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Author Topic:   Coffee House Musings on Creationist Topic Proposals
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2088
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1126 of 1249 (902370)
11-22-2022 4:01 PM
Reply to: Message 1122 by AZPaul3
11-21-2022 7:22 PM


Re: UCD evidence
APauling writes:
And since you're a cracker munchin' catholic with delusions of Genesis poisoning your brain, anything you say on the subject is, entertaining, but ultimately intellectually useless.
APauling nonsense. How did you manage to get reality so so wrong?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1122 by AZPaul3, posted 11-21-2022 7:22 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 7324
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 1127 of 1249 (902376)
11-22-2022 6:20 PM
Reply to: Message 1125 by Dredge
11-22-2022 3:59 PM


Re: UCD evidence
Are you saying that, if I get a Covid jab, it won't work bcoz I don't accept "the fact of UCD"?
The fact you can't accept common descent is an intellectual failure. The jab will work, precisely because of common descent, regardless of what your injured brain is fantasizing.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1125 by Dredge, posted 11-22-2022 3:59 PM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1128 by Dredge, posted 11-22-2022 10:50 PM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 1164 by Dredge, posted 11-26-2022 11:31 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2088
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1128 of 1249 (902379)
11-22-2022 10:50 PM
Reply to: Message 1127 by AZPaul3
11-22-2022 6:20 PM


Re: UCD evidence
APauling writes:
The jab will work, precisely because of common descent,
Show me a scientific paper that says Covid vaccines work because of UCD.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1127 by AZPaul3, posted 11-22-2022 6:20 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1129 by AZPaul3, posted 11-22-2022 11:47 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 1130 by Stile, posted 11-23-2022 8:29 AM Dredge has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 7324
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 1129 of 1249 (902380)
11-22-2022 11:47 PM
Reply to: Message 1128 by Dredge
11-22-2022 10:50 PM


Re: UCD evidence
No. Go find it yourself. UCD is now the default position in evolution. You want to kill it, you do the work. The evidence for common descent is available. Go learn. Then tell us where it is wrong if you think you can. We'll wait.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1128 by Dredge, posted 11-22-2022 10:50 PM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1135 by Dredge, posted 11-23-2022 4:01 PM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 1139 by Dredge, posted 11-23-2022 6:22 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Stile
Member
Posts: 4184
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004
Member Rating: 3.3


(4)
Message 1130 of 1249 (902385)
11-23-2022 8:29 AM
Reply to: Message 1128 by Dredge
11-22-2022 10:50 PM


Re: UCD evidence
Dredge writes:
Show me a scientific paper that says Covid vaccines work because of UCD.
Show me a user manual that says vehicles work because of nuts and bolts
The point is that nuts and bolts are irrevocably important to the manufacture of vehicles. Understanding this importance leads to greater vehicle technology.
The point is that UCD is irrevocably important to those genetic similarities existing. Understanding this importance leads to greater biological/medicinal technology.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1128 by Dredge, posted 11-22-2022 10:50 PM Dredge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1131 by Theodoric, posted 11-23-2022 10:11 AM Stile has seen this message but not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 7848
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.5


(4)
Message 1131 of 1249 (902400)
11-23-2022 10:11 AM
Reply to: Message 1130 by Stile
11-23-2022 8:29 AM


Funny and sad
The funny and sad thing is that he thinks he has some sort of gotcha. It just exposes his ignorance. He tries to sound like he has the ultimate argument against UCD but all he does is continue to show he does not even have a basic idea of the scientific method.
Another troll that should be ignored. A one-trick pony that does not even have a trick or a pony for that matter.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1130 by Stile, posted 11-23-2022 8:29 AM Stile has seen this message but not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9088
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 3.4


(2)
Message 1132 of 1249 (902429)
11-23-2022 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 1125 by Dredge
11-22-2022 3:59 PM


