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Author | Topic: The Bible on Human Waste and Carcasses | |||||||||||||||||||||||
purpledawn Member (Idle past 3488 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
Many times people have commented that the Bible laws concerning health and the environment were ahead of their time. I contend that they are not.
I would like to discuss two specific laws that are usually brought up as evidence of foreknowledge or divine inspiration.
Deuteronomy 23:12-13 Designate a place outside the camp where you can go to relieve yourself. As part of your equipment have something to dig with, and when you relieve yourself, dig a hole and cover up your excrement. If we look at the entire section concerning waste control we read that this ruling deals with soldiers encamped against their enemies.
Deuteronomy 23:9 When you are encamped against your enemies, keep away from everything impure, . At the end of the section we see that the reasons are geared towards keeping the camp holy so they can win, not sanitary.
Deuteronomy 23:14 For the LORD your God moves about in your camp to protect you and to deliver your enemies to you. Your camp must be holy, so that he will not see among you anything indecent and turn away from you. Since Deuteronomy was probably written during the divided kingdom, civilization was already established. Most people weren’t living in camps. Also if we look at the 613 Laws of the Jews, we see this rule listed with the bottom grouping concerning war. I have not seen any evidence that any ancient tribe left waste within the tribal compound. I don’t believe the Native Americans or African tribes did such a thing either and I haven't heard of tribes being discovered that have such a practice. IMO, it seems to be a natural practice in tribal communities to keep waste outside the living area.
Leviticus 11:35-36 Anything that one of their carcasses falls on becomes unclean; an oven or cooking pot must be broken up. They are unclean, and you are to regard them as unclean. A spring, however, or a cistern for collecting water remains clean, but anyone who touches one of these carcasses is unclean. This is another one that when we read the entire passage we find that it is dealing with ritual impurity, not health. It is also listed under Ritual Purity and Impurity in the 613 Laws (5th from the bottom).
Leviticus 11:29-31 Of the animals that move about on the ground, these are unclean for you: The weasel, the rat, any kind of great lizard, the gecko, the monitor lizard, the wall lizard, the skink and the chameleon. Of all those that move along the ground, these are unclean for you. Whoever touches them when they are dead will be unclean till evening. It is concerned with ritual purity and not health.
Leviticus 11:36-38 A spring, however, or a cistern for collecting water remains clean, but anyone who touches one of these carcasses is unclean. If a carcass falls on any seeds that are to be planted, they remain clean. But if water has been put on the seed and a carcass falls on it, it is unclean for you. Notice none of these deals with the need to wash one’s hands after touching a dead animal or the article touched by the dead animal. It does mention putting the item in water, but it is still unclean until evening. The magic hour. Conclusion: These verses do not support that the Bible was “ahead of its time.” Instead it was pretty much par for the course. NOTE: This discussion is concerning these two situations only. *********ABE: Removed preference and spelling This message has been edited by purpledawn, 01-17-2006 10:41 AM This message has been edited by purpledawn, 01-28-2006 07:36 AM There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3488 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:Nothing I have read describing the "whites" interaction with natives suggested that tribal communities didn't keep their personal waste away from the living environment. quote:Exactly! There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3488 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
Why do I get the feeling my very serious topic is going into the kitty litter?
There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3488 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
Is there any evidence that shows that ancient nonhebrew armies didn't bury their waste outside the camp or not at all?
There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3488 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
This article, Domestic wastewater treatment in the ancient world, 3500 B.C.E to 500 C. E., shows that dealing with sewage was not ignored in the ancient world.
In the Egyptian city of Herakopolis (B.C.E. 2100), the average person treated their wastes much like those in Ur, they threw the wastes into the streets. However, “in the elite and religious quarters, there was a deliberate effort made to remove all wastes, organic and inorganic to locations outside the living and/or communal areas, which usually meant the rivers.” Which would cover the timeframe when tradition says the laws were written. I haven't been able to find anymore on ancient armies. There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3488 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:I'm glad you agree, but not sure your rational works the way you have it written. quote:By true, I'm assuming you mean if it is in accordance with fact and not false. Since the Bible is made up of various types of writings, IMO, it is not wise to base a conclusion on whether the Bible, as a whole, is true. Are songs true, is fiction true, are parables true, etc.? Songs may reflect the feelings of the time, but not necessarily factual events. Supposedly after David slew the Philistine (Goliath - 1 Samuel 18:7) the women sang "Saul has slain his thousands, and David his tens of thousand." He'd actually only slain one man. Although songs are inspired by reality, unfortunately they can't always be taken at face value. Job is a fictional writing and the words of wisdom were probably true in their time and some have withstood the test of time. Personally, I don't think the Hebrews classified their writings like we do today. IMO, they mixed their facts with fiction.
quote:Genesis 1 and 2 have different authors. (Documentary Hypothesis) So if Genesis 2 was true, then snakes would still talk, but I understand what you're trying to say. quote:If Leviticus was truly written at the time of Moses and came from God, then King David and Bathsheba would have been killed for adultery. Lev 20:10 'If there is a man who commits adultery with another man's wife, one who commits adultery with his friend's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. Leviticus was probably written about or after 722BCE. (Documentary Hypothesis) But again I understand what you are saying if Leviticus was true about the circumstances of how the laws came to be.
quote:Except that the premise by most is that God gave the info to Moses, not Noah. Those contending that the laws were ahead of their time don't feel that they existed before the time that Moses supposedly received them. quote:I'm not sure I understand what you're going for here. I'm not sure how the truthfulness of the Bible effects the sanitary conditions of other nations. I'm probably reading it wrong. "Peshat is what I say and derash is what you say." --Nehama Leibowitz
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