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Author Topic:   Weekend at Bernie's
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9517
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 8 of 36 (773676)
12-07-2015 3:11 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by RAZD
12-06-2015 5:04 PM


RAZD writes:
You want to "make America Great Again?" -- then return to strong unions to protect workers and just tax systems where those who benefit most from the economy pay the most to support the government that makes that economy possible.
If you have punative rates of taxation a couple of things happen. In the short term the state gets some income. Then those that are being hurt take avoiding action, leaving the country, putting their money in tax havens and so on. If there's a different rate of personal taxation than corporate taxation, they reclassify their earnings - a process that is easy for those with money and hard for an average worker.
The second part of your wish list, strong unions tend towards non-competitive restrictive practices and protectionism. Costs would rise which will lead to the erection of trade barriers as the US would have a price disadvantage. Exports would fall.
The combination of an outflow of revenue and high-worth individuals plus a protectionist, inflexible and high cost labour force with falling exports would put the economy into another depression.
Extreme tax positions don't work in the long term - they have to feel fair for everyone. 90+% is unfair.
Rather than attempting to return to the bad days of powerful unions, stronger employment law would be an alternative - plus decent health and benefit systems.
Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by RAZD, posted 12-06-2015 5:04 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by RAZD, posted 12-07-2015 6:00 PM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9517
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 18 of 36 (773710)
12-08-2015 2:30 AM
Reply to: Message 13 by RAZD
12-07-2015 6:00 PM


When tax rates were more progressive from bottom to top and those who benefited most from the economy paid the most, the economy boomed.
There is a short term effect, as I said. Long term it's detrimental - that's why no country on earth has extremly low corporate taxation and extremely high personal taxation, it distorts markets. Taxation has to be fair to work.
I'm a big fan of the Scandanavian model of high taxation and high benefits. I'm not arguing for low taxation, I'm arguing for high but fair and transparent taxation.
conservative crap propaganda. Strong unions tend to cause just distributions of profits to those doing the work that results in the profit.
Alternatively, economic truth that you don't like to hear. Unions are a reaction to unfair labour markets, they ossify into protectionism if they get enough power and make the 'them and us' system even worse.
My problem with unions is that they should be obsoleted by incorporating the benefits of unions into the general economy to the benefit of all workers -- an economy with a social consciousness, which means a minimum living wage and full health benefits
Which was exactly what I said.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by RAZD, posted 12-07-2015 6:00 PM RAZD has seen this message but not replied

  
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