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Author | Topic: Education | |||||||||||||||||||||||
nator Member (Idle past 2191 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
Oh, I've disagreed with him about all sorts of things.
That's why he wants me.
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robinrohan Inactive Member |
Oh, I've disagreed with him about all sorts of things. My own view is that Holmes thinks you are saying that his life style is inferior to your life style.
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nator Member (Idle past 2191 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: My view is that holmes deigns to have pity upon all of us poor, unenlightened wretches who don't live just like he does. ...which is what most of us do. Of course, he will never actually admit to it. And, of course, he wants me and can't have me. This message has been edited by schrafinator, 12-16-2005 10:36 PM
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robinrohan Inactive Member |
My view is that holmes deigns to have pity upon all of us poor, unenlightened wretches who don't live just like he does. Now we are getting to the heart of the matter. Do you consider Holmes conceited?
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nator Member (Idle past 2191 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: It is inappropriate for us to continue this discussion any further in this thread, and really at all.
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robinrohan Inactive Member |
It is inappropriate for us to continue this discussion any further in this thread, and really at all. HA, HA, HA. Here's the funny thing about it: Both of you are as conceited as hell. A blind man could see it a mile away, you with your proper living formula and Holmes with his superiority complex about sex and everything else. You deserve each other.
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Silent H Member (Idle past 5840 days) Posts: 7405 From: satellite of love Joined: |
...Thank you sir... I don't think you understood me. I was saying that individuals must be blamed and held accountable for their errors, and it happens on both sides. I did not at all suggest that it happens in equal measure.
then they turn around and blatantly fart about what “science” *truly* is (research vs. applied ...etc.) Now YOU are the one making an error. Science is a field of human endeavour and it has a history. You can go and read the history of how it progressed. Yes it can change, as it has already, but it will only get tighter and not more broad. I mean it can, but that wouldn't make much sense. The history has been to focus research by strengthening methodology. It has resulted in much greater pace of results and less false positives or deceit. We certainly can say what science is right now, because it has a definition from its current place in development over time. Much (maybe even all) of creationism falls outside of that functional definition. Most certainly Intelligent Design did or they wouldn't be asking for a legal redefinition of science to change to an earlier, broader, and less useful definition. That does not mean that all science that creationists do is outside of science and somehow invalid, even if much of what they do on the question of speciation is or has been.
the NAS states unequivocally that creationism has no place in any science curriculum at any level. I agree it has no place in science curriculum. Why would it? It is not a leading theory by any means and has no added benefit to instruction of methodology or theory by any means. At least not at this time. It may very well have once counted as science, but it doesn't at this time. Change in methodology, as well as accumulating evidence have left it behind. Perhaps one of the largest problems is that creationists have felt it was safe to sit on their asses with what they had and the way they did things in that specific topic, rather than move with the flow. ID is an attempt to do this, but flawed in that instead of truly moving along, they realize they don't want to move far enough and are trying to legally force everyone else back. Heheheh... kind of like when one is behind in a race asking the judges to force the lead runner to meet you half way. Why should anyone think that is proper? holmes "...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)
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Silent H Member (Idle past 5840 days) Posts: 7405 From: satellite of love Joined: |
Holmes' little attempts to poke me with sticks, pull my braids, snap my bra strap, or whatever else he thinks he needs to do to get my attention only stir me to the eyerolling stage these days. But that's not what I am trying to do. I am honestly responding to what you say. I am calling you out for your hypocrisy when I see it, just as you have said you can do (and certainly have done) to people who refuse to acknowledge an open challenge in the past. Why do you feel that when I do to you EXACTLY what you have done to others, and have defended when they complained, is somehow an immature attempt just to get your attention? Faith raised this issue a long time ago in a general way and I agreed with her then and still do. People here let those on their own side of the evo issue get away with a lot of garbage. I don't.
I think he's terribly frustrated because he wants me but can't have me. That's funny because that's the same thing Rrhain said when he couldn't answer my criticisms. What is it that people want to play it off like I am attracted to them in specific when the heat is on? Hmmmm. Take a look at how many posts I made in the last few weeks and figure out how many were to you. If you want to know the full truth, while you are attractive, and I think you are generally intelligent, I feel no desire to "have you". Indeed given what my sexuality is, how could I be frustrated along those lines? You feel you are damaged goods and I generally react to a person the way they feel about themselves. You are damaged goods and I don't want you. I do however deserve an answer to an unanswered challenge.
So, he follows me around EvC, trying in the only way he knows how to get my attention. Might I remind you that this only began after you started replying to me? You replied to me in subjects reasserting old positions which had already been challenged by me and you had left unanswered. I posted links to info and you simply waved your hand and suggested that science can be misinterpreted data due to bias! That goes to the very question of what you were arguing here with creos. If it is okay for you, why not for them? If it is not okay for them, then why do you not do what you are asking them to do?... concede on the points I have made against you using citations from valid research.
My view is that holmes deigns to have pity upon all of us poor, unenlightened wretches who don't live just like he does...which is what most of us do. I have already written many times that while I DO feel my way of life is fantastic, it is personal and subjective. And I DO NOT want everyone to live as I do. I like diversity and if everyone lived and liked things the same way no one would ever get things done, and it would be a lot more boring. Yes I do pity people who are scares of their own bodies, and the power of their own sexuality. And I have said they have every right to pity me for not feeling as they do. Indeed they do, which is why you are yet again showing your hypocrisy. EVERYONE is conceited regarding their personal tastes. The difference between people like you and people like me being that I do not reject science and logic when I am discussing issues on subjects which involve my tastes. Yes you ARE unenlightened, but not regarding your own sexual tastes. They are what they are. You are unenlightened because you don't realize or acknowledge or show any interest in learning where your own beliefs come from in history. You do not challenge your own concepts. That is not conceit on my part, that is a definitional fact.
