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Author
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Topic: Omniscience, Omnipotence, the Fall & Logical Contradictions.
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 7 of 354 (354212)
10-04-2006 3:10 PM
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Reply to: Message 6 by ramoss
10-04-2006 2:20 PM
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Hell, he could just show that there is such a thing as 'timeless eternity'. LOL
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 6 by ramoss, posted 10-04-2006 2:20 PM | | ramoss has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 10 by Legend, posted 10-04-2006 4:48 PM | | jar has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: God: Just or Unjust?
Any failure to understand the simplicity of this argument is the result of ignorant thinking. Any failure to understand that your argument is fallacious and circular is the result of plain ignorant thinking. If God knows the outcome it is predestined.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 100 by Christian7, posted 11-02-2006 7:03 PM | | Christian7 has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
asgara writes:
Does your god know all about me before I am even born? Does your god know what I will choose before I choose it? Is your god the sole creator of life? to which iBibleNano replied
quote:
1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. Yes. And you know what this proves, absolutley nothing for your side of the argument. All it proves is how awesome my God is.
It proves that your godlet is a mean, vicious, picayune little bling-bling pimp daddy worthy of no honor or respect.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
Sorry but simply more nonsense. You made a clear statement which I quoted in full in Message 108 for all to read. Your little joke of a godlet creates people solely to be damned. That is not something to be respected or worshiped but an evil little demon. More something to be pitied than awesome. It is sad that so many Christians seem to worship such a pitiful joke and think it is GOD.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
Right. Message 112. That was where you said:
1. God knew that goerge would be an athiest. 2. God wanted to give him a fair chance to accept him, even inspite of his forknowledge of the outcome. 3. Therefore God created him. Now that's a valid syllogism. It's not God's fault the person went to hell. It's there own damn fault. This my friend, is called real logic. I don't know what the hell your using but it isn't logic. Thank you for once again confirming that your godlet is an evil little demon. What a pitiful little godlet you worship. How sad.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
Athiests have to gang up on Christians and convert them to a fallicious mindset in order to assert their own allegedly superior intellect and to confirm their disbelief in the living God. Sorry but I am a Christian. Been one for over 60 years. Built churches, taught Sunday school to both kids and adults. The only difference is that I don't worship that pathetic little thing you call your god. The things that you outlined, that have been quoted in this thread are quite clear. You describe a godlet that creates the vast majority of humans just to be damned. If that is not evil, what would you call it? Edited by jar, : appalin spallin
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
asgara writes: God DID know what the final outcome would be? Did god know that George would die an atheist? to which iBibleNano replied:
quote:
Yes he did.
So iBibleNano pitiful little caricature of a god creates folk knowing before hand that they will be damned to hell. I could understand folk that simply feared such an evil creature, but could anyone love such a demon?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 122 by Christian7, posted 11-04-2006 12:35 AM | | Christian7 has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
Well I am a Christian, been one for long, long time. I do believe in Jesus. It is just your silly little godlet that is unbelievable. And according to Jesus it doesn't matter whether you believe in him or not. It is only little playground bully type imitation gods that get pissed when they dissed. Don't get me wrong. I do not doubt that you too are a Christian. I'm just sorry that you don't have a clue what Christianity is all about or what GOD is like.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
You need to read Matthew 25. Read it slowly about seven times.
You ARE NOT a christian. You do NOT believe in the same Jesus that I believe in. Your Jesus probably didn't die for our sins. My Jesus DID! You are likely right that we have different views of Jesus. The idea of GOD requiring that He become Man and then killed as some sacrifice to GOD is just plain silly. The Great Sacrifice was GOD becoming man, just man, same as you, same as me. Those born die. Sorry, that is a fact of life. Jesus message is that All are born forgiven. None are born with Damned stamped on their foreheads. All men, believers and non-believers alike will be judged, judged based on their lives. You should also reread John 3, because it does not say what you claim. Read it about seven times. I'm sure you are a Christian, I have no reason to doubt that. Hopefully one day you will learn what it is all about.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
Keep reading. The condemnation has to do with behavior. See, that is the problem with so many Christians, they don't read the manual. In addition, in Matthew we see Jesus speaking directly, not some editorial as in John 3. And there is no mention of belief in the story of the sheep and goats. Just the opposite, it implies that it will be the believers who are the GOATS, the Christians, and that the non-followers, the unbelievers that will be the sheep. If you like, I have discussed this at length this thread.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: few questions
Since I don't believe the bible contradicts itself, and since I know what John 3 says, I must conclude that Matthew 25 must be interpreted differently. That's fine. Or, of course, John must conform to Mat 25. After all, In Mat Jesus himself is speaking as opposed to the editorial of John. LOL But I don't worship the Bible. I know that it does say contradictory things. It is the Word of God, inspired, but written, redacted, edited, revised, compiled by men. I don't worship it, and also don't try to make it say things it doesn't. Enjoy your version of the Gospel.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 139 by Christian7, posted 11-04-2006 8:10 PM | | Christian7 has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Freedom of choice or just ignorance.
Whether we can avoid it or not is irrelevant because we do not know our own future. So even though a being knows what we will do, we still have freedom of choice because we are not aware of what choice we will make. If we were to know what that choice would be, and were still unable to change it, then there would be no free will. You are confusing ignorance and choice. If what we will choose is foreknown, then we really have no free will. We may well be ignorant of which choice we will make but that is just ignorance, no more. If God knows what the outcome will be, if knowing that God creates man that will be damned, then that God is nothing but evil.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Let's examine that further.
There is a difference between free will and will power. Will power is how much effort you exert into changing something. Free will is simply the ability to exert will power. You can exert how ever much you like with enough effort. So with sufficient willpower you can change things. That means that it is possible for Man to be more powerful than GOD.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: Let's examine that further.
Did you say:
There is a difference between free will and will power. Will power is how much effort you exert into changing something. Free will is simply the ability to exert will power. You can exert how ever much you like with enough effort.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 164 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: Let's examine that further.
So you said:
There is a difference between free will and will power. Will power is how much effort you exert into changing something. Free will is simply the ability to exert will power. You can exert how ever much you like with enough effort. Specifically you said :
You can exert how ever much you like with enough effort. Then you went on to say:
Yes, but that in no ways implies that our will power is ever sufficient to change that which we cannot change. We can exert however much we like , with enough effort, but it is within the restrictions of choice. Is that correct?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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