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Author Topic:   The Changing World Order
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2235
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 4.4


(2)
Message 226 of 264 (904215)
12-23-2022 11:51 AM
Reply to: Message 213 by Tanypteryx
12-22-2022 8:46 PM


Re: Candace Over AOC
The funny thing is he chose Rep. Ocasio-Cortez, who makes Phat look braindead.
and no matter how much he wishes she and Kamala Harris are never going to drag him out of his house, march him to the town square, pull down his pants and point and laugh at his tiny dick.

It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 213 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-22-2022 8:46 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 228 by Phat, posted 12-23-2022 1:34 PM DrJones* has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


(4)
Message 227 of 264 (904223)
12-23-2022 12:15 PM
Reply to: Message 217 by Phat
12-23-2022 1:44 AM


Re: Candace Over AOC
but all of that stuff that you quote vilifying Candace Owens is Liberal propaganda
Factual data is not propaganda.
So why did you bring Rep Ocasio-Cortez into this? Why did you feel to bring her into the conversation? Why do you think it is fair to compare Candace Owens to her?
Quit blaming blood sugar. Back your claims and hate with facts and data or run away and crawl back under your rock.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by Phat, posted 12-23-2022 1:44 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 228 of 264 (904243)
12-23-2022 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 226 by DrJones*
12-23-2022 11:51 AM


Re: Candace Over AOC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 226 by DrJones*, posted 12-23-2022 11:51 AM DrJones* has not replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 3976
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 10.0


(9)
Message 229 of 264 (904244)
12-23-2022 1:47 PM
Reply to: Message 217 by Phat
12-23-2022 1:44 AM


