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Author | Topic: The Dead Sea Scrolls | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Specter Inactive Member |
Arachnophilia writes:
Wait a minute...are you telling me that this is an imperfect version of the Hebrew Bible with modifications? I need to find a good Bible somewhere. And someone take that feuding naked boy off my back!
it's also fairly faithful to the dead sea scrolls, and the septuagint, with only slight modifications.
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ramoss Member (Idle past 634 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
YOu won't find one. Period. However, the DDS does show up the flaws in even the best copying. It also shows on how texts not only get dropped, but other texts get added over time.
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AdminJar Inactive Member |
spector writes: And someone take that feuding naked boy off my back! Last straw. You are suspended indefinitely. You can be reinstated by emailing one of the Administrators and convincing them you understand and can follow the guidelines. New Members should start HERE to get an understanding of what makes great posts.
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ConsequentAtheist Member (Idle past 6260 days) Posts: 392 Joined: |
quote:How, precisely?
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arachnophilia Member (Idle past 1365 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: |
sorry to hear about the ban. i'll reply anyways, in case you're still reading.
Wait a minute...are you telling me that this is an imperfect version of the Hebrew Bible with modifications? they all are. you have one of two choices:1. a version from the earlier septuagint. basically a translation of a translation. 2. a version from the later masoretic. since the two don't differ all that much, i tend to go with the one that's still in hebrew. so do most translators. the kjv is from the masoretic, for instance. usually, they take the septuagint into account, however, and footnote the differences. my printed JPS does this.
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ramoss Member (Idle past 634 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
Well, for example, they managed to restore many lost passages. There was one psalm that every verse started with a different letter of the alphabet. The DDS was able to recover about 4 or 5 verses that were lost.
Then, in the story of Samson and Golliath, the height of Golliath was 4 cubits (about 6'4", which was plenty tall when the average height was 5'2"). The new texts had that at 6 cubits (over 9 feet). Even though the texts that were there recovered I think about 10 percent of passages we didn't have any longer, the books recovered were 15% smaller than their modern equivalents.
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ConsequentAtheist Member (Idle past 6260 days) Posts: 392 Joined: |
quote:The problem, of course, is that you have zero basis for asserting one or the other as flawed, or for claiming which version was 'original'. It is comforting to suggest that the larger value was an unfortunate embellishment of an earlier and more believable text. One can, perhaps, more reasonably argue that a new oral/written tradition sought to render an old story less preposterous.quote:... Then, in the story of Samson and Golliath, the height of Golliath was 4 cubits (about 6'4", which was plenty tall when the average height was 5'2"). The new texts had that at 6 cubits (over 9 feet).
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ramoss Member (Idle past 634 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
The basis for saying the 6 cubits is an embelshment is that the DDS version is a couple of centuries older. It is an assumption, but does show that there ARE the variatons.. which is the point.
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loko  Inactive Member |
If anybody is a follower of Yeshua the Most High God, i suggest him to read the dead sea scrolls.
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Brian Member (Idle past 4981 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
If anybody is a follower of Yeshua the Most High God, i suggest him to read the dead sea scrolls. Why? The DDS only contain Old Testament writings, nothing to do with Jesus. Also, don't you find it upsetting that some of the scrolls were written during and after the time Jesus walked the earth, yet nothing at Qumran even hints at Jesus being anything special. Oh, finally, when you say "The Most High God", are you claiming that to be a polytheist? Cheers. Brian.
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loko  Inactive Member |
the dead sea scrolls explain what this reality is all about, the church has obscured many things that our ancients knew well. There is a fight between light and darkness inside of us.
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CK Member (Idle past 4149 days) Posts: 3221 Joined: |
What specifically in the DDS suggest that?
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loko  Inactive Member |
13) For the man of understanding, that he may instruct and teach all the sons of light concerning the nature of all the sons of men: (14) all the spirits which they possess, with their distinctive characters; their works, with their classes; and the Visitation in which they are smitten, together with (15) the times when they are blessed.
