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Author Topic:   Phat's Bookshelf
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 136 of 174 (905022)
01-14-2023 5:16 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by Phat
01-14-2023 4:06 PM


Re: The Case For Faith (reexamined)
About Paul Jacobsen - Case Against Faith
He won't give his real name. Don't blame him.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by Phat, posted 01-14-2023 4:06 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 137 of 174 (905054)
01-15-2023 10:24 AM
Reply to: Message 134 by ringo
01-12-2023 11:28 AM


Phat's Bookshelf Expands. Recomendations Welcome!
Phat writes:
You and the peanut gallery may be left holding the bag.
ringo writes:
Which (AGAIN), you can not demonstrate.
Time itself will allow my demonstration to unfold. Nobody knows everything. I can at least admit as much. You guys need to be humbled once in awhile.
ringo writes:
Just try not to be so asininely wrong ALL the time.
ALL? That sounds like a bit of a hyperbole.
ringo writes:
Your guarantee is as worthless as the guarantee on the Hindenberg.
Thankfully your humor keeps us interested in this thread.
ringo writes:
You just deny, deny, deny like a devoted Trumpite.
I dont expect to be a devoted "Trumpite" anytime soon, though one of my conservative friends is trying to convert me!
He insisted that I read two books which are in my reading pile. I'll bring them up for dog-piling later, after I read them,
They are:
Ship Of Fools
The Case For Trump
I might not get to them for awhile...I have older books which come first.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by ringo, posted 01-12-2023 11:28 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 138 by ringo, posted 01-16-2023 11:38 AM Phat has replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20915
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 138 of 174 (905070)
01-16-2023 11:38 AM
Reply to: Message 137 by Phat
01-15-2023 10:24 AM


Re: Phat's Bookshelf Expands. Recomendations Welcome!
Phat writes:
Time itself will allow my demonstration to unfold.
Don't even waste time with stupid statements like that. ANYBODY can say the same thing about their own stupid ideas.
Phat writes:
Nobody knows everything. I can at least admit as much.
You just contradicted yourself again. You just claimed that "time itself" would demonstrate that you are right. That's the exact opposite of admitting you don't know everything.
Phat writes:
You guys need to be humbled once in awhile.
I was just humbled the other day, by xongsmith when I made a rash statement about global warming.
I expect to be humbled by smart people when I say something wrong. I am NOT humbled by foolish people saying something stupid.
Phat writes:
Just try not to be so asininely wrong ALL the time.ALL? That sounds like a bit of a hyperbole.
I don't feel like looking up the HTML entity for infinity.
Phat writes:
I dont expect to be a devoted "Trumpite" anytime soon...
I have asked you many times, why do you agree with him so often? Why don't you ever answer?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by Phat, posted 01-15-2023 10:24 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by Phat, posted 01-16-2023 12:06 PM ringo has replied
 Message 140 by Phat, posted 01-16-2023 12:10 PM ringo has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 139 of 174 (905074)
01-16-2023 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by ringo
01-16-2023 11:38 AM


Re: Phat's Bookshelf Expands. Recomendations Welcome!
I am NOT humbled by foolish people saying something stupid.
Wanna know what will save the world? Art and Music. The Left Brain. The right brain has been hijacked by rationality and data, which will soon marry artificial intelligence and morph into something nonhuman or inhuman.
Art, Music, Creativity and belief will outgun logic, reason, and data most every time. Your right brain came from the tree of knowledge. Your left brain comes from the tree of life.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by ringo, posted 01-16-2023 11:38 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by ringo, posted 01-16-2023 12:51 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 145 by Theodoric, posted 01-16-2023 3:16 PM Phat has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 140 of 174 (905076)
01-16-2023 12:10 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by ringo
01-16-2023 11:38 AM


Re: Phat's Bookshelf Expands. Recomendations Welcome!
ringo writes:
You just claimed that "time itself" would demonstrate that you are right. That's the exact opposite of admitting you don't know everything.
Nonsense. Humans have not been around all of the time nor will they be here at some point in time. "Time itself" is synonymous with infinity and/or infinite wisdom. Though I dont claim to have infinite wisdom, I feel that I can be in communion with infinite wisdom. This belief in no way means that I know when I will be right...since im a finite being.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by ringo, posted 01-16-2023 11:38 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 143 by ringo, posted 01-16-2023 12:54 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 141 of 174 (905077)
01-16-2023 12:28 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by ringo
01-12-2023 11:28 AM