Re: Candace Over AOC
Phat, the American right has been going full mask-off fascist for years now. I'm not sure what you consider to be "authoritarianism," but it sounds like your definition would differ quite strongly from mine. I want the most freedom for the most people, and there is a very clear "lesser evil" among the two American political parties. Hint: it is not the Republicans.
But seriously, the Republicans are full fascist, particularly the Trump faction. The more "traditional" Republicans are at best trying to wait out the fascists while preserving their own power and dont have an actual problem with it. People like Candace Owens, Jordan Peterson, and Im sure other people you might hold in esteem are among the fascists.
Fascism (and authoritarianism) is not "a government I dont like." It isnt even "a government with too many rules that restrict my freedom," though the political party seeking to restrict freedoms is the Republican party anyway.
Fascism has a set of characteristics. Both the Republicans and the Democrats meet some of these, to different degrees. The Democrats in general are fascist-lite. Reason to be concerned. The Trump-wing Republicans are full Nazi. Godwin's Law be damned, we're literally seeing the rise of fascism in the US, and it echoes its rise in Germany after WW1 with terrifying precision.
The 14 Characteristics of Fascism, by Lawrence Britt, Spring 2003
Powerful and Continuing Nationalism
"America first" has been the American-fascist slogan since forever. "Christian Nationalists" should sound familiar.
Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights
Again American conservatives are clearly embracing this one. They've supported overturning Roe v Wade forever. Theyre currently fearmongering against Trans rights (which are human rights). They've often supported literal actual torture (waterboarding, other "enhanced interrogation" techniques). They deny people their rights at the border (for all the panic about "caravans," these people were actually using the legal process they were entitled to - you present yourself at a border for consideration for refugee status, there's nothing illegal there).
Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause
Today the Trans community appears to be the primary scapegoat. The very people you've mentioned as respecting promote anti-Trans propaganda. Tans people are not "groomers." Drag performers (who are mostly not Trans anyway) are not "groomers."
Supremacy of the Military
Do I even need to say anything here? Both parties are guilty of this one, but the Trump wing tries to go even further.
Rampant Sexism
Jordan Peterson is a good example of a manosphere misogynist. There are plenty of other examples. Democrats can be sexist too, but Republicans make the oppression of women through the enforcement of rigid traditional gender roles a party platform.
Controlled Mass Media
Trump and his cronies have been setting up their own media platforms for a while now, to out-fascist even Fox News. The news media in America has always been problematic - they're more about preserving the status quo, maintaining existing power structures and manufacturing consent, than about actually informing the public - but the outrage-fueled modern 24-hr news media has been leaning harder and harder to the right.
Obsession with National Security
Ironic that Trump, arguably the largest threat to national security in our country's history, has always clamored for more authority to punish people for endangering it. Both the Republicans and Democrats love this one though - always wanting more police authority to strengthen the surveillance state.
Religion and Government are Intertwined
Christian Nationalists, again. The Democrats at least want actual religious freedom, meaning they support everyone's right to believe or not believe according to the dictates of their own conscience, and they recognize that this means government needs to just stay out of the matter. The Republicans only respect the freedom to worship Jesus however you please, and actively seek to ensconce their religious beliefs in law. The Trumpists are literally the American Taliban. They want the Christian version of Sharia Law.
Corporate Power is Protected
Both the Republicans and the Democrats are guilty here. America is an oligarchy more than anything else; especially since Citizens United (but before that too), the wealthy play both sides of the political aisle.
This is why there are no actual socialists in American government, Phat, no matter what Fox News has told you.
Labor Power is Suppressed
Both parties again, but again the Republicans are worse. American union movements have stagnated, in part because our labor protection laws are pathetic.
Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts
The Trump wing wins "bigly" here as well.
Obsession with Crime and Punishment
"Law and order" anyone?
Rampant Cronyism and Corruption
For all the conservative winging about Hunter Biden and his sinister laptop, Hunter has never actually held any US government office.
Trump was all about appointing family to government positions. And his management style is the textbook definition of cronyism.
Fraudulent Elections
Trump and conservatives literally tried to overthrow a legal election by claiming a non-fraudulent election was fraudulent, simply because he lost. And he knew he lost. And he admitted he knew he lost, and lied about it anyway.
America has been sinking into fascism for years now. The Democrats are fascist-lite. The Republicans are completely fascist.
Phat, you "respect" literal fascists.
Back in 1945 the Dept of the Army made a propaganda film as a reaction to the American fascist movements around WW2. There was a real chance America could have sided with the Nazis back then. There was an American Nazi party.
There is now, too. They just use different names.
Dont be a sucker.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGAqYNFQdZ4&t
EDIT to add another video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83mtXbwPNkc
Another excellent rundown of the 14 characteristics, as well as the 10 stages of fascism, which I didnt cover.

“The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.” - Francis Bacon

"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers

“A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity.” – Albert Camus

"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." - Barash, David 1995...

"Many that live deserve death. And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then be not too eager to deal out death in the name of justice, fearing for your own safety. Even the wise cannot see all ends." - Gandalf, J. R. R. Tolkien: The Lord Of the Rings

"The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death."
1 Corinthians 15:26King James Version (KJV)

Nihil supernum


This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by Phat, posted 12-23-2022 1:44 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 232 by ringo, posted 12-31-2022 12:23 PM Rahvin has not replied
 Message 255 by Phat, posted 01-11-2023 11:59 AM Rahvin has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 3773
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 230 of 264 (904498)
12-30-2022 11:18 PM


George Santos, Republican Pride
It looks like a pretty slamdunk case of a candidate defrauding his voters. And the Republicans are celebrating another rising star.
George Santos

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


Replies to this message:
 Message 231 by AZPaul3, posted 12-30-2022 11:34 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 7508
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 231 of 264 (904500)
12-30-2022 11:34 PM
Reply to: Message 230 by Tanypteryx
12-30-2022 11:18 PM


Re: George Santos, Republican Pride
Well if full-on treason won't move the republicans then this kid fibbing a bit to voters is really just nitpicky stuff.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 230 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-30-2022 11:18 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20915
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 232 of 264 (904520)
12-31-2022 12:23 PM
Reply to: Message 229 by Rahvin
12-23-2022 1:47 PM


