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Author Topic:   The Problem of Suffering
Greatest I am
Member
Posts: 1615
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 76 of 107 (898518)
09-25-2022 3:24 PM
Reply to: Message 73 by Phat
09-25-2022 2:58 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
I do as I am moved to do.
I chose that name near the time of my apotheosis.
I know, like Jesus did, that I would be hated by many, and it was my tong in cheek way of trying to get known.
I also goes well with my avatar, Kaa, --- defined as soul by Egypt -- and adorned Moses' staff etc.
I use such to inform the less educated, which leads to questions.
Regards
DL

This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 2:58 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Greatest I am
Member
Posts: 1615
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 77 of 107 (898521)
09-25-2022 3:28 PM
Reply to: Message 74 by ringo
09-25-2022 3:07 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
That is what intelligence creates.
You would have us be less than the low man who used a flint knife, and with even less intelligence.
You would make stones.
Not verry entertaining life that.
Regards
DL

This message is a reply to:
 Message 74 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:07 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 79 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:39 PM Greatest I am has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 78 of 107 (898522)
09-25-2022 3:36 PM
Reply to: Message 75 by Greatest I am
09-25-2022 3:16 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
I will look at your OP but I am no longer an administrator.
I personally am not a dualist. I am more in line with Ellis Potter.
3 Theories Of Everything by Ellis Potter

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 75 by Greatest I am, posted 09-25-2022 3:16 PM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Greatest I am, posted 09-25-2022 4:03 PM Phat has replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20492
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 79 of 107 (898523)
09-25-2022 3:39 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by Greatest I am
09-25-2022 3:28 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
Greatest I am writes:
Not verry entertaining life that.
I am an omnivore but I don't get my entertainment from killing and eating my fellow creatures.

"Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg.
What's going on? Where are all the friends I had?
It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong.
Give me back, give me back my Leningrad."
-- Leningrad Cowboys

This message is a reply to:
 Message 77 by Greatest I am, posted 09-25-2022 3:28 PM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 3:44 PM ringo has replied
 Message 93 by Greatest I am, posted 09-25-2022 4:04 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 80 of 107 (898526)
09-25-2022 3:42 PM
Reply to: Message 74 by ringo
09-25-2022 3:07 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
Greatest I am writes:
What does your stagnant imagined realm produce or evolve into?
ringo writes:
Why does it need to produce anything? Why does it need to evolve into anything?
Because we are not efficient as a species where we are at now. What do you envision humans "evolving into"?
As far as producing something, you and I might agree that humans could produce more love and empathy.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 74 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:07 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 82 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:44 PM Phat has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 81 of 107 (898527)
09-25-2022 3:44 PM
Reply to: Message 79 by ringo
09-25-2022 3:39 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
ringo writes:
I am an omnivore but I don't get my entertainment from killing and eating my fellow creatures.
How about blowing up their buildings and themselves and taking their food? *cough*Ukraine War*cough*
One would think that humans need to evolve from producing ever better weapons of war.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:39 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 84 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:49 PM Phat has replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20492
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 82 of 107 (898528)
09-25-2022 3:44 PM
Reply to: Message 80 by Phat
09-25-2022 3:42 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
Phat writes:
Because we are not efficient as a species where we are at now.
How are we not efficient as a species?
Phat writes:
What do you envision humans "evolving into"?
It would be a disservice to evolution to try to predict where it will go.

"Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg.
What's going on? Where are all the friends I had?
It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong.
Give me back, give me back my Leningrad."
-- Leningrad Cowboys

This message is a reply to:
 Message 80 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 3:42 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 83 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 3:47 PM ringo has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 83 of 107 (898529)
09-25-2022 3:47 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by ringo
09-25-2022 3:44 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
ringo writes:
How are we not efficient as a species?
(I have to go to work so I will continue this later) Look at the Ukraine War that I mentioned above. Is that "efficient"?
ringo writes:
It would be a disservice to evolution to try to predict where it will go.
Disservice??!! Since when should we "serve" evolution? You seem to think that we will evolve into people with starships exploring an unknown universe! We have yet to clean up our own house here!!

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 82 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:44 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 85 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:50 PM Phat has replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20492
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 84 of 107 (898530)
09-25-2022 3:49 PM
Reply to: Message 81 by Phat
09-25-2022 3:44 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
Phat writes:
One would think that humans need to evolve from producing ever better weapons of war.
Weapons of ware are not the problem. Conveniences like plastic water bottles are the problem. We are just getting to the point in our history where more people are dying from the consequences of convenience than from war.

"Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg.
What's going on? Where are all the friends I had?
It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong.
Give me back, give me back my Leningrad."
-- Leningrad Cowboys

This message is a reply to:
 Message 81 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 3:44 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 86 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 3:51 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20492
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 85 of 107 (898531)
09-25-2022 3:50 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by Phat
09-25-2022 3:47 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
Phat writes:
Look at the Ukraine War that I mentioned above. Is that "efficient"?
What has that got to do with the efficiency of the species?
Phat writes:
Disservice??!! Since when should we "serve" evolution?
Don't be stupid. Look up "disservice".
Phat writes:
You seem to think that we will evolve into people with starships exploring an unknown universe!
How many times do I have to tell you that we can not predict evolution?

"Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg.
What's going on? Where are all the friends I had?
It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong.
Give me back, give me back my Leningrad."
-- Leningrad Cowboys

This message is a reply to:
 Message 83 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 3:47 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 87 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 3:52 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied
 Message 102 by Phat, posted 09-27-2022 3:20 PM ringo has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 86 of 107 (898532)
09-25-2022 3:51 PM
Reply to: Message 84 by ringo
09-25-2022 3:49 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
You DO know that the whole Climate Change argument centers on who gets to try and clean it up---private enterprise or public government, of which you love and serve (as long as they are Liberals)

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 84 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:49 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 88 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:56 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 87 of 107 (898533)
09-25-2022 3:52 PM
Reply to: Message 85 by ringo
09-25-2022 3:50 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
ringo writes:
What has that got to do with the efficiency of the species?
I'll address this question later. Off to work.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 85 by ringo, posted 09-25-2022 3:50 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20492
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 88 of 107 (898535)
09-25-2022 3:56 PM
Reply to: Message 86 by Phat
09-25-2022 3:51 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
Phat writes:
You DO know that the whole Climate Change argument centers on who gets to try and clean it up---private enterprise or public government, of which you love and serve (as long as they are Liberals)
1. Stop trying to change the subject.
2. Your hatred of government and Liberals is noted.

"Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg.
What's going on? Where are all the friends I had?
It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong.
Give me back, give me back my Leningrad."
-- Leningrad Cowboys

This message is a reply to:
 Message 86 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 3:51 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 89 of 107 (898537)
09-25-2022 3:58 PM
Reply to: Message 75 by Greatest I am
09-25-2022 3:16 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
I don't believe in Dualism, however. Like Ellis Potter, (former Buddhist) I am a Trinitarian Monotheist.
3 Theories Of Everything by Ellis Potter

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 75 by Greatest I am, posted 09-25-2022 3:16 PM Greatest I am has not replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 20492
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 90 of 107 (898538)
09-25-2022 4:00 PM
Reply to: Message 72 by Phat
09-25-2022 2:55 PM


Re: The Problem Of Evil
Phat writes:
Remember "It's A Wonderful Life?"
I do. And you didn't reply to what you quoted.

"Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg.
What's going on? Where are all the friends I had?
It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong.
Give me back, give me back my Leningrad."
-- Leningrad Cowboys

This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by Phat, posted 09-25-2022 2:55 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
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