Re: FANTASYLAND by Kurt Anderson
ringo writes:
The jury is in.
Not in my courtroom.
ringo:
Are you blind? How can you not see them?
John 12:40 writes:
"He has blinded their eyes
and deadened their hearts,
so they can neither see with their eyes,
nor understand with their hearts,
nor turn-and I would heal them."
2 Corinthians 4:4-6 writes:
2 Cor 4:4-6
4 The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. 5 For we do not preach ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus' sake. 6 For God, who said, "Let light shine out of darkness," made his light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ.
ringo writes:
Are you deaf? How can you not hear the verdict?
Rev 2:11 writes:
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt at all by the second death.
Rev 2:7 writes:
7 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes, I will give the right to eat from the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.
And as for the jury?
They are still out.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by ringo, posted 01-12-2023 11:28 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by ringo, posted 01-16-2023 1:00 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20915
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 142 of 174 (905079)
01-16-2023 12:51 PM
Reply to: Message 139 by Phat
01-16-2023 12:06 PM


Re: Phat's Bookshelf Expands. Recomendations Welcome!
Phat writes:
Art, Music, Creativity and belief will outgun logic, reason, and data most every time.
You didn't think for a split second before you said that, did you? You just decided to play Mr. Opposite. You might as well have said, "1 + 1 < 2 most every time."
Let's think about it now, shall we?
Where would art and music be without logoc, reason and data? The worms don't produce much in the way of art and music, do they?
Phat writes:
Your right brain came from the tree of knowledge. Your left brain comes from the tree of life.
That makes no sense. Right brain and left brain are inextricably intertwined. You can't pick one over the other.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 139 by Phat, posted 01-16-2023 12:06 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20915
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 143 of 174 (905080)
01-16-2023 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by Phat
01-16-2023 12:10 PM


Re: Phat's Bookshelf Expands. Recomendations Welcome!
Phat writes:
"Time itself" is synonymous with infinity and/or infinite wisdom.
No it isn't. Don't call what I say "nonsense" and then say something stupid like that.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Phat, posted 01-16-2023 12:10 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20915
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 144 of 174 (905081)
01-16-2023 1:00 PM
Reply to: Message 141 by Phat
01-16-2023 12:28 PM


Re: FANTASYLAND by Kurt Anderson
Phat writes:
And as for the jury?
They are still out.
Nope. In. Dismissed. Gone home.
And you have the unmitigated gall to quote from what you call a "dusty old book"?
And you have the multplied gall to quote from the Revelation? The most obfuscated pile of nonsense in the book?
Shame on you.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by Phat, posted 01-16-2023 12:28 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 145 of 174 (905090)
01-16-2023 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 139 by Phat
01-16-2023 12:06 PM


Re: Phat's Bookshelf Expands. Recomendations Welcome!
More stupid comments that are off topic.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 139 by Phat, posted 01-16-2023 12:06 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by Phat, posted 01-19-2023 1:57 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 146 of 174 (905137)
01-19-2023 1:57 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by Theodoric
01-16-2023 3:16 PM


The War On The West
Theo writes:
More stupid comments that are off topic.
The Grinch has spoken. Now on to the next book on the shelf.
The War On The West. I cant say enough about this book. I recommend reading the diverse comments from others on this book,(IN the link) but will quote from the book itself under this subtitle.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Theodoric, posted 01-16-2023 3:16 PM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 151 by PaulK, posted 01-19-2023 9:49 AM Phat has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 147 of 174 (905139)
01-19-2023 3:22 AM


