The Prophecy of the 70 weeks of Daniel

Is it historical or hysterical, how christianity attaches everything under the sun to a Jewish prophesy, always culminating in itself - with no mention of Danial's immediate kin!?

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No, because it is clear that the last week of Daniel is in the latter time. Notice that Israel never stopped their transgressions when Jesus came.

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Actually they did - observing the command of money changing and single handedly refusing to bow to a roman statue, constituting the greatest defense in all recorded history. Thereafter, the catholic church took on the name of roman, continued with Rome's heresy dacrees, and went on to murder millions of innocent folk. Jesus has turned his face away from this group - and harkened to the God of israel.THOU SHALT NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS - ELSE THE TRUTH WILL NOT SET YOU FREE.

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what does this prophesy have to do with the rise of dominate powers in the world today? The prophesy is told to be fullfilled in the 70 week period. So, the time frame of the prophesy, biblically, is limited strickly to historical biblical claims and fullfilled strickly by historical biblical claims.

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If a prophesy is made to happen by the power of a sword or the rake - it is not prophesy. A prophesy must also be vindicated in OPEN form [as opposed a shrouded one], and ideally occur when it is least plausable - so none can say it was the result of natural forces. A prohesy first applies to its contemporary time, if there is a clear connection with the prophesy with events occuring at that time.The most powerful and greatest prophesy is when a precide date is nominated, as with Joseph predicting the saving and death of two prisoners - at a precise time and day, and the forthcoming 7 years of properity and famine: nowhere was prophesy greater than at this instant. The only time the time factor being nominated is not applicable, is when it is declared by God, which constitutes the greatest prophesies ever made:'KNOW FOR A SURETY THY SEED SHALL BE IN BONDAGE'
[Made upon the Jewish nation - before any Jews existed; thus it is a test unto the nations]And'I will surely return you to your land'
[This occured when it was least possible, and remains the greatest affront to the world today].Not all prophesy is welcomed.

The temple destruction has nothing to do with daniel or the NT: it was first prophesized by King Solomon, who made adequate preps to conceal the Arc in anticipation of it. Danial appeared after the Babylonian destruction of the temple, so this is hardly a prophesy.Nor can it be seen otherwise with the NT being a blatant retrospctive input: that there was an on-going war with Rome, and it had a non-negotiable do or die outcome for Judea, is not exactly prophesy but bordering on the superfluous.There is a downgrading of the meaning of a prophesy here - with no criteria being imposed. The fact is, whatever is alligned with a precedence occurence cannot be deemed prophesy; prophesy is an over-turning of nature. That is why Israel's return is marked by an event which never occured before - the return of a dead/dorment language after 2000 years - the max being 120 years elsewhere, and still not prevailing. A language is a life force of its own - its return, when alligned with an attached paradigm - is outside of a natural occurence. Thus the word 'SURELY' in this prophetic verse of the OT.

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Prophecy: A prediction made by a prophet.

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The next step is to verify the prophecy which means to use real world evidence not mythological evidence to verify it.

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I agree. I nominated two examples. Give some other ones?

Yes, Jesus did exist, he is mentioned in coded form in jewish writings, due to the threatening scenario at the time, but none of the NT claims about Jesus are historical. The pre-islamic arabs also rejected the NT premise. The Josephus passage is not a valid source. There is no prophesy I know of, from the NT, which was ever valided historically. Correct me if this is wrong.

You are confusing historical existence with the claims made in the NT. There was no Jesus - but there was a Joshua Ben Joseph, who had a very small following, namely with the Nasserite and Ebonite Jews - and this was only as a Rabbi. Things became magnified after Paul, and when his doctrine surfaced with the west.Here, 100s of gospel writings popped up - with ever evelated claims, and this belief swept the west like wild fire: they saw not only the OT in their pockets, but also all their previous doctrines used as its sequal. Almost all of the west, and all the nations they conquered, were converted by force. Millions were massacred. For today's hijacked christians, a preferred lie transcends a disdained truth.

