Hauntings, Exorcisms and the Like

i'll sign my hubby up for your challenge, Arach.As for the initial topic in this stream, my husband pretty much grew up with a tie to the spiritual world. He played with spirit kids when an young child, had familiar spirits when a teen & witnessed the possession of one of his closest friends in college. He performed the exorcism for that friend. When we met in school (i was a firm atheist at the time) he taught me to see, manipulate & control spirits. After 21 years of being a apart of hauntings, exorcisms and the like, it became aparent to him that the authority of Christ overruled all. We are now christians.I'll make him aware of your potential future debates. I'm sure he'll enjoy them

Interesting posts. Yes I did experience all of the above as a non-christian. I still maintain friendships with friends that are non-christian that are still deep in that world. It is all as real as can be, even though much of what you see in the press is often sensationalized. There is validity in the roots though.Feel free to check out my long and involved story at http://daretobelieve.no-ip.com if you would like.

Thanks for replying. Enjoy reading. You will find there are a lot of new-age, biblical, and spritual truths in it. Gravity is gravity; it is there if you believe in it or not.

I have experienced dreams that were simply the culmination of subconscious thoughts processing a day’s work and I have experienced dreams so demonic that I felt I was in a battle of life and death. I believe some dreams are circumstantial while others can carry deep spiritual roots.

New ager at the time. My wife was even more so when she had such dreams. However these dreams tend to be more prevelant in people who are "baby" christians or are just becoming christians. Some older christians don't know how to fix the problem but that is less common in my experience.Demonic oppression in dreams was on 10% of my demonic spritual experiences 90% of my experience and often torment occured while I was awake. Just so that you know.When a personal friend became posessed (when we were deep newagers) there was no promise of great things. The spirit cut strait to the chase, evil, death and other junk like that.

Many many things.
a) affliction of my conscious mind and warping of my thoughts. Brutal intimidation tactics.
b) The possessions of my closest friends - I performed the exorcism
c) The attempted murder of my life (after I killed myself for the first time)
d) Seeing spirits using my "astral" sight, communicated with them and manipulated them
e) Astral projection (this is not torment). I used to sit in my room in college and see what was happening in a house over 200 miles away. - An my girlfriend could feel me touch her.
f) The ghost of my uncle used to visit me as a child. My mom fought for me and told him to go away. I never knew of my moms deep spiritual side until I was well into my twenties.
The list goes on. Read my story if you so choose, everything is there. http://daretobelieve.no-ip.com

The preceding was the awake stuff. The asleep stuff would resemble things like the dream in the movie "Dragon the Bruce Lee Story". Fighting for my life in general. Also happenings like those in the movie "flat liners". General hideousness and visions of the demonic, murder, rape, blood, the pealing of skin, skeletal remains coming to life and haunting me. You know the usual deep demonic stuff.

