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Author Topic:   Roy Moore, Alabama Chief Idiot back in the news yet again.
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 136 of 313 (750190)
02-11-2015 8:27 PM
Reply to: Message 121 by subbie
02-11-2015 4:53 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
Well, how do we tell what's biblical and what's not biblical, if not being in the bible doesn't count as unbiblical?
As I said, YOU can't tell, you have to trust someone who knows, such as me. And I gave you the answer in Message 96. There it is, that's it. But of course you WON'T accept it as I also said, in Message 123, because you prefer your own ignorance.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 121 by subbie, posted 02-11-2015 4:53 PM subbie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by Theodoric, posted 02-11-2015 9:48 PM Faith has replied
 Message 147 by subbie, posted 02-11-2015 10:21 PM Faith has replied
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 137 of 313 (750191)
02-11-2015 8:31 PM
Reply to: Message 133 by subbie
02-11-2015 5:28 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
No, I never said "cake baking is bad." Do try to follow the argument. I know it's really really hard, but do try.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 133 by subbie, posted 02-11-2015 5:28 PM subbie has seen this message but not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 138 of 313 (750192)
02-11-2015 8:34 PM
Reply to: Message 132 by PaulK
02-11-2015 5:24 PM


The fact that you regard homosexuality as sinful is not a reason for the government to deny homosexuals legal protection.
Since I'm talking about what the Bible says it IS a reason for the government to deny, not "legal protection" which they already have, but the special status they demand as equal to heterosexuals in deserving marriage. And up until quite recently the government would have agreed.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 132 by PaulK, posted 02-11-2015 5:24 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 139 of 313 (750193)
02-11-2015 8:36 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by subbie
02-11-2015 5:37 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
Yeah, but never the Supreme Court.
It would have up until the last few decades, certainly up until the last century.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by subbie, posted 02-11-2015 5:37 PM subbie has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 141 by AZPaul3, posted 02-11-2015 8:51 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 140 of 313 (750194)
02-11-2015 8:42 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by AZPaul3
02-11-2015 6:32 PM


I don't fail to comprehend, I disagree with you. VEHEMENTLY. I DESPISE what you are saying. We're talking freedom of RELIGION here, not freedom of speech, which you keep trying to reduce it to. And again, none of this is "discriminating" against PERSONS, which is what those laws supposedly protect, PERSONS are not kept from service in these Christian stores. You seem to fail to comprehend what it IS about. No, you don't, really, like all the other haters here you prefer to see it in the perverted way you see it and deny Christians the right to act on our religious beliefs, which the First Amendment covers presumably without conditions. YOU are not "the People" either.
Actually, "We the People" have voted against gay marriage in state after state after state, but the SCOTUS don't LIKE "Us the People" so they make up their own rules.
Wedding cakes are not "for sale." They have to be MADE TO ORDER. AND IF THEY WERE FOR SALE RIGHT OUT OF THE DISPLAY CASE THERE WOULD NEVER BE AN ISSUE ABOUT ANY OF THIS. NOBODY ASKS WHAT SUCH A PRODUCT IS FOR, IT ALWAYS COMES UP WHEN THE CAKE IS BEING SPECIAL-ORDERED. If the reason is not known NOBODY CARES.
A Christian photographer asked to photograph a gay wedding can't avoid the facts, nor can a florist asked to supply flowers for a gay wedding. A baker can't either because of the way wedding cakes are ordered, they do know who they are for.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by AZPaul3, posted 02-11-2015 6:32 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 158 by AZPaul3, posted 02-12-2015 3:51 PM Faith has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8564
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.7


