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Author
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Topic: When Fascism Comes To America
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Theodoric
Member Posts: 8495 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: 08-15-2005 Member Rating: 2.9
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Message 211 of 283 (908742)
03-20-2023 9:08 AM
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Reply to: Message 210 by Percy
03-20-2023 8:26 AM
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Re: Ex-Spurts: Drips Under Pressure
We have seen this cycle with Phat many times. It seems the period of the cycling is speeding up. I hope he has mental and medical support on standby. I fear the next crash is going to be quite severe. Actually I don't care. He burned the very last bridge recently.
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 210 by Percy, posted 03-20-2023 8:26 AM | | Percy has seen this message but not replied |
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Tanypteryx
Member Posts: 4033 From: Oregon, USA Joined: 08-27-2006 Member Rating: 4.1
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Message 212 of 283 (908761)
03-20-2023 11:47 AM
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Reply to: Message 205 by Phat
03-20-2023 1:59 AM
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Re: Ex-Spurts: Drips Under Pressure
Message 180Phat writes: No. I stand by this one. China has been playing the long game with America for 50 years. Our esteemed financial geniuses have been duped. Just what exactly is this duping that you have brilliantly uncovered?
Message 202Phat writes: I realize that you all are "impressed" and/or persuaded by "experts in their field". But just wait until you find out the truth about Jerome Powell and Janet Yellin! Message 200Phat writes: I will finish later, as I have to (am blessed to be able to) go to work right now. I will attempt to explain how the US Economy came off of the rails starting in the early seventies and worsening every year since then.
Tanypteryx writes: Just what exactly is this duping that you have brilliantly uncovered?
Have a seat, Damselfly. I must go earn money to feed the larvae, but shall return later.  Is the answer coming anytime soon? I'm beginning to think that you are bullshitting us.
Just what exactly is this duping that you have brilliantly uncovered?
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty PythonOne important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 205 by Phat, posted 03-20-2023 1:59 AM | | Phat has not replied |
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Taq
Member Posts: 9724 Joined: 03-06-2009 Member Rating: 3.3
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Message 213 of 283 (908769)
03-20-2023 12:48 PM
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Reply to: Message 200 by Phat
03-19-2023 3:58 PM
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Re: Grinding America Down
Phat writes:
Oh but it is! It is in fact an economic war.
How so?
I will attempt to explain how the US Economy came off of the rails starting in the early seventies and worsening every year since then. Can you name one economy that is on the rails, just so we have something to compare to? For example, can you name one country that uses a gold-backed currency? No?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 200 by Phat, posted 03-19-2023 3:58 PM | | Phat has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 214 by Phat, posted 03-20-2023 1:05 PM | | Taq has replied |
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Phat
Member Posts: 17619 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: 12-30-2003 Member Rating: 1.1
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Message 214 of 283 (908771)
03-20-2023 1:05 PM
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Reply to: Message 213 by Taq
03-20-2023 12:48 PM
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Re: Grinding America Down
Taq writes: Can you name one economy that is on the rails, just so we have something to compare to? You bring up a good point. Global debt is over 100 trillion dollars. Modeern Monetary Theory seems to think that it is no big deal. It takes no Rocket Scientist to question their conclusions!
Wiki:
Modern Monetary Theory or Modern Money Theory is a heterodox macroeconomic theory that describes currency as a public monopoly and unemployment as evidence that a currency monopolist is overly restricting the supply of the financial assets needed to pay taxes and satisfy savings desires.
Of course Bernie Sanders and Alexandra Occasio Cortez both champion MMT. Public Monopoly, my ass! If money belonged to all of us, we all would have equal stake in "it". Which is patently unfair. Why should the guy passed out under the park bench have an equal share with the hardworking father or mother who holds down 3 jobs? Im not saying that the drunk has no share. Im simply saying that there is no way he has earned his share. At best, we can provide basic food, shelter, and medical needs for him while guiding him towards recovery. What we cant do is rob the hard working opportunists in order to support the idle. equal distribution equates to global socialism. And if the CCP is in line to be the next global superpower, that simply will not work. Wake up, people!