First thing. If you read my entire story you will learn that I chose to give up my list of "parlor tricks" many years ago. If you are going to play with fire. Light one that doesn't consume you. I learned through my new age experiences that using such skills acted as a great harm to my spirit and body. Manipulating energy for my selfish desires is dangerous like manipulating matter, you end up with radioactivity. If you desire my accounts to be proven, then I would suggest you speak to an ex-secret-opps trained solder or join the elite American Military. They have been training for years how to see over hills and difficult areas of a battle field using astral projection. I don't have contact phone numbers of course for this, but if the scientists where that serious about "proving" this, they would try to find a way to un-restrict this information and track down some of these people. They do exist. Let them burn themselves up for your own selfish gain.
I have no desire to prove myself to you. I couldn’t care less if you promote what my past was or who I am. I know my past and I need not prove my past to anyone. If you have intelligent questions the feel free to ask.As for science proving the spiritual world in any way:
Ask any blind person what the color blue is and ask any deaf person what 100 MHz sounds like. That is paranormal science this day, we can guess, but we do not really know. Nor can we definitely prove or disprove. Cutting edge science does not light a candle to where it should be in order to understand and measure properly / completely such things. Let’s look at things we should know by now: Medical science says they understand everything about how the heart works even though after decades of research, they still don’t know what causes the first electrical impulse created in the SA node of the heart of a developing fetus — after that original impulse, the SA node then acts as the pacemaker of the heart. Or Please explain and re-create in a scientific experiment how our millions of neurons create a conscious mind. If science can’t even fully explain consciousness, how can they dare think they can prove or disprove spirituality from some menial caveman-like tests? They measure spirituality as effectively as measuring cell anatomy with a light microscope. Yes they have developed some sophisticated theories and devices in this year 2005 but maybe ask the question again in 1000 years and something interesting can be truly be proven or disproven. How can we expect such deficient science to definitively explain the inner workings of the spiritual world? Prove or disprove it? It humors me how much people depend on this modern science to blindly create or explain their own spiritual beliefs. You may disagree with me and cite a whole bunch of tests, put please tell me if they can explain all the inner workings of the spirit? We know it is there somewhere..The spiritual world will start to be proven to you science guys when YOU can fully understand and prove the definitive existence of your spirit. Let alone explain consciousness and supernatural manifestations. Don’t test me on higher functioning until you understand even the most basic of things.
To make a point:
Let’s go back 200 years. When we (science) could not see / prove an atom or electron, did that mean the electron didn’t exist? Science (we) could not see bacteria and viruses back then, did that mean they didn’t exist? No, that would be naive to say now wouldn’t it? You have better not say the spirit and spiritual world does not exist because of our lack of ability to see / re-produce it then. You go back 200 years and prove the existence of an atom. While science tries at this day to prove or disprove spirituality.Heck! I will even raise the bar: Create one atom if you can. From scratch. Use evolution please. Do it in a lab. Then maybe there will be validity in evolution. I can’t prove a creator any more than you can prove evolution created matter. Where did matter come from? Where did the first atom come from? Answer these questions with your evolution theory, re-create it in a lab, I would like to see it. Create for me one atom and I will believe you.We are wasting time debating on spiritual matters when we can’t even measure the spirit effectively, let alone understand it. The original post asked if there were any non-Christians that experienced new-age type spirituality. That question has been answered through me and my close relationships. Now we are digressing off topic.
Start a new thread if you would like. This one has been answered. I have wasted enough time. Gotta go.

Mike I like your point. As for horse hockey. I have a personal friend that is a retired special operations (classified) sniper. He can not divulge much however he has told me much of what he can. You would soil your shorts if you knew what the government knew and did even back in the 70’s. Who are you to say what they do or don’t do. I am sorry, I must say your statement is horse hockey.My point Charles is that Science can't prove crap. Science can't prove the origins of the world. Yes scientists say definitively that there is no God. That statement is based on faith yet often misleadingly trying to be proven by hiding behind the evolution theory. That is not your problem. That is the scientists that bend the truth. Science can't prove God or the lack of it.Science can analyze quite well what it can see but is blind to most of everything. That is why science says it studies the physical and not the spiritual sure. However you take your physical findings (al be it child like) and state that the spiritual does not exist? What gives? Yet you all rely on science to provide all of the answers, when it has no clue. Science once believed the world was flat. Top scientists used to say bathing was bad for you. Science used to say there was nothing smaller than a molecule. They were all naive and using their limited resources to come upon their "SOLID" proof of false things. It was all crap.
Some science is good however. We can prove there are hormones, DNA and the like. Things that have strait physical existence. Don't use science to debate the spiritual world and expect scientistic data to say that a new age spiritualist is incorrect. This reasoning is rampant across the community has to be rather unfounded because of our vastly limited scientific resources to prove such data. Yet many believe it is proven. How ... I can't even find the word.
As always you have missed my main point. Science says there is no spirit, no ESP, or anything spiritual (even though it can't accurately test for these things). I say come back in 1000 years and you can truly see what percentage of things now being peddled and touted is crap as well. Yet so many swallow blindly these stupid assumptions whole heartedly it is sad.
Since there was no existence of germs 200 years ago and headaches must be cured by cracking your head open, must mean by the same rule that spirituality does not exist. As so many people say. Or try to debate spirituality with incomplete scientific proof. It is all a circus show which I do not wish to be a part of.
You can not prove what you have no ability to prove yet you ask me to prove myself by using your limited means? This is ridiculous, that is my point. Somehow you missed it.
Funny how selected reading is rampant in this forum.
Don't ask me to prove ESP through your science any more than I will ask you to prove an atom using a light microscope. And don’t use your light telescope to tell people that the atom does not exist. It is ludicrous yet done every day.By the way, evolution explains the origins of the earth in a nice pretty story; does that prove there is no God? Science / scientists often draw that connection, I don't know how. Then teach it to my children. Sure folks the earth is flat. I will believe you.... I will stop showing too ok?I do not enjoy debating with people who suffer from selective reading disabilities. The main question of this thread has been answered. You all tell me to say on topic. Now you stay on topic. Start a new post if you would like. I don't like debating with the blind and the deaf. Maybe this forum is not for me. Gotta go. No time to talk further. bye.

