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Author Topic:   Philosophical ramblings on the Adam & Eve Parable
jaywill
Member (Idle past 1941 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 46 of 80 (270276)
12-17-2005 6:45 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by Parasomnium
12-16-2005 7:27 PM


A New Start.
Parasomnium,
I have erased that entry prior to yours. I accept your apology. I in turn ask for your forgiveness for flippant remarks.
I admit that I did not read through the entire exchanges. And I also just learned about the "General Reply" which may have been more appropriate.
This message has been edited by jaywill, 12-17-2005 06:46 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by Parasomnium, posted 12-16-2005 7:27 PM Parasomnium has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 47 by Parasomnium, posted 12-17-2005 12:11 PM jaywill has replied

  
Parasomnium
Member
Posts: 2224
Joined: 07-15-2003


Message 47 of 80 (270324)
12-17-2005 12:11 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by jaywill
12-17-2005 6:45 AM


Re: A New Start.
jaywill writes:
A New Start.
Great, I’m glad that’s out of the way.
I’m afraid, though, that we will not be discussing much, because I have the impression that you are rather into bible study and I don’t find that particularly interesting, I’m more into science. Don’t let my “theological questions” for Carico fool you.
But thanks for your understanding.

Did you know that most of the time your computer is doing nothing? What if you could make it do something really useful? Like helping scientists understand diseases? Your computer could even be instrumental in finding a cure for HIV/AIDS. Wouldn't that be something? If you agree, then join World Community Grid now and download a simple, free tool that lets you and your computer do your share in helping humanity. After all, you are part of it, so why not take part in it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by jaywill, posted 12-17-2005 6:45 AM jaywill has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 48 by jaywill, posted 12-17-2005 12:35 PM Parasomnium has replied

  
jaywill
Member (Idle past 1941 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 48 of 80 (270332)
12-17-2005 12:35 PM
Reply to: Message 47 by Parasomnium
12-17-2005 12:11 PM


Re: A New Start.
Parasomniun,
Well, although this seems to be the "Bible Study" section, for your sake I'll soft peddle interpretation and perhaps have a science or simply liturary question or two for you.
A liturary question about this:
"To the woman He said,
I will greatly multiply your pain in your childbearing;
In pain you will bring forth children. "
Well, one thing strikes me as very curious about Genesis 3. If it was written by a male it seems terribly interesting that he would include a discription of the "crisis" of feminine child birth. I mean, your typical male chauvinist shouldn't have cared to mention this among basic universal things.
Now this is a writing about basic things of human existence. The specific space given to the trauma of pregnancy makes me think the mind behind the writing was very sensative to feminine childbearing matters to include its mention among the genesis of human experiences.
What do you think?
This message has been edited by jaywill, 12-17-2005 12:36 PM
This message has been edited by jaywill, 12-17-2005 12:37 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by Parasomnium, posted 12-17-2005 12:11 PM Parasomnium has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 49 by Yaro, posted 12-17-2005 1:35 PM jaywill has replied
 Message 56 by Parasomnium, posted 12-19-2005 2:52 AM jaywill has not replied
 Message 63 by macaroniandcheese, posted 12-19-2005 10:40 AM jaywill has replied

  
Yaro
Member (Idle past 6496 days)
Posts: 1797
Joined: 07-12-2003


Message 49 of 80 (270339)
12-17-2005 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 48 by jaywill
12-17-2005 12:35 PM


Re: A New Start.
You didn't quote the whole verse:
quote:
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
Sounds' pretty chauvinist to me:
"Honey, you have to obey me! It's part of gods punishment. That's why it hurts so much when you have kids, duh. Get me a beer."
This message has been edited by Yaro, 12-17-2005 01:36 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by jaywill, posted 12-17-2005 12:35 PM jaywill has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by jaywill, posted 12-17-2005 1:58 PM Yaro has not replied
 Message 52 by purpledawn, posted 12-17-2005 6:19 PM Yaro has not replied

  
jaywill
Member (Idle past 1941 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 50 of 80 (270346)
12-17-2005 1:58 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by Yaro
12-17-2005 1:35 PM