(1)
Message 141 of 313 (750195)
02-11-2015 8:51 PM
Reply to: Message 139 by Faith
02-11-2015 8:36 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
And up until quite recently the government would have agreed.
It would have up until the last few decades, certainly up until the last century.
Yes, governments evolve. The courts evolve. Society evolves. We and our institutions evolve greater recognition of the reality of the human experience. We evolve out of our intolerant and backward ways of thinking. We evolve the realization that "them" are human, too. We evolve the view that all people are equal and that all people deserve as much right as any and every other in all things.
We haven't completed the process, there is still much to do, but We the People are making progress. You and yours are falling further and further behind. You really need to catch up, Faith.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 139 by Faith, posted 02-11-2015 8:36 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by Faith, posted 02-11-2015 8:54 PM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 162 by Faith, posted 03-02-2015 7:37 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 142 of 313 (750196)
02-11-2015 8:54 PM
Reply to: Message 141 by AZPaul3
02-11-2015 8:51 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
What a bunch of revisionist hogwash you've all swallowed.
I keep hearing how similar things are here and now to Nazi Germany in the 30s. Corner your opposition, marginalize them, do a big propaganda campaign to be sure they are hated as enemies of progress and prosperity, in this case known as "bigots" and backwards, perhaps low IQ and deserving of extermination. Well, we're the ones keeping you from "evolving" the Perfect Society, right? Homosexuality was a cause celebre then too. Oh and take away their guns, first get them to register them so you'll know where they are and then swoop in and take them away before you herd them off to the camps. Oh and we're about due for a Krystallnacht too. Thugs and vandals destroyed the property of the Oregon bakers. It's coming and you'll be doing the new version of the Heil Hitler salute before long. Hitler loved evolution too.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by AZPaul3, posted 02-11-2015 8:51 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 143 by jar, posted 02-11-2015 9:25 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 153 by Tempe 12ft Chicken, posted 02-12-2015 10:15 AM Faith has not replied
 Message 159 by AZPaul3, posted 02-12-2015 4:25 PM Faith has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 143 of 313 (750197)
02-11-2015 9:25 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by Faith
02-11-2015 8:54 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
Faith writes:
I keep hearing how similar things are here and now to Nazi Germany in the 30s. Corner your opposition, marginalize them, do a big propaganda campaign to be sure they are hated as enemies of progress and prosperity, in this case known as "bigots" and backwards, perhaps low IQ and deserving of extermination. Well, we're the ones keeping you from "evolving" the Perfect Society, right? Homosexuality was a cause celebre then too. Oh and take away their guns, first get them to register them so you'll know where they are and then swoop in and take them away before you herd them off to the camps. Oh and we're about due for a Krystallnacht too. Thugs and vandals destroyed the property of the Oregon bakers. It's coming and you'll be doing the new version of the Heil Hitler salute before long. Hitler loved evolution too.
Oh good grief, what utter rubbish.
How can you even imagine Biblical Christians rise to the height of being worthy of hate and not just pity?
Can you show any evidence of any attempt to exterminate anyone?
Can you point to anyone other than the Christian Cult of Ignorance that has claimed to want to build a perfect society?
Do you have any evidence to support any of your allegations this time?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by Faith, posted 02-11-2015 8:54 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 144 of 313 (750199)
02-11-2015 9:45 PM