Thank you. Not nasty just frustrated.

By the way. ever since I received my new inheritance from the creator, my life is FAR from demon infested or dark. In fact it is quite bright, blessed, brilliant and fun.

In my new age days I used to demonstrate the effects of spirit regardless of belief by altering energy in anyone I so chose. I could reverse the flow of energy within your body to feel cold / hot. I could almost knock you out with sheer energic power if I so chose. There are many out there that are presently like the way I was.
That proves energy but that does not prove spirit. Spirit can not be measured by science nor can it be proven to someone who can not see. Any person can learn to see and understand the spirit however there is not a "dry display" that can be done to show a spirit. Spirits is not a simple duplicatable mass of energy, they are far more complicated than that.My military friend would not appreciate me divulging his name to a bunch of strangers. Sorry. You can look for yourself. If it doesn't interest you enough to look than it doesn't matter. He was in the canadian military and worked directly with the americans for years. It is amazing the similiarities and the vast differences between our two militaries.Anyway enough digression. talk later maybe...

Talk to any Cranial Sacral Therapist studied in the Upleager method. Some practitioners are more "powerful" than others if you want to call it that.
In order for science to prove what is experienced, scientists must first be able to analyze the neurological synaptic and chemical transmissions at microscopic levels. They can not yet do this "live" while someone is doing energy work. So how can it then be proven to scientists? I don't know. Science must catch up first. This might also be tested by microscopic changes in vascularity. Science can see veins but can not yet get into the capillary beds. They are too small to my understanding. At least not in a live person. Maybe nano technology may be able to do this in the coming years. However blood flow is secondary to the parasthetic sensations found in the nerve fibers.
As for documenting things, I have found in general if science can not measure an event it will not be documented cause in there eyes there is nothing proven. I hope when nanotechnology evolves this can finally be seen... Until then science can't measure properly unfortunately. It has been documented in psy documents however most scientists think anything having to do with psy and paranormal are quacks. Yes about 10% what I used to do. I threw away that jersey a long time ago. But how can science prove what they can not measure? We are back to the atom and light microscope problem again. They would have to go off of what a "controlled body" says but then that will simply be shot down by people who want "proof". It is not my desire to prove anything anymore though. It does me no good. Science will prove it when it finally gets to it I am sure. There are people who do experience these things that don't necessarily believe in them. That case is far more rare. They used to call me in a panic not knowing what to do when they experienced it because it felt like their whole world was falling apart. I would go with a few friends and fix the problem. So yes people can experience it. However when you are trained to know what to look for, you will see things far more readily. A bad analogy but it works: It helps to find a needle in a hay stack when you know what the needle is supposed to look like. Your understanding of the needle or belief in the needle does not create the needle's existence. You just find it better and know it when you see it.
I will say that some people do create things out of their mind. Many doctors believe that fibromyalgia is a disorder created in the mind and not in the body. In many cases this is true however in most cases fibromyalgia is a true disorder caused by overtoxicity, myofascial disorders, parasites, fungus and a whole host of other things. Doctors are now understanding this physical issue and now stating that it may no longer be a disorder or belief in the mind. The spirit world is thought about the same way by many. I agree for some it is a chemical imbalance or over active imagination, however there are many cases where it is found outside of a belief base.

