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Author Topic:   D&D and satanisim
Larni
Member (Idle past 164 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 136 of 164 (455228)
02-11-2008 2:26 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by Son Goku
02-11-2008 1:51 PM


Re: Confused
Imagine my suprise when (after playing for many years) I discoverd that D&D had real magic and real covens in it.
I've been a DM (the one who tells the story) for about 20 years and I've never had a sniff of real magic (at least not hocus pokus magic anyway) .
Although there are some rule books that deal with demons (T'anari) and devils (Baatzu), the're still none more real that the ones some fundies believe in.
So you have to think if one believes demons in the one book of fiction are real it's no stretch of the imagination to believe demons in another book of fiction are real.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by Son Goku, posted 02-11-2008 1:51 PM Son Goku has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 138 by Modulous, posted 02-11-2008 2:38 PM Larni has replied

  
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 137 of 164 (455229)
02-11-2008 2:38 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by New Cat's Eye
02-11-2008 2:03 PM


Re: Confused
Sometimes they make me ashamed to call myself a Christian.
Say that they aren't real Christians. That's a game that they do understand.

If I had a million dollars, I'd buy you a monkey.
Haven't you always wanted a monkey?
-- The Barenaked Ladies

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by New Cat's Eye, posted 02-11-2008 2:03 PM New Cat's Eye has not replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 138 of 164 (455230)
02-11-2008 2:38 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Larni
02-11-2008 2:26 PM


Re: Confused
Although there are some rule books that deal with demons (T'anari) and devils (Baatzu), the're still none more real that the ones some fundies believe in.
Unfortunately they used to have more "demonic" names - and they changed them at least partially because of the pressure from the Christian nutters who complained.
For Herr Goku, here is a report about a study that proved that RPG games are dangerous. After all:
quote:
A 15-year old girl was reportedly raped in Angleton, Texas by Armando Simon, 33, a prison psychologist counseling inmates for sexual crimes. According to court testimony, the girl was enticed into sex through an extended D&D game in which she was given the role of “someone who would lose her powers after doing something wrong.” Simon played a character constantly interested in women and his wife would often play a lesbian. The wife encouraged the sex by showing the girl photos of Simon naked with other women. She told the girl, “He always wanted a virgin as a gift.” The psychologist and the girl first had sex after returning from a D&D convention in Houston (Houston Chronicle, 8 May 85)
So, sinners, step away from the D20.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Larni, posted 02-11-2008 2:26 PM Larni has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by Larni, posted 02-11-2008 3:51 PM Modulous has not replied

  
Larni
Member (Idle past 164 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 139 of 164 (455238)
02-11-2008 3:51 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by Modulous
02-11-2008 2:38 PM


Re: Confused
Mod writes:
Unfortunately they used to have more "demonic" names - and they changed them at least partially because of the pressure from the Christian nutters who complained.
Yeah, that's where t'anari and baatzu replace demon and devil.
The psychologist and the girl first had sex after returning from a D&D convention in Houston (Houston Chronicle, 8 May 85)
What they leave out is that they both had been drinking water and breathing air and most daming of all they both had opposable thumbs.
I confidently expect a fundy campaign against thumbs .

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by Modulous, posted 02-11-2008 2:38 PM Modulous has not replied

  
Son Goku
Inactive Member


Message 140 of 164 (455425)
02-12-2008 12:03 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by New Cat's Eye
02-11-2008 2:03 PM


Re: Confused
Catholic Scientist writes:
Have you ever heard of the Bible Belt?
Oh definitely. However I only thought they were conservative protestants with strong family values, with an opposition to trends related to the relaxing of sexual taboos. I didn't think they were anti-boardgames as well. To be honest thinking a boardgame is evil is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.
they've claimed that video games cause violence in children
All of them? I can possibly understand them thinking games like GTA might do this, even though evidence indicates otherwise, but surely they don't think the same about Half Life 2 for example.
Catholic Scientist writes:
Indeed. But there's pretending of magic, etc. That's the devil tricking people into thinking that magic is real or something like that.
and they've even gone so far as to say that even Harry Potter books shouldn't be read because they praise witchcraft
I have no words for this. It is simply too bizarre for me to comprehend.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by New Cat's Eye, posted 02-11-2008 2:03 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 141 by Modulous, posted 02-12-2008 12:23 PM Son Goku has not replied
 Message 142 by New Cat's Eye, posted 02-12-2008 12:27 PM Son Goku has not replied
 Message 143 by Rahvin, posted 02-12-2008 3:22 PM Son Goku has not replied
 Message 145 by Phat, posted 02-28-2008 12:26 AM Son Goku has not replied
 Message 151 by LinearAq, posted 02-28-2008 9:30 AM Son Goku has not replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 141 of 164 (455428)
02-12-2008 12:23 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by Son Goku
02-12-2008 12:03 PM


