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Author Topic:   The boasts of atheists (Atheist self-deception)
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 271 of 304 (331005)
07-12-2006 12:57 AM
Reply to: Message 269 by Faith
07-12-2006 12:46 AM


word choice
Why are you all making this huge moral calamity out of a man's feeling for people who are suffering?????
compassion is a useful emotion for helping our fellow man.
pity, especially unwanted pity, is condescending and patronizing.
perhaps it was just a poor choice of words.
Edited by arachnophilia, : subtitle


This message is a reply to:
 Message 269 by Faith, posted 07-12-2006 12:46 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 272 by Faith, posted 07-12-2006 1:05 AM arachnophilia has replied
 Message 290 by robinrohan, posted 07-12-2006 8:27 AM arachnophilia has not replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 272 of 304 (331006)
07-12-2006 1:05 AM
Reply to: Message 271 by arachnophilia
07-12-2006 12:57 AM


Re: word choice
A FEELING of pity is not the same thing as SAYING to their face how you pity them. Pity has acquired a nasty meaning from those who use it to put someone down, which has in fact been done here. But that's because it's a LIE. True pity is just feeling with your fellow man.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 271 by arachnophilia, posted 07-12-2006 12:57 AM arachnophilia has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 274 by Discreet Label, posted 07-12-2006 1:16 AM Faith has replied
 Message 275 by arachnophilia, posted 07-12-2006 1:17 AM Faith has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 273 of 304 (331007)
07-12-2006 1:14 AM
Reply to: Message 268 by Faith
07-12-2006 12:41 AM


Re: Boasting
I'm sorry. I just dislike sentimentality. It's phony. Sometimes it's mere inarticulateness though, not always phoniness. I don't want to hurt anybody's feelings about it. I would never say this to anyone normally. It just has to be said on a thread like this which is ABOUT such things and in which you are all beating up Robin because of his perfectly sensible feelings and arguments.
Don't be sorry, please, start your club. And all of those who feel like you can get together and commiserate (according to the dictionary that means To feel or express sympathy: commiserated over their failure.
Start your club and you and robin and iano can meet and weep and whine and revel in your misery.
For the rest of us, I give:
Yes, by all means, do not be sorry. Start your club.
The rest of us will enjoy the rescue of Tivo in the Great Storm and how two days later he was big and fluffy and ran off to join the other ground squirrels and has a burrow on the other side of the driveway and when we sit out on the porch he comes up and sits at the entrance and sometimes runs across and over our feet and how this year he brought three of the babies and taught them how to search out seed in the gardens and how when the Owls were nesting in the palm across the road he served as guardian and watch squirrel and not one of those living in his burrow became baby owl food and how wilma and karl (the Great Horned Owls that lived in the palm) had to go to a far off field to find food for their chicks and when karl and wilma taught their hatchlings to hunt they did it in the field across the road and not in Tivo's territory.
keep responding and I will tell the tale of harold and his harem.
Edited by jar, : remove extra LF

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 268 by Faith, posted 07-12-2006 12:41 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 276 by Faith, posted 07-12-2006 2:26 AM jar has replied

Discreet Label
Member (Idle past 5085 days)
Posts: 272
Joined: 11-17-2005


Message 274 of 304 (331008)
07-12-2006 1:16 AM
Reply to: Message 272 by Faith
07-12-2006 1:05 AM


Re: word choice
True pity is not feeling for your fellow man. True pity is putting yourself into another person's shoes and trying to experience their life and then after doing that, doing something to help your fellow man THAT is pity.
The way I feel you are using pity is more like apathy because you do nothing, you say their life is pitiful and then you proceed to do nothing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 272 by Faith, posted 07-12-2006 1:05 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 280 by Faith, posted 07-12-2006 2:47 AM Discreet Label has replied

arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 275 of 304 (331009)
07-12-2006 1:17 AM
Reply to: Message 272 by Faith
07-12-2006 1:05 AM