No time to proof. I am in a hurry.I was thinking anatomy. The manipulation of the cranial bones. I have been a practising therapist in quite some time. If you think the therapy does not work. Speak to the many people I have healed from headaches on a repeated base regardless of beliefs or background. Your statement seems to be rooted in innocent engorance but that is ok. We all can't experience everything in the world.
There are cases that don't work and there are times that the therapy is valid for healing specific disorders. There is a physiological reason why it works, proven in science and also a spiritual reason why it works, partly proven in science i am told. I don't know where you got your difinitive knowledge but my experience says other wise.
It can't be tested that way. The hot or cold is not a general response, it is localized the the area being worked. Also facia re-alignment is something that can even be heard during a session. That should be the start of showing there is something happening to a scientist. The practitioner must be within a certain distance of the patient. Not unlike therapeutic thouch (deployed in a lot of english hospitals because if its effectiveness I am told).
Asking a therapist to do therapy from another room is like asking a psychologist to heal without speaking or asking questions. If science can measure the microscopic changes in the body they will find that the sensations don't fall in line with alterations of room temperature. If you saw a guru, which I am no longer, you should be able to experience some of these things yourself.
If you suffer from headaches I could have you fixed up in about 30 min no matter what your belief base is. I have had people almost stand beside themselves after a session with me (regardless of faith or beliefs) in fact many did it to humor me thinking it would not work at all. I surprise them every time. I don't care who you are, there are physical laws that will one day show how "cranial" / cranio sacral works (regardless of belief). I have alleviated maybe 100 headaches in my time. I have only found 2 or 3 I couldn't "crack". Their cases were more complicated then most though.
If you look up clinical tests of therapeutic touch in recovery rooms in britan you should find out some interesting results. I have not done this research myself, I just understand it a general practise because I used to be deep in the medical world not too long ago. Talk soon. I like your questions and posts.

Many people believe therapeutic touch is a form of prayer. I am at ends about the topic. Quite frankly I don't care any more, but you may feel free to ask this doctor for his references and ask him to back up his statements with copies of the studies mentioned in the following link. He is an MD and supposedly a good resource for information. He should be aware of the hospitals that employ this technique successfully and what their results are:
http://www.mercola.com/2000/jun/17/prayer.htmAnother piece of my mind if it interests:
When I was deep in this movement I was one of the few that could tell acute, intermediate and chronic injuries without any knowledge of clinical history or any other testing. Some I was training could do the same while others had no clue. I could also alleviate symptoms by working on them directly and indirectly. Others had the same success while some left the rooms just frustrated. I had my doctors astounded when I was personally doing pushups on my just healing comminuted spiral fracture of the humorous after only 4 weeks. I also had a secular friend leave one of our training sessions absolutely FREAKED that I could tell he injured his shoulder about a year past, and a hip injury when he was a kid. He was afraid of me ever since and rarely spoke to me after that day. Something as simple as that can really blow the mind of someone who does not believe or understand. He came to prove we all were quacks and fortunately / unfortunately found we weren’t. I knew of one ladies ovarian problems 7 years before doctors found out. The rest of her was in good health and I knew that as well. That however is just my personal experience.There are hundreds of TT practitioners that are quacks, have no clue and experience few results. While others are like dynamite. The study groups should test those (or only those) that have experienced tangible results in the past. I do not know if they did. There are good MDs and bad MDs. There are good TTs and bad TTs. I sincerely hope they tested the talented. In the field I personally found about 10% or less of TT practitioners really knew [understood and successfully implemented] what they were taught and had strong results. That us just my personal experience, I may be wrong but it is what I found.I say talk to the MD and also look at clinical results. As you look at clinical results look at the success rates of the practitioners before they were tested. Control groups can be misleading if the practitioners suck.
I can mistakenly take a control group of retirement homes and say the life expectancy of the average Canadian is 10 to 20 years. That is if I didn’t know that the control group was not a sampling that reflected a solid accurate and provable base.Given the low success percentage of TT practitioners I personally know and have worked with, I can guess there would be a lot of studies saying the therapy is a farce. That is also just my thoughts. I may be incorrect. Anyway gotta go again.Oh ya. If you were going to talk to a CranioSacral practitioner, I would say talk to a c3 level practitioner or even a c4 if you can find one. C4 is not publicly known to be a level because you have to be invited to it to be trained. I don’t know why. Maybe because they want to see a running success before they take you to the next level.