Of course, he will never actually admit to it. Most people do not live like I do, and likely will not for a long long long time, if in fact they ever do. That's sort of sad, but as long as there is some community of some kind I don't mind too much. In any case I still wouldn't want everyone living the way I do. That would be more boring. I've already said this to you so instead of dealing with the evidence you have continued to portray my position using your strawman. I used to live on a block with the Playboy mansion, a synogue, a catholic cardinal's mansion, and a protestant church. To me that is cool. I know live in a block filled with prostitutes, sex shops, catholic churches, protestant churches, dope shops, and children's centers. To me that is cool. Get it through your head, I am not trying to convert you to "my way of life". I am trying to get you to answer challenges to points of fact on history, biology, and psychology which you consistently run away from only to reappear and reassert your position again. And I "follow" you in the same way you "follow" them. When you see them doing what you do to me, you challenge them and sometimes in even more angry ways. I am doing the same. Admit you do the same thing and its okay and so have no reason to pester them. Or admit you really are in the wrong and concede on the points outstanding (never to reassert your original errant positions), so that when you hack at creos you are no longer shattering your own windows. holmes "...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)
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Silent H Member (Idle past 5840 days) Posts: 7405 From: satellite of love Joined: |
Holmes with his superiority complex about sex and everything else. I have my tastes and I like them. You have your tastes and you like them. She has her tastes and she likes them. EVERYONE is conceited about their tastes. That's why people get defensive when others try and tell them that their tastes are wrong. The difference between me and her (and a few others around her) is that I am not falsely suggesting I have evidence that says her tastes are harmful and so immoral or need to be legislated in some way, or indeed that other people's tastes (who happen to be in the minority) are harmful and so immoral or need to be legislated against in some way. Neither do I run away when challenged. People know generally what my sexuality is. I have been a consistent defender of ALL sexual minorities, including tastes that I do not have and in some cases find personally distasteful. That is not because I am hung up on sex, it is because most of the world is (only in a negative way) and so forms the latest witch hunt mentality resulting in ignorance and harm to a lot of innocent people. If I seem to have an air of superiority it does not come from my tastes, though I am admittedly conceited that they are great for me and people like me. My air of superiority sneaks in when I find myself facing people attacking minorities for no other reason than that they are the popular minority to pick on at this time and place. One would think history would have taught people to avoid that situation, but it still goes on. I DO feel enlightened that I haven't fallen for that kind of mistake. I do feel intellectually superior to those that have. They can of course improve their position. Its not an inherent and absolute superiority. If you saw people trying to detect and burn witches, my guess is you'd get a feeling of superiority when addressing them. This message has been edited by holmes, 12-17-2005 06:39 AM holmes "...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)
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nator Member (Idle past 2191 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
I am absolutely not interested in getting into any of this, except to correct the impression that I actually think that holmes is "frustrated because he wants me but cannot have me."
I said that purely as a joke, as it is clearly and obviously not the case.
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Nighttrain Member (Idle past 4015 days) Posts: 1512 From: brisbane,australia Joined: |
Tone devices, people, we`ve got to include tone devices, or misunderstandings will continue to surface.
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RobertFitz Inactive Member |
I tell you what Ringo, I think This thread has become a bit derailed, but I have enjoyed our exchanges greatly and I look forward to meeting you on other threads.
I guess I would call it a result for you as I am withdrawing gracefully in the face of your excellent logic and your tenacity. Cheers Rob
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
RobertFitz writes: I am withdrawing gracefully in the face of your excellent logic and your tenacity. I'll plead guilty to tenacity anyway. I leave a trail of dead horses in my wake. Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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pink sasquatch Member (Idle past 6044 days) Posts: 1567 Joined: |
A blind man could see it a mile away, you with your proper living formula and Holmes with his superiority complex about sex and everything else. You deserve each other. My thoughts precisely - I learned to avoid their self-important banter some time ago... ...and I'm liking you more and more each day, RR.
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Silent H Member (Idle past 5840 days) Posts: 7405 From: satellite of love Joined: |
My thoughts precisely - I learned to avoid their self-important banter some time ago... Okay this is starting to get me steamed. Where did I bring up sex? What did that have to do with what I wrote here? Schraf made a derisive comment, which was hypocritical given her own statements about SCIENCE. She claimed in at least two other threads that science can be biased, and results simply a matter of prejudiced thinking. IF that is true, THEN her criticism here was pointless... yes or no? On top of that it was INACCURATE. Evos and Creos are both capable of avoiding evidence or logic when it is against something they want to believe in. It depends on the individual and not simply on the class of person... Right or not? Given that there are creos who have done some solid work in science, that should answer the question right there. All I did was step in and answer her post directly, and pointed out her hypocritical actions on that subject... THIS subject. Then everyone else comes in to analyze me and assert I am doing something which I did not do? That's great. For a bunch of people commenting on my superiority complex, maybe all of you can point out when I ever entered a thread to simply insult people with no point besides that? This message has been edited by holmes, 12-18-2005 05:47 AM holmes "...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)
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