Summations Only

Unless you can show how what you learned from the program relates to the topic of this thread about the definition of species, I think you're off-topic. I was letting it go under the assumption that it would be a short diversion from the topic, but you seem to want to play 20 questions.Please feel free to propose a new topic to discuss this over at Proposed New Topics.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

Hi Big_Al35,If you have a topic you would like to discuss that isn't related to the definition of species then please propose it over at Proposed New Topics.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

Thanks for explaining how this relates to the topic. Carry on, everyone.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

Hello everyone!I'm going to recuse myself from discussion as Percy for a couple days, then beginning Monday morning I will take on a moderator role as Admin. I'll be looking for continuity in discussion, where lack of continuity is defined as lines of inquiry being suddenly initiated and equally suddenly abandoned. I'll also be making sure that discussion isn't wondering aimlessly but is focused on identifiable goals.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

As of this morning I am moderating this thread.Some of the recent posts primarily address off-topic issues generally related to the creation/evolution debate. Please address the topic, which is about the definition of species.Concerning the recent discussion about the SIGLEC13 gene, before discussion continues someone must explain how it is relevant to the topic.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

I have my finger on the suspension trigger. Please, everyone, follow these specific requests:

1. Keep discussion civil. Accusations that someone is lying are uncivil. In my experience people are almost always mistaken or misinformed and are honestly stating what they believe to be true.
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2. Address the topic, which is the definition of species. If Genesis includes a definition of species then someone needs to state this definition so that it may be discussed.
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3. This is a science thread, so arguments and evidence should be scientific. Religious arguments should not be used in this thread.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

Hi IamJoseph,This is a science thread. The Bible can provide the inspiration for your definition of species, but you cannot cite the Bible as evidence for your definition. In science threads evidence comes from the real world, not revelation.Please do the following:

1. Please provide a clear and concise statement of your definition of species.
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2. Please provide scientific evidence that "life was initiated in a dual gendered form."
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3. Please do not mention the Bible or Genesis again.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

Fearandloathing stated in the very message you replied to that climate was off-topic in this thread and said he would provide a bump for you over at the Climate Change Delusion thread, which he did, yet you replied in this thread anyway.See you tomorrow.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

I hope not many on the science side think that pasting derogatory labels on things proves anything or that motivation is relevant to whether a position is right or wrong. Motivation can be a short cut for detecting underhanded tactics, but it isn't evidence.The science side should stick to the facts they claim support their position and negate the other side's position. The science side should focus on the support or lack thereof of a position and not on their perceived foibles of the person promoting the position.Actually, that's good advice for both sides.If you'd like to discuss creationist tactics then there's a couple appropriate threads still open:

• A Guide to Creationist Tactics
• A Small Observation Concerning YEC Debate Tactics

Or you could propose a new thread over at Proposed New Topics, but leave your opinions about the other side out of this discussion because they're irrelevant and not science.I'm not kidding myself that I can convince you your view is wrong, but perhaps I can convince you that I *will* enforce the Forum Guidelines as I see them, and I wrote them.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

We almost never delete messages here at EvC Forum. The only exception these days are the Dennis Markuze threads.Your message isn't deleted, only hidden. If you like you can click the edit button, bring it into comformance with the Forum Guidelines, then unhide it.I don't think you really want me to treat you the same way I treated IamJoseph. All I did was hide the text of one of your posts. IamJoseph I suspended.Whatever faults IamJoseph had, incivility is not among them, and I find that incivility is the main cause of threads spiraling out of control as more and more participants begin engaging in a verbal fisticuffs contest of one-upmanship instead of discussing the topic. The Forum Guidelines request that participant try to maintain a dispassionate tone.

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--	Percy
	EvC Forum Director

AbE: When I originally composed this message I confused this thread with the Why are there no human apes alive today? thread. I have corrected this error. --AdminMazzy has done an excellent job describing the creationist position on kinds, but most notably she makes this comment about species: Nuggin posted an equally excellent reply noting that Mazzy has come to the precise same conclusion as science. The real world is a messy place and resists the human need to place things in neat categories. The commonly understood concept of species of clearly demarcated animal types is a human construct, and scientists understand that reality is much more nuanced.Species is nearly the lowest rung of our classification ladder (it's not necessarily the lowest because of subspecies or races), and perhaps reaching a mutual understanding on the definition of species and how vague it can sometimes be will be helpful in understanding why science places humans, chimps and gorillas in the same classification category, which should be helpful in the Why are there no human apes alive today? thread.Edited by Admin, : Typo.Edited by Admin, : Grammar.Edited by Admin, : AbE.

This thread is over four years old, I'm throwing it into summation mode.