Did the Biblical Exodus ever happen?

You're not making a lot of sense, Ringo. I'm sure he was aware of the pioneer work that had been done by Wyatt, Fassold and others. He did fully expect to find evidence there. Did your eyes and mind hone in on that phenomenal, in tact, axle and wheel table like form in the video? If so, tell the folks why or why not it appeared to be in the shape of an axle and wheels.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Did you view the short clip which I linked? It shows photography of the various wheel shaped coral forms, the most notable table shaped one in particular. I do not have the other information.As I understand the scientific method, some would involve lab work and other not, depending on what one is doing.As Lennart Mollar explained, likely what is left after thousands of years is the coral forms. To break into those might destroy them. I'm not sure what could be lab analyzed and what the legality would be to remove them.I believe Ron Wyatt claims to have removed a wheel. He says he lost it, but I surmise that that was to keep off the legal hot seat, if indeed he did remove it.The researched corroborating visible evidence, I see as part of the
scientific method.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

You're scraping the bottom, Ringo. Anyone can see the recreated enhancement is deliberate so as to help visualize what formed the coral formations.These sort of silly responses hardly warrant an answer. Don't expect a response from some of them.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Ballard's Black Sea research has yet to get permission to date his scientific researched discovery of civilization in the Black Sea.

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If Ballard’s team gets permission from the Turkish government, they may take a sample of the wood for dating. This would not only confirm the date of the structure, but help to establish a more precise date for when the flooding of the Black Sea took place.

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Mollart, like Ballard, are limited as to how much data can be fully researched to the extent that they would desire, relative to the guarded Mountain and to the sea research.Yet renowned geologists Ryan & Putnam have elevated their take on the incomplete research to the status of theory. They waive off any possible relation of the discovery as supportive to the Biblical flood.

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Columbia University geologists William Ryan and Walter Pitman wondered what could explain the preponderance of flood legends. Their theory: As the Ice Age ended and glaciers melted, a wall of seawater surged from the Mediterranean into the Black Sea.
During the Ice Age, Ryan and Pitman argue, the Black Sea was an isolated freshwater lake surrounded by farmland.

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About 12,000 years ago, toward the end of the Ice Age, Earth began growing warmer. Vast sheets of ice that sprawled over the Northern Hemisphere began to melt. Oceans and seas grew deeper as a result.

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About 7,000 years ago the Mediterranean Sea swelled. Seawater pushed northward, slicing through what is now Turkey.

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Funneled through the narrow Bosporus, the water hit the Black Sea with 200 times the force of Niagara Falls. Each day the Black Sea rose about six inches (15 centimeters), and coastal farms were flooded.

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Seared into the memories of terrified survivors, the tale of the flood was passed down through the generations and eventually became the Noah story.

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Robert Ballard, the National Geographic, along with geologists Ryan & Putnam have expressed no interest in falsifying the phenomenal evidence widely alleged pertaining to Lennart Moller's Exodus research. Unlike Putnam, Lennart Moller makes no claims of theory or of his research being empirical. His attitude is to provide the evidence and let the viewers and readers of his research be the jury as to whether his work is credible.I can see where this thread is going. It's going as I had expected, no matter how much evidence I cite.In the past eight years, I am not aware of Admin openly siding with the skeptics as admin, extending authoritative active debate on behalf of the pack of skeptics, dogging the lone spokesman advocating the other side of the debate.I understand that the secularists have a huge stake in this debate. So do I. it is clear how the pack's consensus will see to it in the future as to who prevails as the conceived winner of this debate. I'm not claiming winner ship, nor am I admitting defeat. I have produce supportive evidence, for what it's worth to whoever.Like Moller, imo, it's time to let objective readers, be they members or visitors, to be the jury, reviewing the arguments and making their own respective judgment as to whether any evidence has been presented supportive to the Exodus.As to all that Admin is requiring, it appears to be more than geologists Putnam et al have been required for their acclaimed scientific theory. Therefore, Like Ballard, Ryan and Putnam all I can say is what I've cited is all that I have at this time.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Both have corroborative evidence. Yes. Both also lack some research which should disallow both from claiming the status of theory.Btw, the clip which I provided shows Mollar's scientific method of falsification. He researched the Red Sea topography in the region of the long acclaimed traditional Mt Sinai, finding it much deeper and more rugged, lacking any corroborative evidence.Thus he falsified it as a possibility, leaving the Nuweiba site being more shallow and having the corroborating evidence supportive to the Biblical record.