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 213 by Taq, posted 03-20-2023 12:48 PM | | Taq has replied |
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Percy
Member Posts: 21581 From: New Hampshire Joined: 12-23-2000 Member Rating: 4.7
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Message 215 of 283 (908802)
03-20-2023 4:00 PM
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Reply to: Message 214 by Phat
03-20-2023 1:05 PM
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Re: Grinding America Down
Phat writes: Taq writes: Can you name one economy that is on the rails, just so we have something to compare to? You bring up a good point. Global debt is over 100 trillion dollars. Modern Monetary Theory seems to think that it is no big deal. It takes no Rocket Scientist to question their conclusions!
Wiki:
Modern Monetary Theory or Modern Money Theory is a heterodox macroeconomic theory that describes currency as a public monopoly and unemployment as evidence that a currency monopolist is overly restricting the supply of the financial assets needed to pay taxes and satisfy savings desires.
I haven't followed the discussion closely, but I think it's possible that with the exception of PaulK that no one understood that when you introduced the term Modern Monetary Theory that you were talking about a specific thing and not just referring to the modern theory of money (e.g., fiat currencies, your usual target) in another way. You invited this confusion yourself by not defining the term until just now, instead just providing a link to the Wikipedia article. That same article indicates the theory isn't "mainstream" and "has been criticized heavily by many mainstream economists," which as PaulK noted doesn't sound like it has had much sway, and he asked how you can blame a theory that hasn't been adopted to any significant extent. But that Wikipedia characterization you quoted, if you ignore the provocative terminology and framing, sounds like plain old mainstream macroeconomic theory, and in the second paragraph Wikipedia says that the extent to which it actually differs from "orthodox macroeconomics" is debated. I don't think it's worth focusing much attention on Modern Monetary Theory.
If money belonged to all of us, we all would have equal stake in "it". Which is patently unfair. Why should the guy passed out under the park bench have an equal share with the hardworking father or mother who holds down 3 jobs? I'm unable to make any sense of this. --Percy
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 214 by Phat, posted 03-20-2023 1:05 PM | | Phat has not replied |
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Theodoric
Member Posts: 8495 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: 08-15-2005 Member Rating: 2.9
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Message 216 of 283 (908803)
03-20-2023 4:09 PM
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Reply to: Message 214 by Phat
03-20-2023 1:05 PM
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Re: Grinding America Down
Your man is pretty supportive of MMT. I guess he is an idiot too. AOC Endorsed MMT Closer to Happening Than You Think: Ray Dalio.
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 214 by Phat, posted 03-20-2023 1:05 PM | | Phat has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 218 by Phat, posted 03-20-2023 8:45 PM | | Theodoric has replied |
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Tanypteryx
Member Posts: 4033 From: Oregon, USA Joined: 08-27-2006 Member Rating: 4.1
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Message 217 of 283 (908806)
03-20-2023 4:20 PM
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Reply to: Message 205 by Phat
03-20-2023 1:59 AM
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Re: Ex-Spurts: Drips Under Pressure
Phat writes: And I won't say I told you so when things unravel. Since the unravelling is all in your mind, that's the only way anyone would notice it happening.
Phat writes: Its likely that the peanut gallery will find a way to blame the Republicans, even though they are smarter with money than the Democrats. Game, Set, Match! Once again you convincingly demonstrate you have absolutely no knowledge of how economics, finance or money works. It is well documented that the Republicans don't know anything more about the economy or finance than you do. They don't even have a fucking clue what the Debt Ceiling is.
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty PythonOne important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 205 by Phat, posted 03-20-2023 1:59 AM | | Phat has not replied |
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Phat
Member Posts: 17619 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: 12-30-2003 Member Rating: 1.1
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Re: Grinding America Down
He is not supportive. He is resigned to the fact that the progressives want to use it to fund their green ew deal! It’s Time to Look More Carefully at “Monetary Policy 3 (MP3)” and “Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)” more later
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 216 by Theodoric, posted 03-20-2023 4:09 PM | | Theodoric has replied |
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Theodoric
Member Posts: 8495 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: 08-15-2005 Member Rating: 2.9
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Message 219 of 283 (908814)
03-20-2023 9:32 PM
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Reply to: Message 218 by Phat
03-20-2023 8:45 PM
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Re: Grinding America Down
That is not what he said. Do you even know what MMT is?
