otherwise, call the circuit non-linear. As best I can tell, all circuits are non-linear. Most are approximately linear, but not exactly linear. We have a large technology (digital electronics) whose existence depends on non-linear circuits. Nevertheless, Ohm's law (taken as a definition) is heavily used within digital electronics. That it is used is a matter of the pragmatism of science. Ohm's law turns out to be very useful. Giving allowance for the fact that circuits are usually not exactly linear, resistance is typically understood as
This allows us to talk of the forward resistance of a diode, and the back resistance of a diode where the diode itself is a highly non-linear circuit element. My point is that scientific theories and laws are not observed facts about the world. The role of theories and laws is far more complex than that.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
Yes it can. And what you wrote can be viewed as bullshit.
The difference, of course, is that the first of those "can be viewed" statements is obviously false, while you are providing plenty of evidence that the second is true.
Eye-Squared-R writes:
No offense Eye-Squared-R, but I know far more about the physics of electricity than you are even capable of knowing. No, I did not attempt to discredit you with a quick Wiki reference. I just pointed out your obvious mistake, then added a Wiki reference to aid the casual reader of this thread (if there are any casual readers remaining).No offense nwr, but I recommend you use considerable caution when endeavoring to discredit someone with a quick Wiki reference on a topic that you may not fully understand. If you had half a clue on what you are talking about, you would not have said anything so foolish as: I2R can also be viewed as Heat. Incidentally, I was underwhelmed by your attempted snow job on reactance.
Eye-Squared-R writes:
Whoever wrote that wiki information evidently knows far more about the physics of electricity than you are capable of knowing. If you had understood the significance of what you just wrote about reactance, you would not have made such a silly mistake.
Sometimes Wiki references are not worded very well and sometimes they are unequivocally incorrect (Surprise!). For example, you’ll find this statement in Wiki’s reference for Scientific Law: Ohm's law only applies to constant currents. Not sure who wrote that but it’s not the first and certainly not the only reference error at Wikipedia. Ohm’s law applies to both constant and variable current where ever the medium includes any resistance.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
Eye-Squared-R writes:
I am amazed that you persist in your public display of ignorance. It is not as if you were not given enough hints.You and nwr may also wish to carefully investigate whether Power can actually be viewed as Heat and ... Heat is one (of several) forms of energy. Power is a rate (energy per unit time). Saying that those are the same is one of the most obvious and foolish of errors that somebody could make in physics.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
Eye-Squared-R writes:
I have held soldering irons, though usually not by the wrong end.Unless you happen to be holding a soldering iron by the wrong end in your hand while you plug it into a power socket. In that case, the blister on your hand will tell you in a hurry that Power can be viewed as Heat. Please review the message to cavediver in Message 48 above and note any errors for us. No scientifically literate person would equate power and heat. In normal discussions, if somebody had equated power and heat I would let it pass as a typical non-scientists confusion. However, in Message 23 you went out of your way to criticize my scientific knowledge, all the while spewing scientific nonsense throughout that post. You set yourself up for criticism. I see that cavediver has already pointed out your mistakes (again), so I won't further press it in this post. I will say more in a response to another of your recent posts.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
I am responding to this, because you are criticizing me by proxy, while ostensibly replying to lyx2no.
Eye-Squared-R writes:
Apparently your problems are not limited to scientific literacy. You seem to have difficulty reading. That "Taken as saying ..." clause is a conditional, which you seem to be ignoring. The normal ("proper") application of Ohm's law does not follow that conditional assumption.
Apparently, nwr did not understand the proper application of Ohm’s Law which is the fundamental building block for electrical theory in physics. Eye-Squared-R writes:
In Message 23 you wrote " Ohm’s law applies to both constant and variable current where ever the medium includes any resistance " and that is quite wrong. The relation between current and voltage is actually expressed by a more complex equation involving an integral (for the effect of capacitance) and a derivative (for the effect of inductance) in addition to the linear term due to resistance. Reactance is defined precisely to take care of the deviation from Ohm's law when alternating current is being used.
It’s unclear how nwr defines a snow job concerning reactance or a a silly mistake.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
Eye-Squared-R writes:
By putting it in color, you only emphasize your mistake. Power is not measured in calories.
Perhaps you missed Equation 4 in Message 48: Equation 4: Heat calories = Power calories Eye-Squared-R writes:
If you drove an electric car uphill, part of the energy from that "I2R" would finish up as the potential energy of the car being at a higher altitude.
Please provide an example where (I2R in kilo-Watts) is not exclusively manifest as heat in real time. Eye-Squared-R writes:
Your inability to read is not an endearing quality.
Your second entry in this thread (Message 16) mused how interesting it was that Ohm’s law was conditionally false and well known to be false. Eye-Squared-R writes:
Yet, in the very message that I am replying to, you said:You and cavediver apparently are on the same straw-man trip. Of course, I never equated or said power was equal to heat in units. quote:That certainly has the appearance of saying that power is equal to heat in units. And you even did that in bold colors.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
nwr Member Posts: 6412 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 4.5 |
Eye-Squared-R writes:
Since you seem to have a serious difficulty with reading, I shall try to explain it for you.
Yes. Lyx2no inquired about the equations and the reference to you was appropriate because the equations addressed your earlier error. Message 41, the post of lyx2no that you refer to, is irony. It is full of sarcasm. lyx2no was laughing at you. In fact he was ridiculing you.
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024