You're assuming that the mighty rush of water would have caused no erosion of a larger delta from the wadi canyon and that nothing changed during the event and over the millennia since the event from shipping and currents, earth quakes etc. Isn't the severe drop off in depth at the end of the delta unusual for deltas?

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

There would, of course, be no way of imperically proving that there was a more tapered off delta at some time in the past. Nor can it be assumed that it was not. I asked a question. Why the sudden drop off of the delta? Isn't that unusual for deltas? We know that the rock above and below the delta does not extend out into the sea. This may be indicative that a deep delta was at some period created by wash out when the wadi canyon was formed.Given that the corroborating evidence cited has not been imperically refuted, it cannot be assumed that there was, for sure, never ever a delta extending further out into the sea.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

How many times do I have to repeat that we're not debating about a wheel. The video photographed evidence shows multiple wheel shaped and axle shaped forms as well as other unusual coral forms in a rather unusual location for coral.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Hi Dirk. Welcome to the fray, but I don't recall saying any such thing. To the best of my recollection, I said something to the effect that the corroborating evidence supported the wheel and axle like corral forms. If they stood alone, the value of them as evidence would be diminished. That's my problem with the traditional Mt Sinai. It pretty much stands alone, lacking substantial evidence to match the Biblical account of the event. Savvy?

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Lennart Moller who sees the forms as evidence is a widely acclaimed prestigious marine scientist having significant credentials. He is no crackpot or fraudulent deceiver.

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Lennart Mller is from Sweden. He is a research scientist in the field of medicine and DNA-research. Dr. Mller has studied a number of subjects (limnology, marine biology, toxicology, chemistry) at the Universities of Uppsala and Stockholm and has a doctors degree in medicine from the Karolinska Institutet (KI). KI (established 1810) is the medical university of Stockholm (http://www.ki.se) and one of the leading international medical universities. The faculty decides about the Nobel Prize in Medicine.

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Lennart Mller has been at KI since 1982 and holds a position as professor (which in Sweden is the highest academic level, in other countries professor indicate a university teacher). Mller is head of the Research Laboratory of Analytical Toxicology and the professorship is in environmental medicine.

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The research is international to its character with collaborations with many different universities around the world. Mller has been lecturing in, collaborating with and visiting many international universities and has in total traveled in more than 60 countries.

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In addition to the normal work for a scientist, to publish scientific articles, Dr. Mller has published a number of books. The books are in subjects like theology, ethics, cancer, urban air, environmental medicine, archeology and scientific images (see "Other Books" on this web site). The books are published by publishing houses like The Swedish Environmental Protection Agency, The Swedish Cancer Society, Prevent, Cordia, EFS, Scandinavia Publishing House, Karolinska University Press and international publishers of the different translations. Under the heading "Other Books" images of the cover of books are shown and for three books web sites are available.

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The different books are published in seven different languages and there are further translations ongoing

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This credentialed scientist figured the evidence warranted all of the expense and time he spent to do the exploratory research.He accomplished about as much as the renowned Robert Ballard accomplished with his acclaimed discovery of flood evidence in the Black Sea, being the photography. Both had some corroborative evidence supportive to their hypotheses relative to the respective phenomena researched. Debatable. I'm not aware that there should be an alter as per the Biblical account. The golden calf was what the people worshiped. The evidence I cited was the hoofed animals inscribed in the rock in the area which fits the Biblical account. These inscriptions suggest that something was going on relative to cattle at some time. Again, this, standing by itself would be of little value as evidence. Jar, you should be ashamed to even go there, given the strawman you peddled as evidence. You should be ashamed that I had to show what you failed to show from the angle which your image was taken. You should be ashamed that you failed to refute my valid argument that there was indeed evidence of a water flow.Have you forgotten my valid point that fragmented pieces of the split rock, void of a water flow, would have fallen in a random pile in and around the crack, rather than forming a relatively smooth bed of eroded small fragments protruding forth from the crack indicative of a water flow? You and the pack failed to refute that valid point of mine.Your strawmen examples of a common creek bed of rounded smooth stones no way resembled what should match a fragmented rock phenomena. Though the mountain having a dark top is debatable, it does not stand alone but is supportive to the other cited evidence. Debatable. LoL. In 14 pages you and the pack have not empirically falsified scientist Mollar's hypothesis regarding this phenomena. Says the dogged skeptic, who wouldn't ever admit to any, regardless of how much is cited. Btw, you failed to mention some of the ducks in my row. Take off the dark glasses and look objectively.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Hi Dirk. I don't recall that Moller cited the alleged the gold wheel as evidence in his video. Correct me if mistaken. I believe Ron Wyatt alleged that it existed. If it did exist, I doubt that it remained long after the word got out. .I'm not taking a position on the alleged gold wheel as to whether it exists/existed or not.I said that the mountain was debatable, but more so if it stood alone, like the traditional Mt Sinai does, lacking anything else. The fact that there is even a black topped mountain in the right succession to my row of ducks lends some (I say some) credence to it's significance.(ABE)Unfortunately the mountain is guarded from access for analysis. I wonder what the Saudi's have to hide, that they see the need to guard it?? Edited by Buzsaw, : As noted