I agree the factor of prophesy is not prevalent anymore, and is replaced with science: both sustaining would be contradictory. Just as we could not survive w/o science today - the ancient people could not have survived w/o some means of a supre-natural facility.The error made generally is to tosss science against ancient sciences [like spells, sorcery, etc] - when both these facilities did not exist simultainiously, but they did independently of each other. Because the ancient science is seen as un-scientific today, it is eronously discarded as myth. The fact is, that ancient forms of science were not myth but followed by all groups of humanity, continiously for many 1000s of years; kings and parents bet their lives on this premise - even sacrificing their most cherished off-spring in its readings; this would not be the case if it yielded no results.The ancients were not stupid, but equally intelligent as of humanity today - they had a different vocab and other applicable factors impacting. In the middle-ages, millions [almost half of humanity] perished by the now commonplace set of illneses [flu, etc] - but this was not the case in ancient times. A phase occured where the old science did not apply - new virus' emerged only conquerable by new science; the old deseases would likewise not yield to today's science methods.This is controversial but not dismissable. In the future times, today's science will also become obsolete, because new paradigms would impact - and simultainiously, new facilities will emerge to counter it: else humanity could not have survived. Whether one wants to reject it or not, there are clear indicators our knowledge is proportional to its time comming, and any measure of advanced knowledge can act as a destruction for humanity. Pencilin was discovered by accident - in its most required instant and humanity would not have survived without this accident. The picture of a light clicking on in the mind has much reality: we think it is because of our genius, but it happens whether we want it to or not.

Yet Alex was Macedonian, and he exhibited polar different views from Greek Hellenism. Alex's greatest conquest may not be his wars, but that he pursued and initiated the first translation of the hebrew bible [The Septuagint']. He was assassinated for this, because it caused upheaval with the Hellenist priests, whose esteem greatly fell.Alex's actions caused the world to change to today's modern history: christianity was a direct result of the Septuagint, whereby the Greeks made it part of their own via the NT, when Judea was deemed dead after the Roman war of 70 CE. Some 90% of the NT premises are vested in the Greek religion. Connect the dots, and one Macedonian was the pivotal factor here.

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So you deny the 70 AD historical date. OK. That will requite proof. Got any??

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Titus came from Greece by any standard?? Tell us about it.

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Titus was the son of Vespasian - both rose to divine emperor, following Josephus' oracle prophesizing this. Titus destroted the temple, but failed in wining the surrender of the Judeans or their housing or worshipping roman dieties. Titus' father thus rejected the crown of victory in the celebrations in Rome - acknowledging it a hollow victory.The war between Rome and Judea is perhaps the most pivotal war in human history - two of today's largest religions would not have emerged had this war not occured. Nor would the term Palestine, the Al Aqsa or today's middle-east conflict have occured.

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But sometimes a prophecy contains a prediction, usually a warning of what will happen if you do or don't do a particular thing.

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At all times a prophesy is an offer of a saving exit: do this and be saved; do that and be not saved - else there is no need for it, if it only predicts destruction. On some occasions what is advocated is not liked, and a prophet can be in danger of his life. Isaiah was thus killed by a bad king - after declaring his prophesy, which was a negative command - namely to surrender to babylon. He hid inside a tree and was cut therein. The prophesy came true - Babylon prevailed.Edited by IamJoseph, : No reason given.

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I'm reminded of the Pharasees who faulted Jesus and Lazurus because it was done on the Jewish Sabbath rather than to lend credence to the miracle.

