Justify damnation, dammit!

If there is a God, he damn well better not send me to hell.

I wish you could see your own arrogance on this issue. If there is a God then he created you. He sent his Son to die for you. He has given you every opportunity to follow him and be saved, and you have rejected him. (I’m assuming this) And now it is his fault. What kind of God would he be if he let you into heaven? If a judge lets go a murder because the murder didn’t know what he did was murder, is that a just judge?

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Jason B

So, you mean to say that Jesus lied to the man and did not answer the man's question? He simply states something else and knows that's not the anwser the man was looking for.
Jesus either gives a complete and correct description reagrding the question to the man, or he lies. I believe Jesus is saying the truth. Well, you don't need family anyway do you:
Luke 14:26 "If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple"To make things worse, Jesus said that whoever calls somebody a "fool" shall be in danger of hell fire (Matt. 5:22), yet he called people "fools" himself (Matt. 23:17) Doctrine made sure that this was stamped out This is an assumption. He might have changed his life the next day.
So, consider he did give away his cash and followed the commandments. In your description, he would not have gone to heaven. Look, this is a conflict. Either he took the sin of all or he didn't. Either you have to believe in Jesus or you don't. There's no middle way. This is christian salvation for a lot of problems within the bible.
Unfortunately doesn't always work does it.Lucy

God created me wrong (sinful version). He should have done his job properly.
After his own mistake, now he demands me to follow him.
Actually, he demands that I follow Jesus, who is his son, who is god, born of the holy spirit, who is his father, who is god also....
Forget it.Lucy

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Bible
Search Results
"Death & Dead" were found 827 times in 751 verses.Thats a Whole Lotta Suffering

God created me wrong (sinful version).

You said if there is a God, he better not send you to hell. I think we can infer from that statement that you have doubts about God’s existence. You have obviously been told about God yet you have doubts. You will not be able to argue ignorance. I guess you will still have the ‘You Created Me’ argument. I hope that works. When I meet my maker, my only defense against hell, will be Jesus.

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Jason B

The Bible does not say exactly what hell will be like.I know of a pastor who wanted to know what hell was like so he prayed on the matter for many nights. Finally he got an answer.He said he saw a man sitting in the middle of a barren dessert all by himself, totally separated from people and even more painful, totally separated from God. He went on to say that on Earth everyone is touched by God’s grace to some measure, even the worst of sinners, still has a measure of God’s grace upon him. But in the hell he saw that night; even that portion will be withdrawn; leaving man totally alone.But that’s just his vision.This message has been edited by Jasonb, 07-23-2004 12:44 PM

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Jason B

As I have said in other threads, IMHO, there are a whole lot of Atheists, Buddhists, Agnostics, Muslims, Hindus and just other good folk that would go to heaven before many that call themselves Christian. I simply cannot imagine a GOD that would want to associate with the likes of Gene Scott, Pat Robertson, Jim Bakker, Oral Roberts, Jerry Falwell, Ted Hovind, or any folk that hang out with such people.I imagine that come judgement day they will be treated much as the Priests were when Jesus himself scourged the Temple. There will be some big time butt kicking and I, for one, would love to be there when "Beam the Money Up" Scottie gets his ass whumped. Let's see how far his horses, planes, fancy homes and strange hats go come graduation day.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Better example... if a father beats the holy living crap out of his child for taking a cookie before supper, is the father's act justified by his yelling, "I TOLD YOU! I TOLD YOU NOT TO TAKE A COOKIE BEFORE SUPPER! YOU'RE FORCING MY HAND!"ETA: I might add that if a murderer didn't know that what he was doing was murder, he does in fact get a severely lighter sentence. Intent is everything when it comes to sentencing a criminal.This message has been edited by Dan Carroll, 07-23-2004 01:30 PM

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"Egos drone and pose alone, Like black balloons, all banged and blown
On a backwards river the infidels shiver in the stench of belief.
And tell my mama I'm a hundred years late; I'm over the rails and out of the race
The crippled psalms of an age that won't thaw are ringing in my ears"
-Beck

if a murderer didn't know that what he was doing was murder, he does in fact get a severely lighter sentence

Mandatory Sentencing aside Intent is to be considered but it is not Everything when it comes to sentencing. A transgressed law is still a transgressed law.My cousin recently hit and killed a women while driving under the influence of drugs. I know him, and I know he did not intend to kill her, but according to his lawyer the judge will not consider that as a defense. His only hope of a lesser sentence is to plead to the mercy of the judge. Now he will still be punished, but his punishment may be less severe if he asks for mercy. But it may not be either.It is the same way with God. We have to ask for mercy. We don’t deserve it. If we deserved it, it would not be mercy, but justice, and I don’t want my just punishment. I plead for mercy.This message has been edited by Jasonb, 07-23-2004 02:10 PM