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Jar, copy and pasting repeatedly the same ole is a waste of bandwidth and contributes nothing edifying.You need to show where I ever claimed there was a calf alter in any Exodus thread before repeatedly alleging that I did. You've spun that up from whole cloth.Worshipping an idol does not necessarily constitute setting up an alter. I am not aware of anything in the Biblical account that says there was a golden calf alter perse.Even if there were ever one, Moses, being exceedingly angry at the sheeple would have destroyed it along with the golden calf. Go figure.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

People have been goading me about evidence along the trail of the multitude of Israelites in the wilderness.It just came to mind that very likely, they were careful to tidy up before moving on, leaving no lasting trail for anyone might wanting to pursue them during the two years of movement.
As for their lengthy sojourn at Kaddish Barn-ea (Petra), I've already covered that, in that many cultures have occupied that over the millennia.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

I don't see why all of the tado over the images. I don't dig that anything has been altered just because the little man was carved out. A different person may have came in from the camp and added the man. Who knows?This is a big fuss about little of consequence. My point was only that animals were in the camp and there was a golden calf worshiped. So far as I'm aware, the scripture doesn't give any details about just how the worship was done. If any alter was involved Moses would have destroyed it. The images plus the fact that the mountain is guarded says something about there being some significant activity there at some point in time.Imo, you're not helping your weak arguments at all nor are you diminishing my points.I've said about all I have that will satisfy Admin or any of you people. You all had your minds set at the OP message. You all will go on from here and repeat your lies to the www unceasingly that Buzsaw has never ever cited one iota of evidence for the Biblical Exodus.Some will read this thread and disagree with you: some with me. I see some ratings which show that one or some agreed with me at least. If I can enlighten one or more, I'm happy. It's worth the time and effort. May the truth prevail. Edited by Buzsaw, : Spell check

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

My position has always been that there was no alter. Perhaps Jar can show that the scripture refers to one. The rock inscription of the man by the animal depicts no alter; just the man and the animal. Thus, if that image relates to worship, it appears that the man is worshiping the animal itself and not bowing or worshiping at some alter.If Wyatt's position happens to be that there was an alter or that the image depicts an alter, I don't know whether that is the case that doesn't necessarily mean that it's my position. Perhaps the one with the man would be the one most indicative of worship. My position has been that the animal inscriptions show that the inscription, being at the foot of the mountain is indicative that some significant activity relating to hoofed animal/animals happened at some time in the past.My position has been that this standing alone would not be significant. It is just another duck in the row of evidence ducts in that it is in the right succession of events supportive to the Biblical account of the Exodus. It is supportive corroborating evidence to the account. That's it, just as Robert Ballard's evidence of salt water vs fresh water was corroborative evidence of his hypothesis relative to the yet to be analyzed logs at the bottom of the Black Sea. Nothing relating to either amount to much standing alone.You people are requiring more of me than of yourselves, in that you are, in a sense, dividing to conquer neglecting the big conglomerate picture. Zooming in on the horse's head is not the way to appreciate a Fredrick Remington painting, for example. This, from scientist Lennart Moller is from his book, THE EXODUS CASE is all I can show at this point. Again, I have shown the credibility data of this renowned scientist author as to his credentials. He is not regarded in the scientific academic arena as a fraud or crackpot, unlike how he appears to be regarded here at EvC by skeptics.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.