Re: Confused
I have no words for this. It is simply too bizarre for me to comprehend.
Coming from a physicist, that is a chilling indictment!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Son Goku, posted 02-12-2008 12:03 PM Son Goku has not replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 142 of 164 (455430)
02-12-2008 12:27 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by Son Goku
02-12-2008 12:03 PM


Re: Confused
However I only thought they were conservative protestants with strong family values, with an opposition to trends related to the relaxing of sexual taboos.
That's not un-true, but its not just that.
I didn't think they were anti-boardgames as well.
I wouldn't call them anti-boardgame, they are against any game that they can spin into and "evil" one.
To be honest thinking a boardgame is evil is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.
Well, Christian Fundamentalists are ridiculous.
they've claimed that video games cause violence in children
All of them?
No, just the bad ones.
I can possibly understand them thinking games like GTA might do this,
Yeah... Says the father to the son: "You know, son, if you kill that hooker, you can get your money back."
but surely they don't think the same about Half Life 2 for example.
quote:
What parents should take into consideration when deciding if this game is appropriate for their child:
- The Half-Life 2 games are very violent and very bloody. Blood sprays on the walls when an enemy is shot. There are also times when the player will encounter dead bodies covered in blood. There is also a weapon called a gravity gun that allows the player to magnetically draw an object in and then hurl it outwards. One such object that can be used with the gravity gun is a giant saw blade. When the saw blade is hurled at an enemy, the enemy is sliced in half.
- There is some bad language in the Half-Life 2 games. Most of the words are words that you would hear on television (such as hell and damn). The word s**t is used a couple of times and God's name is used inappropriately at times.
It is because of the violence and blood in Half-Life 2 that I cannot recommend The Orange Box for children. Most of the games on The Orange Box are rated M and I would agree that these games are best left for a mature audience.source
Here is a link to one rating system.
I have no words for this. It is simply too bizarre for me to comprehend.
Dude... some of these US christians are CRAZY!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Son Goku, posted 02-12-2008 12:03 PM Son Goku has not replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


Message 143 of 164 (455487)
02-12-2008 3:22 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by Son Goku
02-12-2008 12:03 PM


Re: Confused
Please, watch "Jesus Camp." You can rent it, and it's also been posted to YouTube.
It's an eye-opener.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Son Goku, posted 02-12-2008 12:03 PM Son Goku has not replied

  
ramoss
Member (Idle past 612 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 144 of 164 (458123)
02-27-2008 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 123 by Granny Magda
02-08-2008 2:24 PM


Re: I cast Raise Thread.
My DM has 5 adventure paths that are 3.5 that he wants to run us through. Since we meet once ever two weeks, he figures he has enough
material to keep us busy with 3.5 for the next 15 years.
At that time, he'll be 75, and who knows what the state of the game will be then (or the state any of will be in, I am not a spring chicken myself).
I do know that the cat is out of the bag with the OGL for 3.5, and the way that wizards is playing the 4.0 bag, I just don't want to keep on giving them my hard earned money.
They plan on making 'expansion books' ever year as part of the core rule book set. I'll stay 3.5.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 123 by Granny Magda, posted 02-08-2008 2:24 PM Granny Magda has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 145 of 164 (458259)
02-28-2008 12:26 AM
Reply to: Message 140 by Son Goku
02-12-2008 12:03 PM