Re: Candace Over AOC
Rahvin writes:
The more "traditional" Republicans are at best trying to wait out the fascists while preserving their own power...
People need to read the history of the Weimar Republic.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 229 by Rahvin, posted 12-23-2022 1:47 PM Rahvin has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 233 of 264 (904547)
12-31-2022 6:32 PM
Reply to: Message 208 by Phat
12-22-2022 5:07 AM


Re: Candace Over AOC
Still waiting.
Why did you feel the need to compare her with Rep. Ocasio-Cortez? AOC had nothing to do with the conversation.
Curious why you would link them.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 208 by Phat, posted 12-22-2022 5:07 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 234 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-31-2022 7:41 PM Theodoric has replied
 Message 237 by Phat, posted 01-01-2023 1:55 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 3773
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 234 of 264 (904548)
12-31-2022 7:41 PM
Reply to: Message 233 by Theodoric
12-31-2022 6:32 PM


Re: Candace Over AOC
AOC had nothing to do with the conversation. Curious why you would link them.
Because, like all good Republicans he never passes up an opportunity at character assassination of every liberal.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 233 by Theodoric, posted 12-31-2022 6:32 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 235 by Theodoric, posted 12-31-2022 11:16 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


(1)
Message 235 of 264 (904549)
12-31-2022 11:16 PM
Reply to: Message 234 by Tanypteryx
12-31-2022 7:41 PM


Re: Candace Over AOC
And he is a fucking racist.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 234 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-31-2022 7:41 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 236 by Phat, posted 01-01-2023 1:49 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 236 of 264 (904550)
01-01-2023 1:49 AM
Reply to: Message 235 by Theodoric
12-31-2022 11:16 PM


Re: Candace Over AOC
I can tell that you are a racist--against conservative white males. But of course you have an explanation for that, don't you? I myself admit to having certain prejudices in life, but have never seen myself as racist. I do prefer conservative women over liberal women. In general. Liberal women want to take over. (Prejudice much?)

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 235 by Theodoric, posted 12-31-2022 11:16 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 239 by Theodoric, posted 01-01-2023 2:16 AM Phat has replied
 Message 244 by ringo, posted 01-02-2023 11:40 AM Phat has not replied
 Message 247 by DrJones*, posted 01-02-2023 7:51 PM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 237 of 264 (904551)
01-01-2023 1:55 AM
Reply to: Message 233 by Theodoric
12-31-2022 6:32 PM


Re: Candace Over AOC
Why did you feel the need to compare her with Rep. Ocasio-Cortez? AOC had nothing to do with the conversation.
Curious why you would link them.
I felt and was trying to show that the conservatives have every bit as articulate and smart females as the Democrats do. Nothing more.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 233 by Theodoric, posted 12-31-2022 6:32 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 238 by Theodoric, posted 01-01-2023 2:14 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


(1)
Message 238 of 264 (904552)
01-01-2023 2:14 AM
Reply to: Message 237 by Phat
01-01-2023 1:55 AM


Re: Candace Over AOC
But AOC is a member of Congress. Candace Owens is a grifter. Why did you pick APC a d not a white person?

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 237 by Phat, posted 01-01-2023 1:55 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 8140
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


(1)
Message 239 of 264 (904553)
01-01-2023 2:16 AM
Reply to: Message 236 by Phat
01-01-2023 1:49 AM


Re: Candace Over AOC
Maybe you should learn what racism means. I can not be racist against conservative white males. I will let you figure out why.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 236 by Phat, posted 01-01-2023 1:49 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 240 by Phat, posted 01-01-2023 2:38 AM Theodoric has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 17111
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 240 of 264 (904554)
01-01-2023 2:38 AM
Reply to: Message 239 by Theodoric
01-01-2023 2:16 AM


Re: Candace Over AOC
No, you made the charge. Explain to *me* why I am racist against God knows who and you are innocent of racism against me. I will be awaiting your claim of identity politics or some other term that I need to understand. At worst I might be guilty of sexism.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 239 by Theodoric, posted 01-01-2023 2:16 AM Theodoric has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 245 by ringo, posted 01-02-2023 11:53 AM Phat has not replied

  
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