Bible Question: What was the First Sin?

Rom 5:12-13
Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned”
NIVAfter referencing the Greek and Aramaic text, it implies the meaning of "sin entered through one OF mankind." just as it means "and in this way death came to all men (as of human kind)".The first sin was a human sin.1 Tim 2:13-14
For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.
NIVGen 3:1111 And he said, "Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?"
NIVThey knew not to, and God told them before they ate and further reminded them that they weren't supposed to. They knew better. Whether they knew what the word SIN meant, they outright disobeyed God. It's not about what THEY knew, it's what God said! He commanded them not to, and they still did, they went "against a commandment given by God"

Jar,Until you start showing me evidence of your claims - evidence in THE BIBLE, as fit with this scenario (since it's a BIBLICAL argument) i'm afraid your claims and rejects are empty.My IDEA in the last half of that post was something really quick. something i felt like doing in spirit of what you guys have been doing in this thread, you build on what you THINK COULD have happened and then go from there. But once again, you do not give me any evidence of your claims.By the way, there's no implication of the Concept of Original Sin in my posts. that concept is pure falsehood in the first place. Psalms, James, Romans and Ezekiel tell you that sin is not hereditary, each man is responsible for his own actions. Sin can't be passed, it's not hereditary, but it came from human kind.Edited by Mikael Fivel, : No reason given.

LOLI base it on what is actually in the Bible.The FACTs is that it is called the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, that until they ate from the tree they had no way to know right from wrong.Your quotations from the New Testament also simply do not stand up to testing. When you follow the allegations back to the Genesis Garden of Eden story, there is no Fall, no Original Sin.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Fair enough, though Romans, Greeks and Aramaniacs don't have any relevance to this discussion. So you keep saying, but you still haven't addressed the question: How could they possibly "know" before they had the "knowledge"? If "they knew not to", as you claim, the whole Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil is meaningless. Again, how could they "know better" before they "knew"? And they had no way of knowing whether that was good or evil. What God said is irrelevant. Adam and Eve had no way of knowing that they were supposed to "obey" God. They had no idea what "obedience" was. And they can't be held responsible for that because they didn't know it was "wrong".Really, what possible significance can the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil have, if Adam and Eve were expected to have the knowledge of good and evil already?

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Gen 3:1111 And he said, "Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?"
NIVDid you miss this? I posted this before, too! By the way, if you're told not to, and you do, its going against what you were told. Once again, read!Jar, i hope you read that. They could easily know not to eat the fruit, GOD SAID IT TWICE. Before and after!Whether or not you "know" (which is an extremely loose and flexible term) not to, if you're told not to, DON'T DO IT! It doesn't matter what the consequence was, they still sinned, otherwise God would not have kicked them out of the garden!Edited by Mikael Fivel, : No reason given.

That simply supports the point. They knew they were naked. God is surprised that they know they are naked, and that tells God that they NOW knew right from wrong.This simply reinforces the point that until they ate from the Tree of Knowledge they had no way to know that they should or should not obey God.It really is that simple.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Your own music-teacher anecdote refutes your argument.The initial assessment had nothing to do with your final grade, did it? You didn't pass or fail the class based on that initial assessment, did you? Why not? Because your teacher knew that you didn't know the material yet.If that test had any relevance to God's "test" at all, then God's "test" would have had no bearing on Adam and Eve's pass/failure - i.e. no bearing on sin.

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Yeah, it is simple. God didn't want them to touch the tree, otherwise he would have said "you can eat of all of the trees in the garden"."This simply reinforces the point that until they ate from the Tree of Knowledge they had no way to know that they should or should not obey God."If you're told not to do something, DON'T DO IT! you don't need to "know" anything. My parents told me not to touch the burner when i was 3 years old, i listened. I didn't need to "know" anything else (i didn't need to know it was hot, or that i would hurt). Call it what you will, it's obedience vs. disobedience.

But if you tell a three year old not to do something, and they forget and do it, you do not punish them.You comfort them because they are simply too young to know right from wrong.Adam and Eve in the fable are not even at three year old level. They simply did NOT know right from wrong.To support YOUR position you need to show how they could know right from wrong before they ate the fruit that taught them right from wrong.Good luck.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

"Your own music-teacher anecdote refutes your argument.The initial assessment had nothing to do with your final grade, did it? You didn't pass or fail the class based on that initial assessment, did you? Why not? Because your teacher knew that you didn't know the material yet.If that test had any relevance to God's "test" at all, then God's "test" would have had no bearing on Adam and Eve's pass/failure - i.e. no bearing on sin."No, trust me it doesn't. The point of it was for him to figure out what we were capable of. Just like this situation, it was a Positive yeild.If adam and eve hadn't sinned in the first place, Jesus wouldn't have had to come and die for the sins of mankind. Jesus wouldn't have also stated over and over that sin entered the world through mankind, and that he would be the source of redemption FROM SIN.

"But if you tell a three year old not to do something, and they forget and do it, you do not punish them.You comfort them because they are simply too young to know right from wrong.Adam and Eve in the fable are not even at three year old level. They simply did NOT know right from wrong.To support YOUR position you need to show how they could know right from wrong before they ate the fruit that taught them right from wrong.Good luck."Not at all, i imagine God could have told them "you will never see heaven, you and all of human kind are doomed, i hate you and your human race will burn in hell" - so comparatively, i'd say there was some comforting - God made the clothes for them before he shut the Garden. They simply weren't allowed back in for sinning. and once again, you don't need to know ANYTHING if you're told NOT to do something.and to support YOUR position, you need to give me SCRIPTURE that says adam and eve didn't know better and that they didn't commit the first sin.Good luck on that.

The scripture is that the tree was called the Knowledge of Good and Evil.I need no more than that and reason and logic.If you don't know right from wrong you don't know you should obey.Sorry, but thems the facts.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

So he didn't know what A&E would do?

And he wouldn't have punished you for something you were not capable of, would he?He assessed you so that he knew what to teach you. After he had done all he could to teach you, if you still hadn't learned, you would fail the class.Similarly, God wouldn't punish Adam and Eve before He tried to teach them. In their case, eating the fruit was the teaching. There was no possible way that they could fail before the lesson began. Jesus is irrelevant to this discussion.

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Mikael Fivel, Why would the creator have to figure out what His creation was capable of?You keep talking about a test I haven't been able to find that yet, I need directions.I did find:

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"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."