There are lots of different lists of the ways we are like the early stages of Nazi Germany. Some are Christian, some aren't. Some are about the loss of freedom in a growing police state. Others are about the cultural shifts. Some of them list things that are definitely happening but there's no way to tell where they will end up. Here's one from Worldview Weekend in 2009:
1. In 1935, under Hitler's rule, prayers ceased to be obligatory in schools. In 1962, The U.S. Supreme Court outlawed school prayer.
2.Hitler eliminated Christian holidays in the schools first by calling Christmas "Yuletide." Most American public schools now call Christmas vacation a "winter break."
3.Hitler took Easter out of schools and instead honored that time of year as the beginning of spring. It has likewise become common for schools in America to refer to time off at Easter as "spring break."
4.Hitler controlled the church using intimidation and threats. A half-century ago, U.S. Senator and Senate Majority Leader Lyndon Baines Johnson, promoted a bill that included an amendment to use the Internal Revenue Service to remove the non-profit status of a church that speaks against the election of any specific political candidate.
5.Hitler enticed thousands of pastors to promote paganism in their congregations. Neopaganism is one of the fastest growing religions in America, doubling every 18 months according to a June 2008 article in The Denver Post. Many American church-goers practice paganism such as "Christian" yoga, contemplative prayer, and walking a labyrinth. As evidence that church doors continue to open further to aberrant beliefs, a 2008 survey found that 57% of evangelicals do not believe Jesus Christ is the only way to God.
6.Hitler was an environmentalist and vegetarian. Marriages performed by the Nazi state frequently included blessings of "Mother Earth" and "Father Sky." Today Americans increasingly accept radical environmentalism, pantheism, and the celebration of Earth Day.
7.Hitler was fascinated by eastern mysticism. Today an increasing number of American pastors encourage their followers to become "mystic warriors".
8.Hitler believed in reincarnation. He even convinced SS officers that by murdering millions of Jews and other "undesirables" they were allowing them to get on with the reincarnation process and come back more quickly in an advanced status. Americans increasingly accept the idea of reincarnation as well as good and bad karma.
9.Hitler's holocaust killed between 8 and 11 million Jews and non-Jews. Americans have killed an estimated 50 million babies since abortion was legalized through the U.S. Supreme Court in 1973. According to a July 7, 2008 article on worldnetdaily.com "An abortionist who claims to have destroyed more than 20,000 unborn children and who once was Hillary Clinton's OB-GYN says he is doing 'God's work' when he terminates a pregnancyHe admits that abortion kills a human soul."
10.Hitler killed 270,000 handicapped people through active euthanasia.[1] America and the courts are rushing toward the same with the murder of individuals such as Terri Schiavo. Oregon voters passed their Death with Dignity Act in 1994 and re-affirmed it in 1997. Washington state voters legalized doctor-assisted suicide on November 4, 2008. In December 2008, a Montana judge ruled terminally ill residents of that state have the right to physician-assisted suicide, and "death with dignity" is gaining acceptance in other states as well.
11. By 1938, all private schools were abolished by Hitler and all education placed under Nazi control. There is constant pressure from federal and many state education authorities to require that Christian schools use state-mandated, humanistic textbooks. The Home School Legal Defense Association is fighting numerous battles at any given time to prevent parents from loosing the right to educate their children as they see fit. In August 2008, a federal district court ruled that the state of California university system may choose not to recognize the diplomas-and thereby deny college entrance to-students who attended a school using textbooks that express a Biblical worldview in the areas of history and science (i.e., Christian schools).
12.Hitler prevented dissenters from using radio to challenge his worldview. Many powerful liberals in America have made clear their intent to reintroduce the "Fairness Doctrine" that would require conservative and religious radio stations to offer equal time to anti-Christian, anti-conservative worldviews.
13.Pastors who spoke against Hitler's worldview and his murderous regime found themselves on trial and frequently imprisoned for "Abuse of Pulpit." In America, hate-crime legislation has the potential to criminalize Christians and pastors who speak out against the homosexual agenda.
14.Many Christians in Germany justified their allegiance to Hitler through a belief that "Their duty to God was spiritual; their duty to the state was political."[2] Many American Christians now have bought the lie that their worldview can be divided between the secular and the sacred-the politician has one area of responsibility, the pastor another, and never shall the two meet. Yet the Bible teaches that all issues are fundamentally spiritual.
15.Hitler outlawed the cross and replaced it with the swastika. Today many churches, Christian colleges, and universities have willingly removed the cross from their buildings. Numerous court cases sponsored by the ACLU have required the removal of the cross from public grounds. The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in 2005 that the Ten Commandments cannot be posted on public grounds for religious purposes.
16.Hitler was fascinated with Friedrich Nietzsche and distributed his writings to his inner circle. Nietzsche promoted Nihilism, the belief that life has no meaning, and he is best known for his position that "God is dead". Nietzsche is presently one of the most widely read authors by American college students.
17.Hitler exploited the economic collapse of Germany to take over as dictator and usher in his brand of socialism. America's financial crisis has given liberals in both political parties the opportunity to grow the size of government and implement freedom-robbing socialism at lightning speed.
18.Hitler was obsessed with globalism, and many of America's most powerful political leaders are willing to subjugate American sovereignty to contemporary globalism.
19.Many Germans responded to Hitler by retreating into neutrality. Today most Americans prefer to remain neutral on moral issues that they think don't affect them personally.
20.On trial after World War II, Hitler's henchmen used the defense that they had not broken any laws. True, they had not defied the laws of Germany since those had been re-written to fit the goals and objectives of Hitler. The Nazi leaders were nevertheless found guilty because the courts at the time recognized a "law above the law." Yet now the U.S. Supreme Court has rejected the law of nature and nature's God by claiming that as society evolves, morals evolve, and so the law, too, must evolve.
21.Calling upon Darwinian evolution, Hitler convinced the German people that purging millions of people was acceptable because of the need to create a pure race; also referred to as eugenics. American students across the board have been educated in Darwinian evolution because the Supreme Court has ruled that creation cannot be taught in our schools-even if both creation and evolution are taught side by side.
22.Margaret Sanger, the founder of Planned Parenthood in America became acquainted with the doctors and scientists that had worked with Nazi Germany's eugenics program and had no quarrel with the euthanasia, sterilization, abortion, and infanticide programs of the early Reich.[3] Sanger even published several articles in Birth Control Review that reflected Hilter's White Supremacist worldview. Planned Parenthood now grosses one billion per year.
23.In Germany, pastors often cited Romans 13:1-2 to encourage Christians to obey the Nazis. Today in America, many pastors have a false view of Romans 13:1-2 and have convinced millions that to disobey governing authorities is to disobey God. This poor training would facilitate Christians here doing just as the German Christians did if faced with similar challenges.
24.Germans accepted socialism to avoid pain. Today's Americans are rejecting capitalism in exchange for government-sponsored "free" healthcare, education, and countless other government handouts.
25. Many Americans accept what I call, One World Spirituality. This is actually an amalgamation of the three worldviews of evolutionary humanism, Hindu pantheism, and occultism. I noted earlier that Hitler embraced all of these.
26. America is rushing toward government-sponsored, national healthcare. We already have a form of this in Medicare and Medicaid. Hitler, too, expanded and centralized Germany's healthcare system. As Melchior Palyi explained, "The ill-famed Dr. Ley, boss of the Nazi labor front, did not fail to see that the social insurance system could be used for Nazi politics as a means of popular demagoguery, as a bastion of bureaucratic power, [and] as an instrument of regimentation."
- See more at: http://www.worldviewweekend.com/worldview-times/article.php