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Jason B

Makes me think about Rowan Atkinson live.
He plays the devil at the entrance of hell:
"Where are you atheists?
You must be feeling like tossers!
Where are you Christians?
I'm afraid the jews were right"
hihiI don't believe in god though.
I expect to decompose when I die and get a well reserved eternal sleep.Lucy

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Bible
Search Results
"Death & Dead" were found 827 times in 751 verses.Thats a Whole Lotta Suffering

Because he intentionally took the drugs and drove, knowing the risks involved. The intent in this case is willfull negligence.Negligence and ignorance are not the same thing. Maybe you don't. I don't know you, so I really couldn't say if you do or not.This message has been edited by Dan Carroll, 07-23-2004 02:41 PM

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"Egos drone and pose alone, Like black balloons, all banged and blown
On a backwards river the infidels shiver in the stench of belief.
And tell my mama I'm a hundred years late; I'm over the rails and out of the race
The crippled psalms of an age that won't thaw are ringing in my ears"
-Beck

Lam, I appriciate the support, but this little doozy can't go unnoticed: Pfft! Yeah, you and every other amateur who says they're gonna do it. Let's face it, only one of you knuckleheads will come out on top... and it's gonna be me

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Wanna feel God? Step onto the wrestling mat and you'd be crazy to deny the uplifting spirit. http://www.BadPreacher.5u.com (incomplete, but look anyway!)

Is that so?
It does not say that people will burn in it for eternities, if that is what you mean, that is an RCC invention and scare tactic adopted by her offspring, the protestants. Sin will have a final solution.Mal 4:1
For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn
as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all
that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the
day that cometh shall burn them up, saith
the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them
neither root nor branch.Mal 4:2
But unto you that fear my name shall the
Sun of righteousness arise with healing in
his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow
up as calves of the stall.Mal 4:3
And ye shall tread down the wicked; for
they shall be ashes under the soles of your
feet in the day that I shall do [this], saith
the LORD of hosts.no shrieking in eternal hellfire, simply.....the fire acts like a cleansing agent, sin and its adherents will cease to be. The effects of this fire will be eternal, for sin will never arise again.
The difference between eternal punishment
and eternal punishing?

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"Let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit!"
2 Cor. 7:1

The intent in this case is willfull negligence

He as been charged with vehicular homicide (murder with a car). Intent in this case is not being considered by the judge, and I don’t think his intent is much consolation to the young husband who lost a wife.He asked me if I thought God considered him a murderer. I told him I didn’t think so, that God knew he did not have murderous intent. But the state of Florida does consider him a murderer. Sometimes man’s law is much harsher than God’s law. (Just an observation)

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Jason B

Make up your mind. Is he being tried for a lesser crime than murder, or is the state not considering intent?In the state of Florida, vehicular homicide carries a sentence of not more than a $10,000 fine and/or 15 years imprisonment.Also in the state of Florida, first degree murder is punishable by death.And you think intent is irrelevant here? If he had gotten behind the wheel fully intending to run that woman over with his car, which crime do you think he'd be charged with?

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"Egos drone and pose alone, Like black balloons, all banged and blown
On a backwards river the infidels shiver in the stench of belief.
And tell my mama I'm a hundred years late; I'm over the rails and out of the race
The crippled psalms of an age that won't thaw are ringing in my ears"
-Beck

It does not say that people will burn in it for eternities, if that is what you mean, that is an RCC invention and scare tactic adopted by her offspring, the protestants. Sin will have a final solution.

I think he would say, and again it is his vision, Malachi 4 and other passages are meant to convey the horror and agony of the place, to give us a mind frame that says, OK this is a bad place.Just like when the bible says the streets of heaven are pure gold. I don’t think it means literal gold. God attempts to describe heavenly, spiritual things, to human worldly minds and has to use illustrations we understand.If God simply said, I am going to send you to a place, and you will be by yourself forever. We may think, OK cool, Can I take my IPod. Because having a measure of God’s grace upon us all the time, we can not fathom the longings of our soul in complete isolation from God. But he gives us an idea. In Malachi 4 he says it will feel like you are burning for eternity.But again it’s not my theory. I could try to find his name, I think he wrote about it in a book, but I can’t be sure.

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Jason B