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Author Topic:   Charismatic Chaos
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 222 of 531 (869069)
12-22-2019 6:10 PM
Reply to: Message 221 by Tangle
12-22-2019 5:39 PM


True Conversion
Why are there any conversions at all?
So I'll add my view of this to the mix.
Conversion in Christianity is a supernatural thing, not just a choice one makes. The word "conversion" itself implies this, a real change in us. That's what being "born again" or regenerated means.
We need to be converted, actually changed in our nature, in order to be suited to the environment of heaven and God's presence, because of the Fall where we lost our spiritual faculty and our spiritual knowledge and our spiritual connection to God. We became mere "flesh" as a result.
The spirit we had originally must be regenerated in us. "Flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God, neither does corruption inherit incorruption," it says in 1 Cor 15:52. Being sinners from the Fall we inherit corruption through our flesh, and that has to be changed in order to inherit the perfections of the Kingdom of God.
What we get at conversion is called an "earnest" or pledge of the Holy Spirit who will not be given in full until the Rapture, at which time "we shall be changed, in the twinking of an eye, at the last trump..." (1 Cor 15:52).
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 225 of 531 (869077)
12-23-2019 2:07 AM
Reply to: Message 224 by Tangle
12-23-2019 1:10 AM


Re: True Conversion
It's amazing how such a complete system of thought can be accused of being made up, but you guys have to find something wrong with it.
There is no conversion to any other religion, no actual change as there is in Christianity. People choose other religions but they don't convert in the sense I'm describing. There's only one true God, the God of the Bible. Take it or leave it, Tangle, I'm telling you what I know but you don't have to accept it. You can always make up whatever you want, assume I'm just partisan etc.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 224 by Tangle, posted 12-23-2019 1:10 AM Tangle has replied

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 227 of 531 (869081)
12-23-2019 2:24 AM
Reply to: Message 226 by Tangle
12-23-2019 2:22 AM


Re: True Conversion
AbE Ya know what? You need to acknowledge that I answered your query about conversion. You asked a question, I answered it with the Christian point of view. Your opinion is another subject. ////
Other religions do NOT say conversion involves a change in one's nature. Prove it. They do often imitate Christianity (the very idea of faith comes from Christianity, there is no real faith in other religions. They are all lies. You assume they are all on the same level but no, they are imitations and inventions, only Biblical religion is true.)
so maybe you'll find an example somewhere but then there won't be any kind of theological system tol support it as I laid out. And how silly of you to say so flatly that a system is by definition made up. Anything at all to say something negative I guess, no need to be logical about it.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 234 of 531 (869113)
12-23-2019 11:21 AM
Reply to: Message 233 by Tangle
12-23-2019 11:07 AM


Re: True Conversion
yeah, well since you got most of what I say wrong I'm through with you for the rest of the year too.
Merry Christmas and Happy New year anyway.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 247 of 531 (869141)
12-24-2019 4:49 AM
Reply to: Message 246 by Tangle
12-24-2019 4:45 AM


Re: The spirit was strong on this one
That's perfectly silly. The Bible does not read like fiction, it reads like history. As C.S. Lewis, who taught literature at Oxford I believe, pointed out.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 246 by Tangle, posted 12-24-2019 4:45 AM Tangle has replied

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 260 of 531 (869216)
12-26-2019 7:34 AM
Reply to: Message 256 by Theodoric
12-25-2019 12:20 AM


Re: The spirit was strong on this one
C. S. Lewis says it does not read like fiction, and he should know.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 269 of 531 (869247)
12-26-2019 7:14 PM
Reply to: Message 266 by Phat
12-26-2019 4:27 PM


Lewis on literature and history
The point, Thugsy, and Theodoric, was that C.S. Lewis was an EXPERT ON LITERATURE, ON FICTION. IT was on that basis that he said that the Bible is unequivocally NOT FICTION. And we don't hve to doubt that he also had extensive knowledge of history too, it would be silly to think that an Oxford professor wouldn't.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 273 of 531 (869256)
12-26-2019 10:47 PM
Reply to: Message 272 by Theodoric
12-26-2019 7:54 PM


Re: Lewis on literature and history
So he didn't know how to judge some parts of the Bible. The main point still stands. He knew most of it wasn't fiction but history.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 277 of 531 (869284)
12-27-2019 2:55 PM
Reply to: Message 276 by Theodoric
12-27-2019 9:59 AM


Re: Again Faith needs to backpedal and retract claims
You're a little too....shall we say "generous" ? .with your accusations of lying. I remember Lewis, in "Mere Christianity" I believe, arguing with the modernists who called the Bible fiction, that he knew fiction and the Bible was not. I remember it as a blanket statement.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 374 of 531 (871445)
02-03-2020 8:04 AM
Reply to: Message 372 by Phat
02-03-2020 7:36 AM


