Origin of Gods word

The lunar cycle covers about 29.54 days. Divide that by four and you get a period of 7.38 days. Rounding numbers to the nearest comfortable unit is something we do all the time. We, like the ancients, are willing to swap complexity for simplicity.We often base our calculations on a thirty (30) day month, even though we know that there are only four such months in our year.We say there are 365 days in a year, even though we know that the year is actually longer than that.We say there are 52 weeks in a year but when we multiply 7 by 52 we come up short. Inaccurate! But would you call our number choices 'arbitrary'?Detailed technical descriptions and discussions are confusing and boring to most people. Most of the time we'd rather think in round numbers. Who, after all, is likely to remember that the lunar cycle actually lasts 29.538 earth days? Or, 29.455 sidereal days? Who cares? Thirty days is close enough. And for most people's purposes, seven day weeks are close enough as well.Would you call our conventions arbitrary? If you are saying that the seven day week was an arbitrary choice, then I believe you should reconsider.db

I thought we were talking about development of the lunar calendar and it's relation to the seven day week. I cannot give substantial rebuttal to an unsubstantiated assertion. What makes you think the Aztek did no sailing? And what makes you think they developed their calendar independently of any seafaring society? In that case all you need do is scratch lines on the wall of your cave. That is one hypothesis. There's a lot more to a calendar than scratches on a stick (or piece of horn, actually).db

I was talking about the invention of timekeeping. Because they lived in the mountains and built no boats?

They ended up building an empire based on an area in the mountains, but little is known about their origins. It seems they originated in Northwestern Mexico and were a nomad people (see this PBS article for example) who eventually settled in Tenochtitlan - where modern day Mexico city is - and surrounding areas.Given the cultutal level of the civilisations they were surrounded by and eventually conquered I would suggest the origins of their calender and/or timekeeping long predates when they settled in the middle of Mexico. Maybe they just nicked it from someone they encountered in their ancient history.Who knows where they derived these things from - I'm just saying the mountains bit may be a red herring.

I know I owe many replies and I will get back to them later. Possibly tomorrow. I must mention this however that the calender's were created because farmers wanted to know when harvest time was.

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-porcelain

removed by author.This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 10-08-2004 07:54 PM

Harvest time is when the crop is ready. If you study the calendar of old Israel you may notice that the timing of various festivals is fixed; linked to sun and moon signs throughout the year; with the exceptin of harvest festival. The harvest festival begins after the harvest, rather than on any specific date. The timing depends on the harvest itself: the time when grains, grapes, etc. are ready to pick.It is impossible to accurately and consistently predict harvest time, no matter what calendar you use. Oh sure, there is a window of expectation; a range of dates in which harvest is likely to occur; but the calendar can't tell you when to pick cotton. Only the cotton can tell you that. Passover, on the other hand, begins with the first full moon following spring equinox, because that is the traditional date of the Exodus. It would be more accurate to suppose that the calendar was invented to predict Passover. (Not that I believe such a thing)db Edited for factual content.This message has been edited by doctrbill, 10-09-2004 09:27 AM

But the calendar can help tell when to plant.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Crop success depends on a number of factors including the duration of daylight. In that respect the calendar is immensely useful. Success may also require a frost-free environment. In this case, the calendars of years past may be consulted for information about frost history. If one's crop would be damaged by frost, one may choose to plant after the latest known date when frost has occurred in the past. So, Yes. The calendar is useful in determining when to plant.db

So, for building a calendar of any kind is there anything available to early man that is better or more uniformly available than the moon?

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

You mean apart from that big yellow ball of fire in the sky ? Edited to change orange to yellowThis message has been edited by MangyTiger, 10-08-2004 10:58 PM

The sun is available to everyone as well, unless you live in London, or Seattle. Seriously though, it's easier to create a lunar calendar than it is to make a solar one. Even so, the lunar calendar must be adjusted by checking it against the equinoxes and solstices. A purely solar calendar, such as the one invented by ancient Egyptians, is much more accurate, requiring very little adjustment by comparison.The most interesting thing about the Egyptian calendar, as it relates to this discussion, is that it had 12 months of equal length, divided into three 'weeks' of 10 days each. That seems pretty clever to me. They always knew how many days there are in month. No need to for grown men to incant nursery rhymes ... db

The ball of fire in the sky is okay but it offers little change other than precedence. That is great for a long term basis but it is something that doesn't come into play until you are settled in one place (agriculture) for a long period.The moon has an advantage because it is a shorter gross cycle, more obvious variation and still incorporates the longer term precedence cycles. Once a lunar cycle is determined, then all of the other supporting features will jump to the forefront as supporting evidence. There are the tides, menstrual cycles, weather prediction and harvest. Over time these all lead to fertility and likely religion.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

quote:

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The most interesting thing about the Egyptian calendar, as it relates to this discussion, is that it had 12 months of equal length, divided into three 'weeks' of 10 days each. That seems pretty clever to me. They always knew how many days there are in month. No need to for grown men to incant nursery rhymes ...

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Really ? I didn't know that. But if the year is 360 days long doesn't that mean the months 'moved' through the year - so you couldn't decide (say) when to plant based on it being the first of the third month or whatever ?A year is how long it takes the Earth to complete one orbit of the Sun (i.e. to return to the same position relative to the Sun it was in when you started measuring the year). This takes near enough 365 days - but if you define a year as 360 days then when your calendar year ends Earth is 5 days away from completing the orbit. After six years you would have slipped a month - after 36 years the month that had been the height of Summer would now be the depth of Winter.Or am I being dense - it is well past bedtime over here.Just thought - did they have a five day holiday at Christmas

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Confused ? You will be...

Hi Mangey Tiger,Thanks for your response.Indeed, even that clever scheme left a few days at the end. This was for them a sort of 'dead week.' Like at college, before final exams. You know?We might think of it as a Federal Holiday Week.dbPS. Get some sleep.