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 218 by Phat, posted 03-20-2023 8:45 PM | | Phat has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 220 by Phat, posted 03-21-2023 1:08 PM | | Theodoric has replied |
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Phat
Member Posts: 17619 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: 12-30-2003 Member Rating: 1.1
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Re: Grinding America Down
Yes, ive read quite a lot about it. And I feel insulted that Dalio approves of it. He just wants to keep his 17 billion dollars afloat along with the rest of the funny money.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 219 by Theodoric, posted 03-20-2023 9:32 PM | | Theodoric has replied |
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Theodoric
Member Posts: 8495 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: 08-15-2005 Member Rating: 2.9
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Message 221 of 283 (908822)
03-21-2023 1:21 PM
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Reply to: Message 220 by Phat
03-21-2023 1:08 PM
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Re: Grinding America Down
So you lied. Again. So no longer a Dalio fan?
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 220 by Phat, posted 03-21-2023 1:08 PM | | Phat has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 222 by Phat, posted 03-21-2023 3:48 PM | | Theodoric has replied |
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Phat
Member Posts: 17619 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: 12-30-2003 Member Rating: 1.1
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Re: Grinding America Down
Im not a fan of people who support MMT. If Dalio supports it, he is indeed taken off of my list of trustworthy sources. There are several reasons why I am against it. Taken from this source: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT): Definition, History, and PrinciplesInvestopedia:
Core Principles of Modern Monetary Theory (MMT) The central idea of modern monetary theory is that governments with a fiat currency system under their control can and should print (or create with a few keystrokes in today’s digital age) as much money as they need to spend because they cannot go broke or be insolvent unless a political decision to do so is taken. (...) Some say such spending would be fiscally irresponsible, as the debt would balloon and inflation would skyrocket. But according to MMT:
- Large government debt isn’t the precursor to collapse that we have been led to believe it is;
- Countries like the U.S. can sustain much greater deficits without cause for concern; and
- A small deficit or surplus can be extremely harmful and cause a recession since deficit spending is what builds people’s savings.
MMT theorists explain that debt is simply money that the government put into the economy and didn’t tax back. They also argue that comparing a government’s budgets to that of an average household is a mistake. While supporters of modern monetary theory acknowledge that inflation is theoretically a possible outcome from such spending, they say it is highly unlikely and can be fought with policy decisions in the future if required.
Meanwhile, the BRICS nations plan on forming a new Global Reserve Currency backed by Gold, which China has been accumulating at an accelerating pace. In essence, the "temporary experiment" that Nixon started in 1971 will be ended by China, our primary competitor...while we play tiddly winks with fiat money backed by nothing.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 221 by Theodoric, posted 03-21-2023 1:21 PM | | Theodoric has replied |
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Tanypteryx
Member Posts: 4033 From: Oregon, USA Joined: 08-27-2006 Member Rating: 4.1
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Message 223 of 283 (908825)
03-21-2023 4:25 PM
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Reply to: Message 222 by Phat
03-21-2023 3:48 PM
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Re: Grinding America Down
Phat writes: Meanwhile, the BRICS nations plan on forming a new Global Reserve Currency backed by Gold, which China has been accumulating at an accelerating pace. In essence, the "temporary experiment" that Nixon started in 1971 will be ended by China, our primary competitor...while we play tiddly winks with fiat money backed by nothing. And what disastrous sequence of events are you predicting will occur because of "the BRICS nations plan or is it just all vague handwaving... "the sky is falling!"? And can you describe just what behavior you are labeling as playing tiddly winks? It seems to me that we have a functioning economy, you know, money being exchanged for goods and services in a society.
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty PythonOne important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 222 by Phat, posted 03-21-2023 3:48 PM | | Phat has not replied |
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Theodoric
Member Posts: 8495 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: 08-15-2005 Member Rating: 2.9
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Message 224 of 283 (908826)
03-21-2023 4:54 PM
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Reply to: Message 222 by Phat
03-21-2023 3:48 PM
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Re: Grinding America Down
There is not enough gold.
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 222 by Phat, posted 03-21-2023 3:48 PM | | Phat has not replied |
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Tanypteryx
Member Posts: 4033 From: Oregon, USA Joined: 08-27-2006 Member Rating: 4.1
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Re: Grinding America Down
I'm wondering why the Chinese are sharing all their plans with Phat? How does he know how much gold they have and how much they're buying and selling and that they are going to set up his perfect dream economy based on gold?
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty PythonOne important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 224 by Theodoric, posted 03-21-2023 4:54 PM | | Theodoric has not replied |
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