The War On The West Chapter One
Chapter One: Race
Chapter One:
There is an obvious, observable truth about people in the West. Historically the citizens of Europe and their offspring societies in the Americas and Australasia have been white. (...)In the war on the West, white people are one of the first subjects of attack. A fact that has been steadily normalized and made into the only acceptable form of racism in the societies in which it happens. To demonize the West, it appears to be necessary first to demonize the people who still make up the racial majority in the West.
Chapter One goes on to discuss the evolution of CRT(Critical Race Theory) and of its effects on society-at-large. Many progressives have been bamboozled through CRT.
Chapter One writes:
...one of the distinguishing marks of CRT was that its assertions were based not on evidence, as it might previously been understood, but essentially on interpretations and attitudes. (...)the rules of CRT had no need for normal standards of evidence. If a person's "lived experience" could be attested to, then the question of "evidence" or "data" had to find a place further back in the queue, if at all.
In other words, it became "sufficient to fall back simply on the evidence of one's own perceptions". Theodoric has yet to explain why one cannot be racist against white people. I await his scintillating logic!
AddByEdit:
Here are the Chapters:
quote:
Chapter 1: Race
01:14:07
Chapter 1: Race, Continued
01:10:48
Interlude: China
47:45
Chapter 2: History
01:16:06
Chapter 2: History, Continued
01:16:02
Interlude: Reparations
Chapter 3: Religion
01:03:22
Chapter 3: Religion, Continued
01:15:14
Interlude: Gratitude
31:37
Chapter 4: Culture
49:48
Chapter 4: Culture, Continued
01:02:49
Conclusion
52:48

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by Theodoric, posted 01-19-2023 8:22 AM Phat has replied
 Message 154 by Taq, posted 01-19-2023 10:49 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 157 by Theodoric, posted 01-19-2023 11:40 AM Phat has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 148 of 174 (905143)
01-19-2023 8:22 AM
Reply to: Message 147 by Phat
01-19-2023 3:22 AM


Re: The War On The West Chapter One
Here is why you racism and books like this are so stupid. You and the author are racists.
Race and ethnicity are solely cultural constructs. Yes, we can genetically measure % of ancestry but how do we accurately define race.
A prime example is my heritage. My father was born in Puerto Rico, to a very Puerto Rican family. I do not have his DNA profile, but I do have mine and I have the DNA profile of a maternal uncle. From that, we can make a large number of assumptions. Hopefully one of my Puerto Rican relatives will have their profile done to do a comparison also.
One thing that makes this analysis easier is that my parents had almost zero genetic overlap. There is a possibility my father had a tiny bit of English ancestry but that is it. My mother's ancestry is English, Scottish and Irish. Nothing more. This is confirmed by looking at my maternal uncle's DNA.
Therefore, whatever other DNA heritage I have comes from my father. Here is where it gets interesting. My father was the whitest looking man you would have ever seen. He was practically see-through. People always say that I don't look Puerto Rican. I don't mention my father, I just tell them that Puerto Ricans look like anyone you see walking in the USA. We are pale white to darkest black and everything in between and to the sides. In my family alone we run the gamut of colors and "races". Yes even Asian and for the anti-semites, even Jews.
My father was, approximately 55-60% Spanish, Portuguese, Basque, and 12-15% English and Welsh. He was also approximately 20-25% Taino(indigenous) and 12-15% African. What does this make him racially? What does this make me racially? According to the slave laws of the old south, I could be enslaved. According to the one-drop rule which was in place in many places prior to 1967, I would be considered black. Prior to Loving vs Virginia which is after my birth, in some states my parents could not be legally married and in fact, they would be guilty of a felony. In fact, I would not be able to marry my wife prior to Loving in a number of states.
But for us, it was different than for a lot of other people. We are white looking. Genetically, we probably have more African and Indigenous DNA than some people that are classically black and indigenous looking.
The point of this screed is that it is all just a social construct. You have no idea what the DNA history is of the person you are talking to. We are all the same but we are all different.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by Phat, posted 01-19-2023 3:22 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by Phat, posted 01-19-2023 9:14 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 149 of 174 (905146)
01-19-2023 9:14 AM
Reply to: Message 148 by Theodoric
01-19-2023 8:22 AM


Re: The War On The West Chapter One
That's all rather interesting but where do you get the idea that the author of the book was racist?
The point of this screed is that it is all just a social construct. You have no idea what the DNA history is of the person you are talking to. We are all the same but we are all different.
So you dismiss his observations and conclusions?

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by Theodoric, posted 01-19-2023 8:22 AM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by Theodoric, posted 01-19-2023 9:30 AM Phat has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 150 of 174 (905148)
01-19-2023 9:30 AM
Reply to: Message 149 by Phat
01-19-2023 9:14 AM


Re: The War On The West Chapter One
The premise of his argument is fallacious and racist. His previous writings are racist. The snippets you posted are racist.
I do not need to read read racist arguments to dismiss the observations and conclusions.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by Phat, posted 01-19-2023 9:14 AM Phat has not replied

  
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