Religion v Spirituality

I guess the whole point is to find a common meaning based in common sense and a bit if inspiration. I began with a statement I had read somewhere and thought it would make a good discussion. It certainly has but has gone off at tangents purely due to us being human. Sprituality is seen as voodoo, supernatural, religious doctrine and non-existent.I see spirituality as a transformation of self. Nothing more and nothing less. I have reached this conclusion through my own personal experiences, as does everyone else with theirs'.I believe we have finished our physical evolution, i.e we will remain human beings. However,I believe there is another equally valid evolution occurring right now. I believe the spiritual evolution is the dawning of tranformation. This evolution is taking place within the consciousness and cannot be proved except by the results.

That sounds about right to me. Education (self-education) is transformation of self. I don't think we have gone extinct just yet Yet another post fails to answer "what is spirituality?"

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What if you educated folk are too educated to understand some of us? - Heinrik

But magda, I don't mean a 'world view'. I mean reality which only becomes s reality when experienced. You can have a view but you cannot experience a view.the point about the flat earth was that they had evidence that the ocean fell over the edge, and they could not see land, and believed they were the only inhabitants of the world. This belief affected whole civilizations. It was primitive thinking that caused them to experience something as true that actually was not.Do you imagine we are no longer primitive and we stop here? Strongly held beliefs today can be blown out of the water tomorrow just as they were then. It is in challenging the beliefs we know to be true that will change the world. There is no point in challenging beliefs you believe to be false, is there?My reasoning is to look at the global experiences and find the common denominator that links us all together in a spiritual reality. All I can find is our humanity. Us. Each one of us.

What does education transform you into? And how can education have anything to do with a spiritual transformation, that is not on the curriculum?I'm not speaking of changing what you know. I am speaking of changing who you are.

Says you: provide evidence for your assertion. Without us there is no vaguely defined mumbo jumbo some flakes call spirituality.You appear to have no real reason to believe there is a 'spiritual' existence.Care to provide one?

Cut the martyr talk and respond to post 67.Or don't.

Education changes one into a person who is more aware of and better understands the wonders of our world. Since nobody has explained what "spiritual" is, I take that word to be meaningless. Thus I do not see any real question there - merely words in the syntactic form of a question.Oh, and education can (and should) provide far more than what is on the curriculum. I don't buy into the philosophers' (and theologians') fairy tales, that knowedge is "what you know" (i.e. a bunch of facts). I fully grant that a bunch of facts is not particularly transforming. I see knowledge as structural - part of our makeup - and thus I see education as highly transforming.

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What if you educated folk are too educated to understand some of us? - Heinrik

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But magda, I don't mean a 'world view'. I mean reality which only becomes s reality when experienced.

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Oh, so you mean a reality that doesn't exist.

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You can have a view but you cannot experience a view.

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I'm currently experiencing the view that you are wrong.

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the point about the flat earth was that they had evidence that the ocean fell over the edge, and they could not see land, and believed they were the only inhabitants of the world.

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I would love to see your evidence of the seas falling over the edge of the world, but this whole spiel about reality is irrelevant unless you can demonstrate what connection it has to spirituality.

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It was primitive thinking that caused them to experience something as true that actually was not.

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No, they experienced a spherical Earth. They interpreted that experience as being one of a flat Earth.
Please drop this rubbish about reality. I am sorry I ever asked. It appears to have no relevance whatever to spirituality and unless you can show that it does, I am loathe to continue this off-topic blather.

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It is in challenging the beliefs we know to be true that will change the world. There is no point in challenging beliefs you believe to be false, is there?

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So there is no point challenging fascism, racism or sexism? What codswallop. If you want to challenge an idea that is true, you might start by jumping off a cliff in order to challenge the belief in gravity, but I wouldn't recommend it.

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My reasoning is to look at the global experiences and find the common denominator that links us all together in a spiritual reality. All I can find is our humanity. Us. Each one of us.

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So the common link between humanity is that we are all human? Wow. Thanks for that priceless gem of reasoning. Your waffle is typical of kind of circular, meaningless, self-important, pseudo-profundity that I would expect from a sentence containing the phrase "spiritual reality". This is a perfect example of why I dislike the term. "Spiritual reality" my arse.

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Mutate and Survive

All you are saying here is that people share humanity. what has that go to so with 'spirituallywhichyoustillhavenotdefined'?

That made me smile.

because it means different things to different people. to some, it is a more mystical or sensual version of a normal religion. to some, it's new-age hoodoo.i think it's anything that looks outside the present experience. as far as i'm concerned, any abstract thought might qualify.

Without us there is no consciousness. That is because I haven't given you one.Edited by Heinrik, : No reason given.

You see larni, when you make snide comments and add a few insults, I don't believe you want to know.

It is terribly difficult to bring into one's awareness something that has not been experienced and is already believed to be something else.It requires a shift in perception and yours is a physical world only. I learned everything I needed to know of the physical world and it wasn't enough. There was and is no meaning to our existence.In my endevours to explain a new phylosophy, never once have I included the 'supernatural'. My definition of spirituality is based in the reality we live in now. I would term it 'down to earth' spirituality. However, whilst all the misconceptions you hold on to, for grim death, are actually blocking you from expanding your awareness.

Well thanks for explaining that to me. I understand much more your point of view. Which is......................................????