Re: A New Start.
You didn't quote the whole verse:
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
AAAAh! You caught me!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by Yaro, posted 12-17-2005 1:35 PM Yaro has not replied

  
Parasomnium
Member
Posts: 2224
Joined: 07-15-2003


Message 51 of 80 (270382)
12-17-2005 6:03 PM
Reply to: Message 45 by robinrohan
12-16-2005 7:42 PM


Re: Hey, Parasomnium
Mrs. Rohan writes:
"That's your Dutch friend?!"
Not to worry Mrs. Rohan, don’t let my avatar fool you. In reality I’m a stunning beauty.
Robin writes:
She wants to know what you think of Andre Rieu (spelling probably wrong).
It’s “André Rieu”, you only omitted an accent. I don’t care very much for his music, I prefer my classical music unpopularized. But lots of people quite enjoy it the way he brings it. So I think it doesn’t hurt to go and listen to him at the fair.

Did you know that most of the time your computer is doing nothing? What if you could make it do something really useful? Like helping scientists understand diseases? Your computer could even be instrumental in finding a cure for HIV/AIDS. Wouldn't that be something? If you agree, then join World Community Grid now and download a simple, free tool that lets you and your computer do your share in helping humanity. After all, you are part of it, so why not take part in it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 45 by robinrohan, posted 12-16-2005 7:42 PM robinrohan has not replied

  
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3457 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 52 of 80 (270385)
12-17-2005 6:19 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by Yaro
12-17-2005 1:35 PM


Eve and Descendants
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
If you notice, God didn't pass the judgment on to her descendants.
I feel that God is very precise in what is to be passed down through the ages.
IMO, this was Eve's punishment, not women in general.

There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton

This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by Yaro, posted 12-17-2005 1:35 PM Yaro has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by jaywill, posted 12-18-2005 9:27 PM purpledawn has replied

  
jaywill
Member (Idle past 1941 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 53 of 80 (270636)
12-18-2005 9:27 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by purpledawn
12-17-2005 6:19 PM


Re: Eve and Descendants
One the things that has always fascinated me about the Bible is that there is something in it for everyone to not like.
I think the person does not exist on earth who likes everything written in the Bible without one exception.
That goes for rich or poor, male or female, Jew or Gentile, east or west, black or white.
Somewhere in the Bible there's a passage somebody wishes was not there.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by purpledawn, posted 12-17-2005 6:19 PM purpledawn has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by Nighttrain, posted 12-18-2005 10:10 PM jaywill has replied
 Message 57 by purpledawn, posted 12-19-2005 4:01 AM jaywill has not replied

  
Nighttrain
Member (Idle past 3993 days)
Posts: 1512
From: brisbane,australia
Joined: 06-08-2004


Message 54 of 80 (270642)
12-18-2005 10:10 PM
Reply to: Message 53 by jaywill
12-18-2005 9:27 PM


Re: Eve and Descendants
Somewhere in the Bible there's a passage somebody wishes was not there.
Yep, like the passage between 'In the beginning God'---through to ---'Be with you all.Amen'

This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by jaywill, posted 12-18-2005 9:27 PM jaywill has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 55 by jaywill, posted 12-19-2005 1:56 AM Nighttrain has replied

  
jaywill
Member (Idle past 1941 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 55 of 80 (270670)
12-19-2005 1:56 AM
Reply to: Message 54 by Nighttrain
12-18-2005 10:10 PM


Re: Eve and Descendants
Yep, like the passage between 'In the beginning God'---through to ---'Be with you all.Amen'
Yep, and there's those types too, who can read 66 books of the Bible and see nothing worthwhile.
" ... yet to those who are defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure..."
This message has been edited by jaywill, 12-19-2005 02:08 AM
This message has been edited by jaywill, 12-19-2005 02:08 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by Nighttrain, posted 12-18-2005 10:10 PM Nighttrain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 58 by Nighttrain, posted 12-19-2005 5:23 AM jaywill has replied