Re: Confused
Son Goku writes:
To be honest thinking a boardgame is evil is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.
All that evil is is the absence of God. Imagination is freely chosen, but every decision we make involves a communion of sorts. We either commune with our inner conscience or we commune with the imagination of an author, a script, a movie, or a game. At least thats how I see it, anyway.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Son Goku, posted 02-12-2008 12:03 PM Son Goku has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by Vacate, posted 02-28-2008 12:44 AM Phat has not replied
 Message 148 by Larni, posted 02-28-2008 7:36 AM Phat has replied

  
Vacate
Member (Idle past 4601 days)
Posts: 565
Joined: 10-01-2006


Message 146 of 164 (458262)
02-28-2008 12:44 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by Phat
02-28-2008 12:26 AM


absence of God
All that evil is is the absence of God
All what evil? That is what I do not understand about the claims of D&D being evil. I played it quite a bit in my youth, and had to defend it against my father. He learned in church how bad it was for me and condemned it. His basis was not on experience, or even testimony of people who had played it, but simply baseless claims. I challenged him to actually try it, and directed him to a friend of his that played the game. I never learned the results of his experience because he never again bothered me about my harmless social gatherings.
What exactly is evil about the game? Is nintendo also evil? Baseball? Reading? How about mathematics? The mere fact that the game does not promote religion does not seem like a valid reason to consider it evil. How about gardening or painting the fence?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Phat, posted 02-28-2008 12:26 AM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 152 by New Cat's Eye, posted 02-28-2008 9:49 AM Vacate has replied

  
Son Goku
Inactive Member


Message 147 of 164 (458290)
02-28-2008 7:02 AM


Absolutely mad.
Vacate (above) has posted experiences about his father condemning the game and cavediver has written about camp organisers giving out about the game. Also Catholic Scientist has linked to people who think half life 2 is suitable for only a mature audience. I genuinely feel sorry for anybody who must grow up an environment where people have concerns about these things, because anybody who seriously thinks D&D or computer games are evil doesn't live in the real world. I honestly can't express in words how strange I find this. I mean, do these people ever stop and think "Wait a minute it's just a board game, with dice and stuff". I just get an image of parents running into a room and throwing "snakes and ladders" out the window, in case their children pick up loose morals from the nefarious snakes.
As for the Harry Potter being evil thing, I still don't actually understand the argument. Here is my understanding so far:
1.Child reads about Harry and co.'s amusing and frightful adventures in Hogwarts.
2.As the books develop a plot emerges that children and many adults find enthralling.
3.Child finishes this book of magic and British school humour.
4.???????????????
5.Complete moral degradation of child.
Edited by Son Goku, : More accurate about opinions on half-life 2.
Edited by Son Goku, : Better paragraph structure.

Replies to this message:
 Message 153 by New Cat's Eye, posted 02-28-2008 9:50 AM Son Goku has not replied

  
Larni
Member (Idle past 164 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 148 of 164 (458291)
02-28-2008 7:36 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by Phat
02-28-2008 12:26 AM


Re: Confused
What exactly is it you are saying here?
That any thing that does not include your god is evil?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Phat, posted 02-28-2008 12:26 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by Asgara, posted 02-28-2008 8:08 AM Larni has replied
 Message 155 by Phat, posted 02-29-2008 12:32 AM Larni has replied

  
Asgara
Member (Idle past 2303 days)
Posts: 1783
From: Wisconsin, USA
Joined: 05-10-2003


Message 149 of 164 (458295)
02-28-2008 8:08 AM
Reply to: Message 148 by Larni
02-28-2008 7:36 AM


Re: Confused
I believe that Phat's comment would be better understood without the word "that."
From
quote:
All that evil is is the absence of God.
To
quote:
All evil is....is the absence of God.
He isn't saying the games are evil, he is merely describing evil itselt.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by Larni, posted 02-28-2008 7:36 AM Larni has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by Larni, posted 02-28-2008 8:59 AM Asgara has not replied

  
Larni
Member (Idle past 164 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 150 of 164 (458299)
02-28-2008 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 149 by Asgara
02-28-2008 8:08 AM


Re: Confused
Asgara writes:
He isn't saying the games are evil, he is merely describing evil itselt.
Ya, I know that.
But he is saying that the abscence of his god [in things] is evil.
So when I think of something that does not include his god[e.g. my old EverQuest character], then that is evil.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by Asgara, posted 02-28-2008 8:08 AM Asgara has not replied

  
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