Re: word choice
Pity has acquired a nasty meaning from those who use it to put someone down,
"sentimentality" has acquired a nasty meaning by those who use it to describe cutesy kitsch.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 272 by Faith, posted 07-12-2006 1:05 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 276 of 304 (331013)
07-12-2006 2:26 AM
Reply to: Message 273 by jar
07-12-2006 1:14 AM


Re: Boasting
There's nothing sentimental and phony about rescuing animals and caring for animals. But there sure is about making ooing and ahing over baby birds into the meaning of life, and there sure is about saying that flowers are how the earth laughs. Yik. Almost ruins the beauty of flowers and the charm of baby birds. It's about proportion.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 277 of 304 (331016)
07-12-2006 2:36 AM
Reply to: Message 275 by arachnophilia
07-12-2006 1:17 AM


Re: word choice
"Sentiment" is probably what you are thinking of. Most of us have quite a bit of sentimentality too, so in itself it's just a human thing. The problem is in elevating sentimental expressions to the meaning of life.
quote:
sen·ti·men·tal·i·ty sen·ti·men·tal·i·ties 1. The quality or condition of being excessively or affectedly sentimental.
2. A sentimental idea or an expression of it.
Sentimentality - definition of sentimentality by The Free Dictionary
quote:
sen·ti·men·tal (sen't?-men'tl)
adj.
Characterized or swayed by sentiment.
Affectedly or extravagantly emotional.
Resulting from or colored by emotion rather than reason or realism.
Appealing to the sentiments, especially to romantic feelings: sentimental music.sentimentally sen'ti·men'tal·ly adv.SYNONYMS sentimental, bathetic, maudlin, mawkish, mushy, romantic, schmaltzy. These adjectives mean overly or insincerely emotional: a sentimental card; a bathetic novel; maudlin words of sympathy; mawkish sentiment; mushy effusiveness; a romantic adolescent; a schmaltzy song.
Answers - The Most Trusted Place for Answering Life's Questions
quote:
Dictionary Information: Definition Pity
Thesaurus: Pity
Description and Meaning: Pity
Pity (Pit"y) (?), n.; pl. Pities (#).
[OE. pite, OF. pité, pitié, F. pitié, L. pietas piety, kindness, pity. See Pious, and cf. Piety.]
1. Piety. [Obs.] Wyclif.
2. A feeling for the sufferings or distresses of another or others; sympathy with the grief or misery of another; compassion; fellow-feeling; commiseration. "He that hath pity upon the poor lendeth unto the Lord." Prov. xix. 17. "He . . . has no more pity in him than a dog." Shak.
3. A reason or cause of pity, grief, or regret; a thing to be regretted. "The more the pity." Shak. "What pity is it That we can die but once to serve our country!" Addison.
^ In this sense, sometimes used in the plural, especially in the colloquialism: "It is a thousand pities."
Synonyms -- Compassion; mercy; commiseration; condolence; sympathy, fellow-suffering; fellow-feeling. -- Pity, Sympathy, Compassion. Sympathy is literally fellow-feeling, and therefore requiers a certain degree of equality in situation, circumstances, etc., to its fullest exercise. Compassion is deep tenderness for another under severe or inevitable misfortune. Pity regards its object not only as suffering, but weak, and hence as inferior.Pity (Pit"y) (?), v. t.
[imp. & p. p. Pitied (?); p. pr. & vb. n. Pitying.]
1. To feel pity or compassion for; to have sympathy with; to compassionate; to commiserate; to have tender feelings toward (any one), awakened by a knowledge of suffering. "Like as a father pitieth his children, so the Lord pitieth them that fear him." Ps. ciii. 13.
2. To move to pity; -- used impersonally. [Obs.] "It pitieth them to see her in the dust." Bk. of Com. Prayer.Pity (Pit"y), v. i.
To be compassionate; to show pity. "I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy." Jer. xiii. 14.
http://www.selfknowledge.com/72347.htm
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Nighttrain
Member (Idle past 4015 days)
Posts: 1512
From: brisbane,australia
Joined: 06-08-2004


Message 278 of 304 (331017)
07-12-2006 2:39 AM
Reply to: Message 261 by docpotato
07-11-2006 11:56 PM


Me.too,Doc P. Let`s start a club.

