Belief Statement - jar

The point is, if you do X and Y is a result of X then you do not need to do Y. Thus there is only one command.It isn't difficult Jim. If you automatically love God when you love your neighbour and do what is right then the command to love god is redundant.All you need say is love your neighbour as you love yourself, thus no command to love God is necessary.Are you getting the logic here, or am I not explaining the logic properly?Once we sort out the logic 'problem' we can move on to a few other problems in logic I believe your stance throws up.Brian.

Phat, Brian is correct. But there's no reason why you have to call yourself a Christian. You can be something else.If you want to be reasonable, I suggest nihilism.Just a suggestion.

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"Your friends, if they can, may bury you with some distinction, and set up a monument, to let posterity see that your dust lies under such a stone; and when that is done, all is done. Your place is filled up by another, the world is just in the same state it was, you are blotted out of its sight, and as much forgotten by the world as if you had never belonged to it."--William Law

Take too long to type up, and it would be too boring to read.Brian.

Well, since I disagree with your analysis, I don't really see any point to continuing. I see the Primary commandment as Love GOD. The others are explanations of how one does that.It isn't hard to understand Brian, Love GOD, love others as you love yourself.It really is as simple as that.If you wish to believe that you are not saved, then that is fine. However, I believe that after you die you will be judged, not on some profession of belief, but rather on the life you lived.This is a belief statement Brian, what I believe. It is not a sermon, not an Epistle, not a gospel, just a statement of what I believe.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Following is what we are commanded to do. We forget sometimes and stray. That is where grace comes in.

From "Julius Caeser" (Shakespeare) Often quoted, the meaning should be clear.

Huh, isn't that pretty much what I said? I said, No, {being nice was not the only requirement}, but then went on to say {in the "but" part) that it is important, based on Matther 25. You chose to ignore the "NO" that started the sentence. Please pay attention.My exact quote:

More arrogance. But of course everyone thinks they do that already. The fact that what I think it says does not agree with what you think it says does not mean that you are reading as a whole and I am not. It means we have different criteria for interpretation. I don't see the Bible as a set of propositional truths. I see it as a series of stories that reveal truth. There is a difference. It is a different philosophy of interpretation. It happens.

I think that witching hour would be an act of kindness before your belief thread gets butchered any more! AbE AdminJar:No need Phat. Let folk say what they want.Edited by AdminJar, : reopen thread to allow the last few comments from others

Loving God and Neighbor is important. However what I've never understood about Jar on salvation is how he can claim Christianity's salvation all the while rejecting the emphatic words of Jesus himself, the Christ of Christianity and his desciples regarding the need of Christ in salvation. For example, I assume that by most of what I've read on Jar on salvation that he rejects most of the NT scriptures noted here:Page not found – The Jesus Site

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW

Most of those are but cherrypicking buz, quote mining and taken out of context. Let me try yet again to explain my belief.I read those in context, and within the context of the rest of the Bible. IMHO the Bible, reason, logic and my whole idea of GOD says that there is no need to believe in, know, acknowledge or even believe in GOD to be saved.GOD will judge us on what we do in life.AbE:Buz, that really is a big difference in our respective points of view but we have little time remaining. If you would like to discuss it in greater deatail, maybe a thread just on that would be a good idea.Edited by jar, : add suggestion for new thread

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

1. But your problem is that the context of which these verses come from all support them as stated for what they appear to say.2. I don't think a thread is warranted. I know your usual responses but they never answer this problem of what to do with the words and clear teachings of Jesus and his apostles on the doctrine of salvation. So far as I have observed you simply sweep them under the proverbial rug or pass them off as metaphoric myth. I'm not sure that this treatment of the words of the Christ himself of Christianity and his apostles will suffice for anyone in the judgment. As in the OT, some sacrificial atonement was required for the atonement of the sins of mankind (i.e. salvation) and an aknowledgement and applications of that atonement required by the people who desired it.3. The clear doctinal teaching of the role of works in the NT is that the works are the product of the new life in Christ via the Holy Spirit which is the spirit of Jesus Christ when we receive him as lord and savior of our lives. For example, "If any man be in Christ he is a new creature. Old things are past away and see, all things are become new." I Corinthians 5:17 Our love of God and how we treat others is all enhanced by this salvation experience of receiving the spirit of Christ into our being.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW

Okay, so you don't want to discuss it. That's fine with me as well.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Then it would behove somebody on the "fundamentalist" side to discuss those words.

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I still kinda wondering if we agree or not, or if I'm just nit-picking.If I take the above quote literally then it means that if I spend 10 hours a week doing volunteer work for others and donate 15% of my income to charity I'm more likely to wind up with salvation than someone who spends 5 hours a week and donates 8%. What is the cut-off? (3.7 hours and 6.27% maybe) I think that we can also safely assume that some people perform good works because they like being told what wonderful people they are, while others serve anonymously. Are their deeds judged equally? I would just contend that we are judged on the condition of our heart, and not our deeds or our understanding of doctrine.

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Everybody is entitled to my opinion.