Re: Whining for A Free pass
Look, I'm well aware that my ancestors were very callous and exploitive of indigenous cultures. I am also aware that the Populists represent one of the attempts to maintain "White Privilege" in the interests of "Making America Great Again.
No you are not "aware" that, Phat, it's a big fat lle that you get from hanging around EvC too muich. If you're going to hang out here you need to at least be listening to the other side of it. MAGA has absolutely nothing to do with race. Trump has done more for ALL races than Obama ever did. This is not an administration committed to "white privilege" which is nothing but another Leftist smear. Your mind is going to be poisoned completely if you continue to listen to people here.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 379 of 531 (871476)
02-03-2020 4:27 PM
Reply to: Message 377 by Phat
02-03-2020 2:07 PM


Re: Whining for A Free pass
you need to ask yourself why Trump Populists have such strong feelings regarding Obama, Leftism, and Nationalism.
I know why. It's because Obama is a Communist hater of America who did what he could to destroy our economy and our standing as the good nation against the evil nations in the world, and because Leftism IS ultimately Communism, which is anti-American in essence. It has come down to us from the sixties when Cultural Marxism got a foothold in the universities and it has been working ever since to destroy the nation. This is the grounding of our desire to make America great again, because they hve been working to destroy our greatness and if Hillary had won we'd be in really bad shape now. Oh it will come back and people who don't understand what America was founded to be and what Leftism is will no doubt keep supporting it. And Nationalism is simply the desire to keep America America. I'm sorry you have been so influenced by the other side.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 381 of 531 (871478)
02-03-2020 4:39 PM
Reply to: Message 377 by Phat
02-03-2020 2:07 PM


Re: Whining for A Free pass
I guess the "identity movement" is some marginal rightwing racist group?: Why do you make Trump responsible for such crazxy people?
Oh one more thing: Leftism/Communism/Marxism in America is like a wolf and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch. In other words you cannot be a "moderate" between the two of them, it's one or the other.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 386 of 531 (871500)
02-04-2020 11:27 AM
Reply to: Message 384 by Hyroglyphx
02-04-2020 12:13 AM


Re: Whining for A Free pass
I'm aware of some reacism, so what? The Left goes around accusing ALL of us on the right of racism, it's in evidence here at EvC, and all the rest of their politically correct arsenal of accusations, that all came out of Cultural Marxism. It's a partisan weapon, it has nothing to do with facts and truth, and all the namecalling isn't going to stop what racism continues anyway. You hate Trump so I'm wary of anything you say.
It's the Democratic Party that historically has all the racism to its credit and that never gets noticed. There's probably just as much of it among them now as ever too.
The right I identify with is conservative, it defends the Constitution, everybody's rights. The Left wants to bring it all crashing down and unfortunately some of them don't even know it. You too most likely.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 392 of 531 (871508)
02-04-2020 1:12 PM
Reply to: Message 390 by Hyroglyphx
02-04-2020 12:30 PM


Re: Whining for A Free pass
Is it all right with you if I don't see things your way?
I have no idea what "blood" Republicans have on their hands but I don't much mention Republicans, I identify as a general conservative which I refer to as the Right. But I also see the racist blood only on the hands of Democrats and you didn't offer any facts to dispute that, just an accusation.
I think David Horowitz has written about the Communist movement's work to undermine America and I'm sure it's true, but what I'm personally aware of is the Cultural Marxists since I encountered them in particular back in the sixties. I was in Berkeley at the time, which is also where David Horowitz was, and the Marxists were very loud and that's what has continued through the universities since then. Don't give me "moderate," don't give me anything about my side being the problem, the Rrepublicans have been a bunch of wimps but I don't identify with the Repuiblicans. It is quite right to lay it all at the feet of the Left, whether the old line Communist movement Horowitz was born into, or the Cultural Marxists I'm aware of. That's the ideology that has EvC by the throat as well as the Democrats.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 397 of 531 (871514)
02-04-2020 1:56 PM
Reply to: Message 394 by Theodoric
02-04-2020 1:18 PM


Re: Whining for A Free pass
My grandson is a blond, unfortunately a very very light yellow blond (not from my side of the family) even at the age of twelve, and he's been bullied by a Mexican kid, and called "trump" because of his blond hair. His parents are liberals. Just keep up the white privilege crap if you want to see more white kids bullied. Sorry, the racism is going more and more both ways these days. And the thing that matter is the institutional racism anyway, and we don't have that any more.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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