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Author Topic:   Rebuttal To Creationists - "Since We Can't Directly Observe Evolution..."
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8513
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.3


(5)
Message 2656 of 2926 (904394)
12-28-2022 4:38 PM


Forewarned.
Note the respondent did not dispute the accuracy of the warning.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

Replies to this message:
 Message 2657 by Kleinman, posted 12-28-2022 6:00 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 336 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 2657 of 2926 (904395)
12-28-2022 6:00 PM
Reply to: Message 2656 by AZPaul3
12-28-2022 4:38 PM


Re: Forewarned.
AZPaul3:
Note the respondent did not dispute the accuracy of the warning.
How can I dispute AZPaul3. He knows much more about probability theory than the peer-reviewers and editors of Statistics in Medicine. And AZPaul3's explanation of biological evolution is crystal clear. In fact, it is invisible. He knows as much about how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail as do biologists. Nothing!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2656 by AZPaul3, posted 12-28-2022 4:38 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2658 by Phat, posted 12-29-2022 9:17 AM Kleinman has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 2658 of 2926 (904416)
12-29-2022 9:17 AM
Reply to: Message 2657 by Kleinman
12-28-2022 6:00 PM


Re: Forewarned.
The problem is,(or seems to be) that you always insist on framing the argument.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2657 by Kleinman, posted 12-28-2022 6:00 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2659 by Kleinman, posted 12-29-2022 9:51 AM Phat has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 336 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 2659 of 2926 (904420)
12-29-2022 9:51 AM
Reply to: Message 2658 by Phat
12-29-2022 9:17 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Phat:
The problem is,(or seems to be) that you always insist on framing the argument.
Yeah, right, like I did the Kishony and Lenski experiments. You've got a bunch of numbskulls claiming that reptiles evolved into birds and fish evolved into mammals millions of years ago and you have real, measurable, and repeatable experiments that demonstrate how evolution actually works. Choose your frame.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2658 by Phat, posted 12-29-2022 9:17 AM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2660 by ringo, posted 12-30-2022 11:59 AM Kleinman has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 2660 of 2926 (904474)
12-30-2022 11:59 AM
Reply to: Message 2659 by Kleinman
12-29-2022 9:51 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
You've got a bunch of numbskulls claiming that reptiles evolved into birds and fish evolved into mammals millions of years ago....
The only numbskull saying that is you.
I have tried to explain to you mathematically that what science says is A → B and A → C, whereas YOU and ONLY you are saying that B → C. Why do you not understand that those are two different things? How can you even dare to talk about mathematics when you don't understand such a simple fact of mathematics?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2659 by Kleinman, posted 12-29-2022 9:51 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2661 by Kleinman, posted 12-30-2022 12:16 PM ringo has replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 336 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 2661 of 2926 (904475)
12-30-2022 12:16 PM
Reply to: Message 2660 by ringo
12-30-2022 11:59 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman:
You've got a bunch of numbskulls claiming that reptiles evolved into birds and fish evolved into mammals millions of years ago....
ringo:
The only numbskull saying that is you.

ringo is a liar, a fake cowboy, and a fake mathematician who doesn't know how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. Go Google that you dumbass fake. Is everyone in this bunch of numbskulls as dumb as ringo? The only thing real about ringo is he is a dummy. That's your cue to post about five messages that say nothing but fill space.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2660 by ringo, posted 12-30-2022 11:59 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2662 by ringo, posted 12-30-2022 12:34 PM Kleinman has replied
 Message 2665 by Phat, posted 12-31-2022 2:27 AM Kleinman has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 2662 of 2926 (904476)
12-30-2022 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 2661 by Kleinman
12-30-2022 12:16 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
ringo is a liar...
Go ahead and point out anything I've said that isn't true.
Kleinman writes:
... a fake cowboy...
A fake girl maybe....
Kleinman writes:
...and a fake mathematician...
Well. Kleinman is the one who won't acknowledge that A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C. So... Kelinman either:
1. Doesn't understand simple mathematics, OR
2. Is too cowardly to admit that he's wrong about evolution, OR
3. Is just a slimy troll who will say ANYTHING, no matter how stupid, just to get attention.
Kleinman writes:
Is everyone in this bunch of numbskulls as dumb as ringo?
There are many people here who are smarter than me. All of them understand that A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C. None of them has challenged me on that simple fact.
YOU, on the other hand, do NOT understand that A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C. Therefore, YOU are dumber than me.
Kleinman writes:
That's your cue to post about five messages that say nothing but fill space.
As I have already mentioned, I don't follow instructions well, so I will say this five times in ONE message:
Kishony and Lenski and Desai, oh my!
Kishony and Lenski and Desai, oh my!
Kishony and Lenski and Desai, oh my!
Kishony and Lenski and Desai, oh my!
Kishony and Lenski and Desai, oh my!
(whic is all YOU have posted in 1600 messages.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2661 by Kleinman, posted 12-30-2022 12:16 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2663 by Kleinman, posted 12-30-2022 12:58 PM ringo has replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 336 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 2663 of 2926 (904478)
12-30-2022 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 2662 by ringo
12-30-2022 12:34 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman:
ringo is a liar...
ringo:
Go ahead and point out anything I've said that isn't true.

Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals. You must be one of those fake cowboys who tell tall tales. Tell us all about those fake transitions you have. And you still don't know how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2662 by ringo, posted 12-30-2022 12:34 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2664 by xongsmith, posted 12-31-2022 12:59 AM Kleinman has replied
 Message 2668 by ringo, posted 12-31-2022 10:56 AM Kleinman has replied

  
xongsmith
Member
Posts: 2578
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 6.8


(2)
Message 2664 of 2926 (904502)
12-31-2022 12:59 AM
Reply to: Message 2663 by Kleinman
12-30-2022 12:58 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinbottle writes:
Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals. You must be one of those fake cowboys who tell tall tales. Tell us all about those fake transitions you have. And you still don't know how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.
you can't find your way out of the bottle you are in,
bye bye.