  
Parasomnium
Member
Posts: 2224
Joined: 07-15-2003


Message 56 of 80 (270675)
12-19-2005 2:52 AM
Reply to: Message 48 by jaywill
12-17-2005 12:35 PM


Childbirth
jaywill writes:
Well, one thing strikes me as very curious about Genesis 3. If it was written by a male it seems terribly interesting that he would include a discription of the "crisis" of feminine child birth. I mean, your typical male chauvinist shouldn't have cared to mention this among basic universal things.
Why is that so special? Can’t a male feel empathy? If a man loves his wife and sees her in pain during labour, then why shouldn’t he feel sorry for her? Maybe not every man is a “typical male chauvinist”.
Now this is a writing about basic things of human existence. The specific space given to the trauma of pregnancy makes me think the mind behind the writing was very sensative to feminine childbearing matters to include its mention among the genesis of human experiences.
It should be obvious to anyone who has seen a woman in labour, that the pain that comes with it cannot be a very nice experience. I don’t think it’s beyond a male writer’s comprehension that a description of giving birth should include mention of the accompanying pain a woman suffers.
To me, what strikes you in the text you quoted isn’t that profound at all. Now, if the pain wasn’t mentioned, that would raise some eyebrows.

Did you know that most of the time your computer is doing nothing? What if you could make it do something really useful? Like helping scientists understand diseases? Your computer could even be instrumental in finding a cure for HIV/AIDS. Wouldn't that be something? If you agree, then join World Community Grid now and download a simple, free tool that lets you and your computer do your share in helping humanity. After all, you are part of it, so why not take part in it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by jaywill, posted 12-17-2005 12:35 PM jaywill has not replied

  
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3457 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 57 of 80 (270676)
12-19-2005 4:01 AM
Reply to: Message 53 by jaywill
12-18-2005 9:27 PM


Re: Eve and Descendants
quote:
Somewhere in the Bible there's a passage somebody wishes was not there.
And then there are those who don't like what the Bible actually says.
If one truly believes that the A&E story is an historical account, then one should believe what is actually written.
Not all women have major pain when it comes to childbirth.
If you notice it says greatly multiply, which to me says it wasn't considered to be totally painless to begin with, but pain of a lesser degree. Can't multiply what isn't there.

There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton

This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by jaywill, posted 12-18-2005 9:27 PM jaywill has not replied

  
Nighttrain
Member (Idle past 3993 days)
Posts: 1512
From: brisbane,australia
Joined: 06-08-2004


Message 58 of 80 (270683)
12-19-2005 5:23 AM
Reply to: Message 55 by jaywill
12-19-2005 1:56 AM


Re: Eve and Descendants
Yep, and there's those types too, who can read 66 books of the Bible and see nothing worthwhile.
" ... yet to those who are defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure..."
But then who says the 66 books selected were autographs?
"A fool and his money are soon parted"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 55 by jaywill, posted 12-19-2005 1:56 AM jaywill has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 59 by jaywill, posted 12-19-2005 8:34 AM Nighttrain has replied

  
jaywill
Member (Idle past 1941 days)
Posts: 4519
From: VA USA
Joined: 12-05-2005


Message 59 of 80 (270695)
12-19-2005 8:34 AM
Reply to: Message 58 by Nighttrain
12-19-2005 5:23 AM


Re: Eve and Descendants
Nighttrain,
"A fool and his money are soon parted"
I like that. Where did you read it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by Nighttrain, posted 12-19-2005 5:23 AM Nighttrain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by Nighttrain, posted 12-19-2005 9:48 PM jaywill has replied

  
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 60 of 80 (270714)
12-19-2005 10:26 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Ben!
10-22-2005 2:54 PM


Re: The A&E Parable in a nutshell
why would he have created something similar to him except that he was lonely? he was so lonely, he was talking to himself. very bad sign. do you think he had a wolsin?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Ben!, posted 10-22-2005 2:54 PM Ben! has not replied

  
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