Is God determined to allow no proof or evidence of his existence? Part II

I have attempted to read this thread and follow some of the arguments contained therein. I have some concerns:

The thread is too long and long winded! A forum is no place to write a book! Mr. Ex-Nihilio, while I appreciate your right to have a soapbox, and also thoroughly explain yourself, I want you to try and edit your thoughts and main points into more concise, easily readable entries.

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Purpledawn seems able to have smaller posts. Lets keep this topic short and to the point so that people will actually want to read this stuff!

Except for the fact that they don't actually know how this works or even exactly why it's happening for that matter.Like I noted from the article before, when the "primitive" alga is subjected to artificial schedules of alternating light and dark spans of varying length over many days, this single intact cell is somehow able to translate all that manipulation of light and darkness into the measurement of a seven-day week.The best that they can say at this point is that some rhythms rise while others fall -- like a modern dance in which the dancers move seemingly independently of each other.They think that the cells must have actually been carefully choreographed on a biological level throughout natural means. However, the dance is so complex that chronobiologists are admittdely only beginning to understand the interrelationships of the rhythms -- and it may yet remain that there is no residual ancient choreography at all, but a very present choreographer over-seeing the rhythm, the Lord of the Dance himself so to speak.

Mr.Ex, please don't take it personally, it wasn't meant that way.I understand that life gets in the way of internet discussion boards, I've been there myself.I just thought it was funny all the back and forth you did with purpledawn only to end up in the anti-climax of 'it's late and I've got to go'.I should have kept it to myself. Please accept my apologies.P.S Pepe says 'believe or else..'

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"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

*sigh*

meh, no problem.Actually, looking back -- it was kind of funny. Anyway, apparently my posts are either too long, or not clear enough, or else something else I've done wrong.Fuck it.They want to find the answers they can go look for themselves.Take care dude.

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Except for the fact that they don't actually know how this works or even exactly why it's happening for that matter.

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So all you have given me is an unknown, not a verified presence of God.

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"The average man does not know what to do with this life, yet wants another one which lasts forever." --Anatole France

No. I've demonstrated a scientifically verified pattern throughout all life which quite accurately verifies what the Scriptures apparently were saying all along.In science one doesn't validate the existence of something with one test. You gradually build up a case for something with various disciplines to present a unified theory that can be accepted as a whole.The part I mentioned above is the first piece of a greater body of evidence which, when placed together, seems to confirm the existence of the Judeo-Christian God.That's why I was moving onto the next pieces.Apparently, however, my posts are too long -- so I'm debating on whether I should even continue with this. In truth, it seems impossible for me to validate God's existence to you if I'm limited to sound-bites, buzz-words, and other meaningless dribble.
_______________AdminPhat, I don't understand why you gave me that warning.In my opinion it wasn't very cool.The people of this forum are intelligent enough to read things on their own. They're also quite capable of judging for themselves whether or not a post is too long -- and simply decide not to read it if they wish.If you're saying that my posts are long, then I'll agree with you 100%.But if you're saying they're too long, then I'll disagree with you 100% as well.You realize that purpledawn is asking me to scientifically validate the existance of God, correct?After taking a step back and cooling of a little I'll simply admit to you that I don't know how to explain this without going into great detail about it. If you know of a better way to prove that God exists on a purely academic level, then please do so. I'll step back and, if you desire, you can take over this thread for me.This message has been edited by Mr. Ex Nihilo, 10-26-2005 04:12 AM

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No. I've demonstrated a scientifically verified pattern throughout all life which quite accurately verifies what the Scriptures apparently were saying all along.

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I disagree, but continue.

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Apparently, however, my posts are too long -- so I'm debating on whether I should even continue with this. In truth, it seems impossible for me to validate God's existence to you if I'm limited to sound-bites, buzz-words, and other meaningless dribble.

