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Author Topic:   Who & what are the demons ?
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 32 of 349 (493753)
01-10-2009 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by ICANT
01-05-2009 6:24 PM


Re: Re Demons
ICant writes:
The evil messengers of the devil. Who was created by God to tempt you and I. So we could make choices in life.
1. Hi brother. I like your responses in this message except for this. If God created the forces of evil to tempt humans, why are Satan and his angels eventually cast into the eternal lake of fire, never ever to re-emerge in order to effect free will/choice for all of the host of the heavens, i.e. God's intelligent creatures existing here and there in the cosmos of the universe.
My thinking is that Satan is not needed to effect free will. Lucifer, the bright and shining angel, whoever he was, evidently once held a high position in God's kingdom but exercised free will to exalt himself in the north parts of the cosmos above Jehovah's throne. No temptation of Satan is cited here and no serpent, etc to tempt Lucifer to rebel against the supreme majesty/designer/creator of the universe, Jehovah.
2. James one verse twelve says that God tempts no man to do evil. So why would he create one to tempt man to do evil?
3. When Jesus was accused of the Jews of being demon possessed, Jesus's response was that a house divided/pitted/engaged against itself would fall. Wouldn't the creation of evil by God go contrary to the kingdom of God, dividing his kingdom against itself?

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by ICANT, posted 01-05-2009 6:24 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 01-10-2009 6:31 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 39 by ICANT, posted 01-11-2009 3:02 AM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 33 of 349 (493758)
01-10-2009 4:33 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by DevilsAdvocate
01-10-2009 3:53 PM


DA writes:
So the Bible's chronicling God commanding the annihilation of the Canaanites including men, women, children, babies, animals as well as pillaging their cities and towns is not destruction? Think again.
hi DA. It was indeed destruction, i.e purging of Jehovah's planet Earth of cultures embedded into demonic pagan doctrines contrary to the welfare of the planet at large.
This action by Jehovah was to establish on planet earth, a messianic kingdom nation which would eventually eliminate all wars and evil regimes on the planet. Thus the re-emergence of the nation of Israel to be consummated at the 2nd advent of Jesus Christ/messiah of planet earth.
Furthermore, this action by Jehovah was specifically designated to one relatively tiny area of real estate on the planet and to a designated nation, the nation of Israel. It was not God's mandate to Dark Age Roman Catholic Popes and Bishops, Islamic Jihadists, German Nazis and Stalinists,etc who took it upon themselves to kill, kill, kill for their own evil regimes and demonic ideologies.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 01-10-2009 3:53 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 35 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 01-10-2009 6:27 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 40 of 349 (493891)
01-11-2009 1:42 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by DevilsAdvocate
01-10-2009 6:27 PM


So evidently as long as the destruction, rape, pillaging, infanticide, slavery, etc is localized to one spot on the globe it is ok for God to do the killing and enslavement but it isn't for anyone else. Oh, and BTW what about the global flood in which everything was destroyed men, women, children, babies, animals, etc. that wasn't localized.
LOL, you will justify anything (not even short of outright homicide) and you say that atheists have moral relativity.
Yes. If Jehovah be god, Jehovah kills. In Luke:12:5 Referring to God, Jesus said, "I will warn you whom you shall fear; fear him who after he has killed, has power to cast into hell, yea, I say unto you; fear him."
Thus the Biblically acclaimed wisest man that ever lived said that the fear of Jehovah is the beginning of wisdom.
Who is the creature who tries to justify the maker/creator/ruler/supreme majesty of the universe who anhilates opposiing cultures and establishes his authority; who destroys those who oppose his supremacy in the universe; rebels, even?
Poor cockroaches in the kitchen; they all had to go in the extermination; the young, the old; poor creatures of nature; the owner of the kitchen dislikes them.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 01-10-2009 6:27 PM DevilsAdvocate has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 41 of 349 (493894)
01-11-2009 2:02 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by ICANT
01-11-2009 3:02 AM


Re: Re Demons
ICANT writes:
If God created the forces of evil to tempt humans, why are Satan and his angels eventually cast into the eternal lake of fire, never ever to re-emerge in order to effect free will/choice for all of the host of the heavens, i.e. God's intelligent creatures existing here and there in the cosmos of the universe.
Thanks for your responses, ICANT, but you failed to specifically address the above.
You and others cite references to God creating evil. You, being apprised on linguistics etc surely are aware that the word evil applies to other than pertaining to Satan, especially in the Hebrew, having relatively few words in the vocabulary.
For example, throughout the Bible, references can be cited which use the word evil as in destructive and injurious pertaining to conflict, etc. God brought/created evil upon Israel when they disobeyed him. Dangerous animals are referred to as evil beasts, etc. In Ecclesiastes 5:14, the writer refers to the fishes taken in an evil net.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by ICANT, posted 01-11-2009 3:02 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by ICANT, posted 01-11-2009 5:25 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 57 of 349 (494550)
01-16-2009 8:24 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by onifre
01-11-2009 10:10 PM


onifre writes:
Do you have any evidence of this happening outside of the Christian bible...?
Hi Onifre.
1. Who else, as writers or historians, would be privy to this event?
2. What significance would this event have to anyone else?
3. What other ancient manuscripts relative to historical events do we have as near to the alleged ancient historical event in question than the NT?

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by onifre, posted 01-11-2009 10:10 PM onifre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 58 by onifre, posted 01-16-2009 8:49 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 59 of 349 (494559)
01-16-2009 9:20 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by onifre
01-16-2009 8:49 PM


onifre writes:
My point exactly. The alleged event took place without any witnesses that wrote any other books about the life of said individual.
The only place it is found is in the questionable books of the NT. This is unsupported mythology as are most other stories of this nature that speak of "demons".
OK, but what evidence do you have relative to my point 3 which you failed to consider? By your allegation that this near to the event historical manuscript is mythology, woudn't that imply that all other (abe: unverified)ancient historical manuscripts further removed from the events claimed are even more likely mythology as well?
Buz Point 3 writes:
. What other ancient manuscripts relative to historical events do we have as near to the alleged ancient historical event in question than the NT?
Edited by Buzsaw, : Addition as noted
Edited by Buzsaw, : No reason given.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by onifre, posted 01-16-2009 8:49 PM onifre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 61 by onifre, posted 01-16-2009 9:58 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
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