"I'm the Grim Reaper now, Mitch. Step aside."
Death to #TzarVladimirtheCondemned!
Enjoy every sandwich!

- xongsmith, 5.7dawkins scale


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2663 by Kleinman, posted 12-30-2022 12:58 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2666 by dwise1, posted 12-31-2022 4:51 AM xongsmith has not replied
 Message 2667 by Kleinman, posted 12-31-2022 9:55 AM xongsmith has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 2665 of 2926 (904503)
12-31-2022 2:27 AM
Reply to: Message 2661 by Kleinman
12-30-2022 12:16 PM


Re: Forewarned.
This is uncalled for. Forum Guidelines
Teasing each other is one thing. Insulting one another is off limits.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2661 by Kleinman, posted 12-30-2022 12:16 PM Kleinman has not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


(2)
Message 2666 of 2926 (904505)
12-31-2022 4:51 AM
Reply to: Message 2664 by xongsmith
12-31-2022 12:59 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinbottle writes:
Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals. You must be one of those fake cowboys who tell tall tales. Tell us all about those fake transitions you have. And you still don't know how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.
you can't find your way out of the bottle you are in,
And he still cannot ever tell us how the Internet works, nor computers, etc. So then according to him none of that works?
At least that's what I keep getting from him. That until absolutely everybody knows how everything works, then none of it could possibly work? Is it just me, or isn't that what he's been insisting on so fervently to everybody?
Complete and utter bullshit!
OBTW, your reference to the Klein bottle. It's basically the 3-D equivalent to the Möbius strip in that a Klein bottle has no differentiation between the outside and the inside of the same bottle. Which I guess means that it must be devoid of any actual content.
So by referring to "Little Man" as "Klein bottle", you are classifying him as devoid of content.
OK, that certainly does fit. Cool!
The cultural footnote is that Clifford Stoll later become interested in constructing Klein bottles.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2664 by xongsmith, posted 12-31-2022 12:59 AM xongsmith has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 336 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 2667 of 2926 (904507)
12-31-2022 9:55 AM
Reply to: Message 2664 by xongsmith
12-31-2022 12:59 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman:
Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals. You must be one of those fake cowboys who tell tall tales. Tell us all about those fake transitions you have. And you still don't know how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.
xongsmith:
you can't find your way out of the bottle you are in,

bye bye.

This isn't going to be one of those long good byes, is it? And obviously, you aren't going to explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail, so I'll help you on your way out the door. For a single selection pressure:
The basic science and mathematics of random mutation and natural selection
And for multiple simultaneous selection pressures:
The mathematics of random mutation and natural selection for multiple simultaneous selection pressures and the evolution of antimicrobial drug resistance
That's your cue AZPaul3.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2664 by xongsmith, posted 12-31-2022 12:59 AM xongsmith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2671 by AZPaul3, posted 12-31-2022 12:29 PM Kleinman has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 2668 of 2926 (904509)
12-31-2022 10:56 AM
Reply to: Message 2663 by Kleinman
12-30-2022 12:58 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
ringo writes:
Go ahead and point out anything I've said that isn't true.
Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals.
That' is correct. They don't.
Reptiles and birds evolved from a common ancestor. Fish and mammals evolved from a common ancestor.
You and your cousin descended from a common ancestor. Your cousin did not descend from you.
I have tried to explain it to you mathematically: B descended from A and C descended from A. That does NOT mean that C descended from B.
But you don't understand the math.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2663 by Kleinman, posted 12-30-2022 12:58 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2669 by Kleinman, posted 12-31-2022 11:50 AM ringo has replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 336 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 2669 of 2926 (904517)
12-31-2022 11:50 AM
Reply to: Message 2668 by ringo
12-31-2022 10:56 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman:
Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals.
ringo:
Go ahead and point out anything I've said that isn't true.
ringo:
That' is correct. They don't.

Reptiles and birds evolved from a common ancestor. Fish and mammals evolved from a common ancestor.

You and your cousin descended from a common ancestor. Your cousin did not descend from you.

I have tried to explain it to you mathematically: B descended from A and C descended from A. That does NOT mean that C descended from B.

But you don't understand the math.


The fake cowboy and fake mathematician knows how evolution worked millions of years ago but can't explain how evolution works today. That includes explaining how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. If you understand the math, explain it. But you don't, you are a fake.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2668 by ringo, posted 12-31-2022 10:56 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2670 by ringo, posted 12-31-2022 12:13 PM Kleinman has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 2670 of 2926 (904519)
12-31-2022 12:13 PM
Reply to: Message 2669 by Kleinman
12-31-2022 11:50 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
The fake cowboy and fake mathematician...
I'm more of a mathematician than you. You don't understand that A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C.
Kleinman writes:
... knows how evolution worked millions of years ago but can't explain how evolution works today.
You're getting ahead of yourself. You need to demonstrate that you have an inkling of an understanding of evolution before anybody is going to answer your inane questions.
Demonstrate that you understand that A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C and THEN I will try to explain to you how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.
Kleinman writes:
If you understand the math, explain it.
I have already pointed out YOUR misunderstanding of the math, twice in this post alone. YOU need to explain it before anybody can take you seriously.
But you don't, you are a fake.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2669 by Kleinman, posted 12-31-2022 11:50 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2672 by Kleinman, posted 12-31-2022 12:46 PM ringo has replied

  
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