Replies to this message:
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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9201
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


(1)
Message 145 of 313 (750201)
02-11-2015 9:48 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Faith
02-11-2015 8:27 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
As I said, YOU can't tell, you have to trust someone who knows, such as me.
Wow!!
Unfreaking believable. Hubris much?

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Faith, posted 02-11-2015 8:27 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by Faith, posted 02-11-2015 9:49 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 146 of 313 (750202)
02-11-2015 9:49 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by Theodoric
02-11-2015 9:48 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
I could list dozens of others but I'm the one who happens to be here. And I gave my answer in Message 96. That's the one you'll get from any Christian who understands why we can't do anything to serve a gay wedding.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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subbie
Member (Idle past 1284 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


(1)
Message 147 of 313 (750204)
02-11-2015 10:21 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Faith
02-11-2015 8:27 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
This is what you said in Message 96:
Faith writes:
You don't need chapter and verse, subbie, you know very well that homosexual acts are condemned in the Bible, and that marriage is prescribed even by Jesus Himself as between a man and a woman. That's the basis for refusing to serve a "gay wedding," as obviously to serve it would be to deny what God has said about both homosexuality and marriage.
I'm asking for a general rule to determine what's biblical and what isn't. There is no generally applicable rule in Message 96. As far as I can tell, it's whatever Faith pulls out of her tight white ass. If there is a general rule for determining what's biblical and what isn't please let me know, and stop shouting MESSAGE 96 because it ain't in there. If there isn't a general rule, and all it comes down to is whatever Faith pulls out of her tight white ass, that's fine, too. I'm just trying to figure out how you determine these things.
Also, baking a cake for someone's wedding afterparty doesn't deny anything that Jesus or anyone else says. At most, it affirms that not everyone believes the same thing you do, and you're mature enough to accept that fact. But I can understand your failure to grasp that, given your maturity level.

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate
Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Faith, posted 02-11-2015 8:27 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by Faith, posted 02-12-2015 1:13 AM subbie has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17828
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.3


(2)
Message 148 of 313 (750206)
02-12-2015 12:55 AM
Reply to: Message 138 by Faith
02-11-2015 8:34 PM


quote:
Since I'm talking about what the Bible says it IS a reason for the government to deny, not "legal protection" which they already have, but the special status they demand as equal to heterosexuals in deserving marriage
There you go confusing the issues again.
The legal protection is the inclusion of homosexuals in the anti-discrimination laws. And you ARE complaining very bitterly about that - for no valid reason as you've proven again and again.
But since you bring up the subject, equality is NOT a "special status" as any sensible person would agree.
The Bible is NOT a valid reason in U.S. law, because that WOULD be establishment of religion, forbidden by the Constitution.
quote:
And up until quite recently the government would have agreed.
Then it's good that the U.S. is finally respecting the ideals of the Constitution. Patriotic Americans should be celebrating.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by Faith, posted 02-11-2015 8:34 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 149 of 313 (750207)
02-12-2015 1:13 AM
Reply to: Message 147 by subbie
02-11-2015 10:21 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
Message 96 is the answer, you aren't going to get a "general" answer whatever that is, the one I gave is the answer.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by subbie, posted 02-11-2015 10:21 PM subbie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 154 by subbie, posted 02-12-2015 10:29 AM Faith has not replied
 Message 155 by Percy, posted 02-12-2015 11:26 AM Faith has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22504
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.9


(4)
Message 150 of 313 (750212)
02-12-2015 8:09 AM
Reply to: Message 103 by Faith
02-11-2015 4:26 PM


Re: The jokes just keep coming
Faith writes:
True religion, Christianity, did indeed originally define American law,...
Many factors, Christianity included, influenced American law.
...and to now make homosexuality a special protected class is a violation of that original law and a slap in God's face.
First, homosexuals are only being granted the same rights as everyone else. They are not being given any special protections.
Second, the First Amendment proscribes the incorporation of religious beliefs into law. Your belief that it is a slap in God's face to give homosexuals the same rights as everyone cannot influence law in this country because of this amendment.
The owners and employees of secular businesses cannot discriminate on the basis of their personal religious beliefs. This protects everyone from religiously based discrimination, including you.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 103 by Faith, posted 02-11-2015 4:26 PM Faith has not replied

  
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