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You aren't limited to soundbites, buzzwords, or meaningless dribble.Since you like to supply a lot of information, here is a tip that may help you.Make your point first. When writing for the newspaper they told us to put the important information first. The reasoning is that your story may get cut short due to limited space in the paper.The same tactic will work well here. Make your point at the beginning then provide the proof. Then restate your conclusion at the end.Get the readers attention so they will want to read the rest of the post.In a medium like this one where people pop in to quickly see what is going on, you may lose their interest if the point of your post doesn't present itself quickly.ABE: Better subtitleThis message has been edited by purpledawn, 10-26-2005 11:01 AM

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"I refuse to think of them as chin hairs. I think of them as stray eyebrows." -Janette Barber-

Basically I dont think its His will to get proved physically. It seems to me He wants us to train up our faith even in His absence and try to reach Him spiritually. Because only when our faith is strong enough we wont be another Adam, and only when our sins are forgiven and removed, we can reach Him physically.

Ok, thank you. I'll do that. Why do you disagree?

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Basically I dont think its His will to get proved physically.

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That is my contention.God does not allow his existence (presence) to be scientifically substantiated today.I haven't found that the scriptures really provide a why though.

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"I refuse to think of them as chin hairs. I think of them as stray eyebrows." -Janette Barber-

Mr. Ex,
In Message 145 you asked why I disagree. I'm attaching the reply to Message 130 because that's where your info was and it makes it easier for me to refer to it.

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No. I've demonstrated a scientifically verified pattern throughout all life which quite accurately verifies what the Scriptures apparently were saying all along.

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You have shown that science has found a seven day rhythm among other rhythms within living things. I don't feel that you have made a true connection between humans using a seven day week and this natural rhythm.You have shown that "weeks" have varied in length among cultures. Did those cultures change the length of their week because of their internal rhythm or because a stronger culture took over?Did having a longer or shorter week adversely affect their physical health?The seven day week is associated with Babylonian Astronomy. The Jews adjusted what the Babylonians started. They just started counting and started over after seven.According to the book by Paul Johnson,"A History of the Jews", the Jews were influenced by Babylonian astronomy. The Jewish calendar was also reformed during the common era. I don't see the relationship between the seven day week and our seven day rhythm other than the number seven.Does the first day of our seven day cycle always start on the first day of the week? If not, then I don't see where one affects the other.

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"I refuse to think of them as chin hairs. I think of them as stray eyebrows." -Janette Barber-

Mr. Ex.I don't think my reply showed up on your topic index.

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"When women are depressed they either eat or go shopping. Men invade another country." -Elayne Boosler-

Actually, I did notice it. I've been trying to reply to it without "overdoing" the text.In general, it seems to me that the seven day rhythm is more than a numerical curousity. The septad rhythm is specifically linked with healing and replenishment, just as the Hebrew Sabbath is associated with the seven day week. Many Rabbi's seem to see it in this light, being linked with healing. And Christ himself seems to see it in this way too.Here's some questions that you asked... The previous cultures apparently patterned their social rhythms mostly after their marketing days -- whereas the Israelites patterned their marketing days around their Sabbath. I'm not sure if we have any demographic information from back then. However, more recent research seems to be thinking that this could be the case.For example, this article here seems to think that during the 24 hour rhythm, there are certain peek peiods when medicine seems to be more effetive.... Daily RhythmsAs similar idea seems to be emerging concerning the daily rhythm as such.... Daily Rhythms TooAs far as the weekly cycle is concerned, apparently specific days seem to be emerging as being ideal for certain things to happen.For example, Wednesday and Saturday are days with highest physiological activity. Thursday and Friday are days with lowest physiological activity. Monday, Tuesday and Sunday are days with medium physiological activity.There are also apparently serious consequences associated with working against one's biological clock, such as accidents, depression, and lack of quality sleep. Blood pressure and allergic reactions differ throughout the day. Heart attacks and strokes are also affected by the biological clock. Timing surgery with the biological clock can prove to be life-saving.I'll look to find more information on this, and then post links so I can verify if this information is accurate.This message has been edited by Mr. Ex Nihilo, 10-29-2005 07:18 PM

I understand the seven day rhythm. I understand that our bodies have highs and lows etc.How would a shorter or longer social week affect the seven day rhythm and a persons health?

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There are also apparently serious consequences associated with working against one's biological clock, such as accidents, depression, and lack of quality sleep. Blood pressure and allergic reactions differ throughout the day. Heart attacks and strokes are also affected by the biological clock. Timing surgery with the biological clock can prove to be life-saving.

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These deal with biological functions.IMO, the social week does not affect biological functions.

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"When women are depressed they either eat or go shopping. Men invade another country." -Elayne Boosler-