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Author Topic:   God's Day 1 Billion Years?
ringo
Member (Idle past 530 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 28 of 61 (338541)
08-08-2006 2:04 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by jimrlong.com
08-07-2006 5:59 PM


jimrlong.com writes:
It is no more likely this got created by accident either.
I don't quite understand why you're talking about an "accident". Chemistry is pretty deterministic - if the components are there and the conditions are right, the bonds will form. The "likelihood" (probability) may be low, but as long as it is non-zero, it will happen, given enough time.

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This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 530 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 30 of 61 (339274)
08-11-2006 3:31 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by jimrlong.com
08-11-2006 3:13 PM


jimrlong.com writes:
... amino acids are more likely to be attracted to other molecules than other amino acids
Depends on what's in the beaker, don't it?
Depends on concentrations. Depends on pH. Depends on temperature. Depends on a lot of things that your blanket statement ignores.
... according to NASA an environment capable of producing amino acids has never been present on Earth
From the Miller-Urey experiment and subsequent variations, it seems clear that a wide variety of environments are capable of producing amino acids. Are you suggesting that NASA denies all of those possibilities? If so, please provide references.
Given enough time the proverbial 747 could be built out of spare parts by wind, but will the jet fly or the cell live?
I was down at the lake the other day watching the canards. None of them were as old as yours.
(You can use the "Peek" button in the lower right-hand corner of each post to see how quotes and other "special effects" are done. You can consult a good high-school textbook to find out how comprehensible English sentences are constructed.)

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This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 530 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 33 of 61 (339297)
08-11-2006 4:02 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by jimrlong.com
08-11-2006 3:55 PM


Re: From the Miller-Urey experiment
So you just ignore the subsequent experiments that produced amino acids in other environments? You cling to one half-century-old experiment as the sole defense of your ignorance of chemistry?

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by jimrlong.com, posted 08-11-2006 3:55 PM jimrlong.com has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 34 by jimrlong.com, posted 08-11-2006 4:09 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 530 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 36 of 61 (339310)
08-11-2006 4:44 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by jimrlong.com
08-11-2006 4:09 PM


Re: From the Miller-Urey experiment
jimrlong.com writes:
I gave my cite with listed website give your cite with website.
Why don't we start with your own? Your own quote mentions Juan Oro in 1961. And the very next paragraph after your quote begins:
quote:
Many of the compounds made in the Miller/Urey experiment are known to exist in outer space. On September 28, 1969, a meteorite fell over Murchison, Australia. While only 100 kilograms were recovered, analysis of the meteorite has shown that it is rich with amino acids. Over 90 amino acids have been identified by researchers to date. Nineteen of these amino acids are found on Earth.
From a quickie Google search:
link
quote:
Subsequent experiments have substituted ultraviolet light or heat as the energy source or have altered the initial abundances of gases. In all such experiments amino acids have been formed in large yield. On the early Earth there was much more energy available in ultraviolet light than in lightning discharges. At long ultraviolet wavelengths, in which methane, ammonia, water, and hydrogen are all transparent, but in which the bulk of the solar ultraviolet energy lies, the gas hydrogen sulfide (H2S) is a likely ultraviolet absorber.
quote:
... Carl Sagan, and his colleagues made amino acids by long wavelength ultraviolet irradiation of a mixture of methane, ammonia, water, and H2S. The amino acid syntheses, at least in many cases, involve hydrogen cyanide and aldehydes (e.g., formaldehyde) as gaseous intermediaries formed from the initial gases. It is quite remarkable that amino acids, particularly biologically abundant amino acids, can be made so readily under simulated primitive conditions.
Now remind me, what does any of this have to do with the topic?

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ringo
Member (Idle past 530 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 39 of 61 (339333)
08-11-2006 6:11 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by jimrlong.com
08-11-2006 5:38 PM


Re: It has everything to do with the topic
jimrlong.com writes:
Hebrew Bible.... Unique you might say, but I prefer inspired.
No, I wouldn't say "unique" at all - Egyptians had monotheism, Hammurabi had his code book..... We have lots of threads on that stuff.
Without a descent explanation about how life started on earth, I don't have enough faith to be an atheist.
Well, atheism is pretty much defined as a lack of faith, so that's no problem. We have lots of threads on that too.
You have given no proof how this would come together and start living.
Nothing was ever said about "proof".
All I've done is point out a few of your misconceptions about chemistry. If you have no clue how chemistry works, how can anybody show you that life could arise without a "creator"?
I have to believe that without a Creator, there is no life.
Silly, silly, silly. Just look out the window and "believe" that life exists. How it came to exist is an entirely different question.
I was told about the inconsistency of the Biblical account and tried to show you the inconsistencies of your account.
I haven't given any account. How could there be "inconsistencies"?
I was willing to take the word of a scientist to the beginning of life and its date. So that is where I came up with 1 Day in God's life might be a billion years.
Your mistake is in injecting God into the science.
Whether or not God exists, whether She created the world in six days or watched life form spontaneously over billions of years has nothing to do with science.

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