Prologue: God and Creation From the God of Knowledge comes all that is and shall be, and before (beings) were, He established all their design. (16) And when they are, they fulfil their task according to their statutes, in accordance with His glorious design, changing nothing within it. In His hand (17) are the laws of all (beings) and He upholds them in all their needs. It is He who made man that he might rule (18) over the earth. And He allotted unto man two Spirits that he should walk in them until the time of His Visitation; they are the Spirits (19) of truth and perversity. ORIGIN OF THE SPIRITS OF TRUTH AND PERVERSITY The ORIGIN of Truth is in a fountain of light, and the ORIGIN of Perversity is from a fountain of darkness. (20) Dominion over all the sons or righteousness is in the hand of the Prince of light; they walk in the ways of light [+I]. All dominion over the sons of perversity is in the hand of the Angel of (21) darkness; they walk in the ways of darkness [-I]. And because of the Angel of darkness (22) all the sons or righteousness go astray; and all their sin and iniquities and faults, and all the rebellion of their deeds, are because of his dominion, (23) according to the Mysteries of God until the end appointed by Him. And all the blows that smite them, (and) all the times of their distress, are because of the dominion of his malevolence. (24) And all the spirits of his lot cause the sons of light to stumble [-J]; but the God of Israel and His Angel of truth succour all (25) the sons of light [+J]. Truly, the Spirits of light and darkness were made by Him; upon these (spirits) He has founded every work, (26) upon their [counsels] every service, and upon their ways [every Visit]ation. The one, God loves [IV] (1) everlastingly, and delights in all his deeds for ever, but the counsel of the other He loathes, and He hates all his ways for every) And these are the ways of these (Spirits) in the world. It is to enlighten the heart of man, and to level before him the ways of true righteousness, and to set fear in his heart of the judgment (3) of God. And (to it belong) the spirit of humility and forbearance, of abundant mercy and eternal goodness, of understanding and intelligence, and almighty wisdom with faith in all (4) the works of God and trust in His abundant grace, and the spirit of knowledge in every design and zeal for just ordinances, and holy resolution (5) with firm inclination and abundant affection towards all the sons of truth, and glorious purification from hatred of all the idols of defilement, and modesty (6) with universal prudence, and discretion concerning the truth of the Mysteries of Knowledge. Such are the counsels of the Spirit to the sons of truth in the world. And as for the Visitation of all who walk in this (Spirit) [+K], it consists of healing (7) and abundance of bliss, with length of days and fruitfulness, and all blessings without end, and eternal joy in perpetual life, and the glorious crown (8) and garment of honour in everlasting light. THE SPIRIT OF PERVERSITY IN HUMAN BEINGS: EFFECTS AND PUNISHMENT (9) But the Spirit of perversity belong cupidity, and slackness in the service of righteousness, impiety and falsehood, pride and haughtiness, falsity and deceit, cruelty (10) and abundant wickedness, impatience and much folly, and burning insolence, (and) abominable deeds committed in the spirit of lust, and the ways of defilement in the service of impurity, (11 ) and a blaspheming tongue, blindness of eye and hardness of ear, stiffness of neck and heaviness of heart causing a man to walk in all the ways of darkness [-K], and malignant cunning. And as for the Visitation (12) of all who walk in this (Spirit) [-K], it consists of an abundance of blows administered by all the Angels of destruction in the everlasting Pit by the furious wrath of the God of vengeance, of unending dread and shame (13) without end, and of the disgrace of destruction by the fire of the regions of darkness. And all their times from age to age are in most sorrowful chagrin and bitterest misfortune, in calamities of darkness till (14) they-are destroyed with none of them surviving or escaping. (15) In These (two Spirits) walk the generations of ail the sons of men, and into their (two) divisions all their hosts are divided from age to age. They walk in their (two) ways; and all the reward (16) of their works is by their (two) classes, according to the share of each, according to whether he has much or little, throughout the ages. For God has allotted these (two Spirits) in equal parts until the (17) final end, and has set between their divisions eternal hatred. An abomination to Truth are the deeds of Perversity, and an abomination to Perversity are all the ways of Truth. And a fighting (18) ardour (sets one against the other) on the subject of all their ordinances, for they walk not together. But in His Mysteries of understanding and in His glorious Wisdom God has set an end for the existence of Perversity; and at the time (19) of the Visitation He will destroy it for ever. Then Truth shall arise in the world for ever; for (the world) has defiled itself in the ways of wickedness by the Spirit of holiness; and He will cause the Spirit of Truth to gush forth upon him like lustral water. All lying abominations shall come to an end, (and) defilement (22) by the Spirit of defilement. The just will comprehend the Knowledge of the Most High, and the perfect of way will have understanding of the wisdom of the sons of Heaven. For God has chosen them for an everlasting Covenant (23) and all the glory of the Man is theirs. Perversity will exist no more: shame upon all the works of deceit!
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ConsequentAtheist Member (Idle past 6260 days) Posts: 392 Joined: |
quote:Quoting, without proper attribution, The Rule of the Community of an obscure sect of 2nd Temple Period Judaism proves only that you are willing to plagiarize.
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Brian Member (Idle past 4981 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
You really should cite your source, it is the polite thing to do.
Cut and paste job
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