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 Message 261 by docpotato, posted 07-11-2006 11:56 PM docpotato has not replied

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 279 of 304 (331018)
07-12-2006 2:43 AM
Reply to: Message 278 by Nighttrain
07-12-2006 2:39 AM


Actually, Doc's remark pretty much qualifies him for Robin's and my club. In case it's just a flash in the pan, though, he'd have to undergo testing.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 278 by Nighttrain, posted 07-12-2006 2:39 AM Nighttrain has not replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 280 of 304 (331020)
07-12-2006 2:47 AM
Reply to: Message 274 by Discreet Label
07-12-2006 1:16 AM


Re: word choice
True pity is not feeling for your fellow man. True pity is putting yourself into another person's shoes and trying to experience their life and then after doing that, doing something to help your fellow man THAT is pity.
The way I feel you are using pity is more like apathy because you do nothing, you say their life is pitiful and then you proceed to do nothing.
Good grief, man, how do you know what anybody here does to help out others?
And hey, how are you so sure they'd like you to sit down and talk to them anyway, since you're into questioning everybody's reactions but your own? They might experience your conversation as a royal pain.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 274 by Discreet Label, posted 07-12-2006 1:16 AM Discreet Label has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 281 of 304 (331021)
07-12-2006 3:08 AM
Reply to: Message 270 by docpotato
07-12-2006 12:56 AM


Re: Boasting
Some people know how to read facial expressions and body language better than others.
This objection to a feeling of pity for old men who have spent much of their lives in an institution with terrible wounds is mindboggling.
I'm sure most people just pass them by, either feeling nothing or avoiding whatever they do feel, or saying something cheery and patronizing. But you all would attack a guy who felt for them. You're all nuts.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 270 by docpotato, posted 07-12-2006 12:56 AM docpotato has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 282 by iano, posted 07-12-2006 5:07 AM Faith has replied

iano
Member (Idle past 1962 days)
Posts: 6165
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 282 of 304 (331031)
07-12-2006 5:07 AM
Reply to: Message 281 by Faith
07-12-2006 3:08 AM


Re: Boasting
Some people know how to read facial expressions and body language better than others.
Their eyes met across the crowed room and, having met, looked away quickly - as if they had been caught doing something wrong. When she dared to look back she found him already meeting her gaze. A flush rose in her cheeks and she absentmindedly replaced a stray strand of hair that had fallen from its perch. He could only admire her graceful fingers as they worked at the coiffure in the nimble way that comes so easily to women. His heart was beating faster now and he knew that if he didn't move, his courage would foresake him and he never would. Move...
"Hallo" he said, quietly "You must be very tired - seeing as you've been running through my mind all evening"
"Get lost pervert!" she replied
Edited by iano, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 281 by Faith, posted 07-12-2006 3:08 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 284 by Nighttrain, posted 07-12-2006 7:00 AM iano has replied

Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 283 of 304 (331033)
07-12-2006 5:30 AM
Reply to: Message 282 by iano
07-12-2006 5:07 AM


Re: Boasting
Yeah well the proof IS in the pudding.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 282 by iano, posted 07-12-2006 5:07 AM iano has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Nighttrain
Member (Idle past 4015 days)
Posts: 1512
From: brisbane,australia
Joined: 06-08-2004


Message 284 of 304 (331043)
07-12-2006 7:00 AM
Reply to: Message 282 by iano
07-12-2006 5:07 AM


Re: Boasting
Ian, you old romantic.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 282 by iano, posted 07-12-2006 5:07 AM iano has replied

Replies to this message:
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Nighttrain
Member (Idle past 4015 days)
Posts: 1512
From: brisbane,australia
Joined: 06-08-2004


Message 285 of 304 (331045)
07-12-2006 7:05 AM
Reply to: Message 284 by Nighttrain
07-12-2006 7:00 AM


Re: Boasting
Actually, I offered a seat in a crowded train to a 'woman'-replete with tatts, face stapled on, torn jeans. 'Whaddya think, I`m a cripple?' she snarled. Which made me a tad reluctant to seat-donate for the next vision from hell.

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