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The Pharisees shone best when they got it right concerning the Sabbath - that was and is their credence, and the non-credibility of those who flaunted this command. The fault was with the gospel writers and those who have no notion of the OT laws, having never observed it, or understood why the sabbath command gets priority over murder, adultry, stealing, etc. The sabbath law, when observed, makes all other crimes far away, and is attached to the first two commands against blasphemy. The factor of honesty [the 3rd command] is the only one which precedes it. Since when is honoring the sabbath a crime - how desperate can the gospels be?How ridiculous of the gospel writers - they never could negate the sabbath, so they replaced it with another day - worshipping the sun, as with the hellenist sun diety. They then went on to commit the greatest crimes in humanity's history - even persecuting those who did not worship in the new sunday. Its beyond obsurd.The 10 Commandments were given on the sabbath. Thus it says, "REMEMBER AND OBSERVE [two commands in one] *THIS DAY*". The 'this day' refers to the day being a sabbath - provable when all the OT calendar dates are calculated. The sabbath marks the ceasation of all creation, and the honoring of the universe's creation, which moves into the sabbathical zone once a week for 24 hours. There is no day which takes precedence of the sabbath. The one day in seven for a rest from all work was introduced by this law, and is alligned with inalienable human rights, appropriate freedom from labor, and that man shall not live by bread alone. IN Dueteronomy, Moses reverses the sabbath message, declaring the sabbath will keep those who keep the sabbath.

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The Book of Isaiah says so (Isaiah 45:1). Do you claim to know better than the Bible ?

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Isaiah does not condone anything in the NT. Isaiah represents Monotheism; the sabbath laws and only the 613 laws of the OT - he castigated any who desecrated the OT laws, and assured the only path was via those laws. One cannot select what they like from a prophetic scripture. Isaiah would never condone the desecration of the sabbath, as per the NT. Its not even an option to think about.

The Macedonians claim an older writing than the greek - which has not been generally acknowledged. The difference between the Macs and the Greeks is that it was a Macedonian who initiated the first translation of the Hebrew bible - a factor which changed history, and ushered in two religions.Today, there is a latent, hovering battle in an under-current, whereby christianity and islam have been claiming ascendence of what was initiated by Alexander - while both these religions cannot seperate themselves from their past, making the OT subservient to their own past beliefs with new names. Alex, and thereby the Macs, were thus different from the greeks: while he esteemed the Jews and was assassinated for it, the Greeks hellenised the OT out of ego. Today's world is the result of Alexander - a Macedonian, without whom there would be no Septuagint, and no NT or Quran. It was a Macedonian, not a Greek, who changed history.

Like Rome, Greece was inclined in conquering nations - including Macedonia. Daniel was exiled in Babylon when Greece conquered Persia, which was soon after Daniel made prophesy. In a sense, such prophesies are of small merit, because it says the obvious: nations will conquer each other. Daniel is one of the smaller prophets, and not in the category of Joseph, Moses, David, Isaiah, Ezekiel, Jeremaya.Daniel's prophesy brilliance is he saw the big picture, and would have said the same of Rome - despite that nation's boasting all roads lead to it. If Daniel was referring to Greece - this was of a transitory super-power with a small life span, and one which was soon conquered by another.Whatever the current political issues with modern greece and a newly assumed Macedonia, the fact is that Alexander was a Macedonian, and his actions of translating the OT is transcendent of any wars between past nations. In a sense, Greece was inclined in negating Alex's actions - but failed in this quest: Monotheism won over Polytheism.Edited by IamJoseph, : No reason given.

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Antiochus DID ban Jewish sacrifices. And Antiochus DID set up what Jews call "the abomination that causes desolation".

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This was also emulated, even more fastediously, by the medevial catholic church.

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None of those happened in the seven years after Jesus died.

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Not so according to history.

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So it's not bunk. It's a fact.

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So it's not bunk. It's a fact.My point is, one must not lift off selectively from Isaiah or history, and derive conclusions that way. While the Persian king Cyrus did save israel by acknowledging this as a legitimate premise, the Greeks did the reverse of the Persians and of Alexander - a Macedonian. But such does not subscribe to a Messiah - not according to the Isaiah criteria, which is where thise premise comes from. Likewise, it cannot vest itself with the NT, which is a greek inclined doctrine, having nothing to do with Isaiah - except via selectivism and distortion of that writing.Isaiah never prophesized a Messiah to be resurrected, but the peoples themselves - in the midst of all humanity, and in open form: last time I checked this never happened. Isaiah predicted a humanity at peace from war. Only the reverse occured. can it be - shock of shocks and blasphemy and heresy notwithstanding - someone was wrong about Isaiah - you think?!