Is there such a thing as chance?

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The choice of which bank to use is innocuous.

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I disagree.Banks have an enormous inpact on their communities through who they decide to lend money to (or not), if only the people who deposit large sums get basic benefits, etc. They also have been at the forefront of the movement in the service sector of maintaining the "almost full time" employee which gives the bank lots of hours of work but the employee doesn't quite qualify for benefits because they don't work full time.That's why I have my money in a credit union, which is a not for profit institution.

Point missed, sorry. But thats not how it works. We still have to pay for our sins. Forgiveness doesn't mean you get away with it. Forgiveness doesn't happen, unless you repent, and stop sinning (or try to). You can keep being forgiven, but I'm sure there is a point, plus you still have to pay, thats between you and God. Back to the old Party all week, confess on Sunday syndrome. Thats a bunch of BS if you ask me. You got to walk the walk.I am still paying for my sins, that I have committed in life, and feel more guilty than ever about them. But it doesn't drag me down (because I am forgiven), because I am getting what I deserve. So will other people when they sin, so I do not need to retaliate, I put things in God's hands, and the result happen most of the time instantly.*edit*
To add a thought. Becoming a Christian is tougher than not being one. Its the exact opposite of what you are saying. A true Christian has a hard life, because he does the works of the Lord.This message has been edited by riVeRraT, 01-24-2005 16:21 AM

I've never had mine called short or had any complaints about the ...or were you talking about somesin else?(for information purposes only ... boy what a set of straight lines ... )

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I've never had mine called short or had any complaints about the ...
or were you talking about somesin else?

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(for information purposes only ... boy what a set of straight lines ... )

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complaints about the.............what?
sin.....I was talking about sin. You?
Please accept my apology, but I'm more than a ding confused these days. It's the weather, I believe. We have weather all the time where I live, but lately it is so unpredictable.
You spelled something wrong, but evil is like that, you know, sin.
If lockstep is not observed, out of step is out of step.
So, step on it or step in it when you step off it, but kindly don't step over it.
For information purposes only.

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"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."
Hey, Al, I agree!

liberal lockstep? lol.
weather or not we step in it eh?

Sorry you missed it . It was right, no left, no right in front of you. Do you chose to blink? Or are you going to blink anyway? There are so many levels of innocuous choices that this concept is ultimately self-defeating if not ridiculous. Because {A} instead of taking personal responsibility you externalize it to some myth base, and then {B} work hard at realizing that myth base, which {C} (because it is based on myth) doesn't accomplish anything other than random results, so you {D} "work" harder to try to make those random results become what you think they should be, and start back at point {A}. That is my observation. You set yourself up to fail (heck you start with the precept that you have already failed before starting and that failure is {inherent\inevitable\unavoidable} ) not because the standard is impossible but because the standard is without reason.I don't mean any offense, btw, but I do get a little peeved at the "poor christians have it so hard" line.

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
{{{Buddha walks off laughing with joy}}}

Blinking is a choice? It wouldn't be bad, so it is good. It's a sign of life.
It's subconscience, so its different. Non taken, but now you have to hear 7,000 truths, after your 1,000 lies.
It's not poor Chritstians have ot so hard, as it is a choice, and one that I am very happy about making. There's nothing poor about this Christian. I rich in the Lord, family, love, and many other things.We have it harder because of many things, including people with your mindset. And that BTW is of no thanks to many people who claim to be Christian and are not.1st:

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instead of taking personal responsibility you externalize it to some myth base,

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Dude, what the freak is that? Being a Christian is all about personal responsibilty, and accountability. Maybe something that most people are not familiar with, (including myself in the past) and they just go about there own way, making their own rules, and their own God.I am, now more than ever, personally responsible for ever action I do. Plus I am under the gun from people like you making those kinds of statements. I am however not responsible for the actions of others, and in those cases, I might ask God for help. So far he has helped me EVERYTIME. Wierd huh?2nd

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work hard at realizing that myth base, which {C} (because it is based on myth) doesn't accomplish anything other than random results,

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Yes, I have looked for this theory of yours myself. Because I want to believe in something that is real, not something that I have to work hard at making come true, to satisfy the emotional need of having an imaginary friend, or whatever.But, as I learn more about God, I find that the results are not random at all. God makes promises, and he keeps them, period. We are the ones who are random.3rd

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"work" harder to try to make those random results become what you think they should be, and start back at point

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If I don't understand something, or a result, I ask God, and I get immediate answers. This is with myself. I cannot speak for others. It is not hard at all. The hardest part about following God, is avoiding temptation. All sin can feel great, just like a heroin addict loves his heroin.4th

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You set yourself up to fail

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Funny, I don't feel like I failed. Actually, I feel dam good about myself. I get great joy from doing the work of the Lord.5th

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heck you start with the precept that you have already failed before starting and that failure is {inherent\inevitable\unavoidable

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Not sure how you made that analogy, but being born into sin is not failing. It is a fact of life. I just word it differently than you. You cannot change the facts.This is somthing that you cannot see, until the truth is made known to you. I felt the same way you did. Now I see different. It's a wonderful refreshing, enlighting, eye opener, and the word failure just does not fit in there.6th

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not because the standard is impossible but because the standard is without reason.

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If you don't believe.Peace

Sometimes it is conscious and sometimes it is subconscious. If you notice that your eyes are dry you can blink to make them wetter, or you can wait a bit and the blinking will happen autonomously.Can you choose not to blink? (don't blink ... ) you assume your faith to be undeniably true and this forces you to make and hold to several assumptions that you would not otherwise need to make, involving purpose, specialness, "sin" etcetera.

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
{{{Buddha walks off laughing with joy}}}

Lets go about this a different way.Would you agree that if something cannot be descibed as bad, then it must be good?Obviously blinking is good for you. You assume that I was always this way, and never saw things the way you do.

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Would you agree that if something cannot be descibed as bad, then it must be good?

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So we are agreed that mastubastion is a good thing?

Feels good, and is good are 2 different things.Getting high feels good, but it is not really good for you, correct?

Nope. I would say it could be morally neutral. Morals relate to behavior of a social animal in a social situation. Anything not related to that {animal\behavior} is not related to morals, hence not good or bad.

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
{{{Buddha walks off laughing with joy}}}

Everything we do can be related to morals, whether social or Godly.Blinking for instance. If I blink it is morally accepted, and no-one would say anything to me about it. So it is good.If I start blinking like a strobe light as you were talking to me, there might be a problem.When rhain uses his little *blink* statement, you don't think there is more than just a blink behind it?Every little action we choose to make, is a whole bunch of things accociated with it. Unless you can make choices without thinking, or no previous thoughts about it. Is it possible for you to be without thought in your head?

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Would you agree that if something cannot be descibed as bad, then it must be good?

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Entirely debatable - certain drugs can have adverse affects if overused but that does not mean "getting high"=bad, not at all.

is Sickle cell anemia good or bad? one half the population is protected from dying of malaria by it, one fourth are not protected (and will survive if not subjected to it) and one fourth die from a double dose of the mutation.a hard call imho.

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
{{{Buddha walks off laughing with joy}}}