Re: UCD evidence
Dredge writes:
Are you saying that, if I get a Covid jab, it won't work bcoz I don't accept "the fact of UCD"?
NASA is able to get satellites to orbit the Earth even though there are Flat Earthers. You can continue to deny basic findings in science, but that doesn't change the reality.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1125 by Dredge, posted 11-22-2022 3:59 PM Dredge has not replied

  
FLRW
Member
Posts: 73
Joined: 10-08-2007


(2)
Message 1133 of 1249 (902441)
11-23-2022 12:59 PM


See; A formal test of the theory of universal common ancestry
by Douglas L Theobald
Abstract
Universal common ancestry (UCA) is a central pillar of modern evolutionary theory. As first suggested by Darwin, the theory of UCA posits that all extant terrestrial organisms share a common genetic heritage, each being the genealogical descendant of a single species from the distant past. The classic evidence for UCA, although massive, is largely restricted to 'local' common ancestry-for example, of specific phyla rather than the entirety of life-and has yet to fully integrate the recent advances from modern phylogenetics and probability theory. Although UCA is widely assumed, it has rarely been subjected to formal quantitative testing, and this has led to critical commentary emphasizing the intrinsic technical difficulties in empirically evaluating a theory of such broad scope. Furthermore, several researchers have proposed that early life was characterized by rampant horizontal gene transfer, leading some to question the monophyly of life. Here I provide the first, to my knowledge, formal, fundamental test of UCA, without assuming that sequence similarity implies genetic kinship. I test UCA by applying model selection theory to molecular phylogenies, focusing on a set of ubiquitously conserved proteins that are proposed to be orthologous. Among a wide range of biological models involving the independent ancestry of major taxonomic groups, the model selection tests are found to overwhelmingly support UCA irrespective of the presence of horizontal gene transfer and symbiotic fusion events. These results provide powerful statistical evidence corroborating the monophyly of all known life.

Replies to this message:
 Message 1137 by Dredge, posted 11-23-2022 6:16 PM FLRW has not replied
 Message 1239 by Dredge, posted 12-07-2022 1:23 PM FLRW has not replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2088
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1134 of 1249 (902448)
11-23-2022 3:37 PM
Reply to: Message 1122 by AZPaul3
11-21-2022 7:22 PM


Re: UCD evidence
APauling writes:
The scientific consensus, by near unanimous agreement, agrees the fact of the UCD is a linchpin in the evidence of evolution. 
That's not the point.
Which treatment of which disease could not have been developed without accepting "the fact of UCD", and why?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1122 by AZPaul3, posted 11-21-2022 7:22 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1144 by Tangle, posted 11-24-2022 7:36 AM Dredge has replied
 Message 1145 by ringo, posted 11-24-2022 11:29 AM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2088
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1135 of 1249 (902451)
11-23-2022 4:01 PM
Reply to: Message 1129 by AZPaul3
11-22-2022 11:47 PM


Re: UCD evidence
APauling writes:
No. Go find it yourself.
In other words, you have nothing to support your claim that Covid vaccines work because of UCD Message 1127.
UCD is now the default position in evolution. You want to kill it, you do the work. The evidence for common descent is available
More evasion. My question doesn't concern evidence for UCD. I want to know how the theory of UCD has made a practical contribution to medical or biological science.
Do try and keep on-topic.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1129 by AZPaul3, posted 11-22-2022 11:47 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1136 by xongsmith, posted 11-23-2022 5:29 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 1138 by AZPaul3, posted 11-23-2022 6:19 PM Dredge has not replied

  
xongsmith
Member
Posts: 2339
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 1136 of 1249 (902456)
11-23-2022 5:29 PM
Reply to: Message 1135 by Dredge
11-23-2022 4:01 PM


Sea Lion Dyin'
troll

"I'm the Grim Reaper now, Mitch. Step aside."
Death to #TzarVladimirtheCondemned!
Enjoy every sandwich!

- xongsmith, 5.7dawkins scale


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1135 by Dredge, posted 11-23-2022 4:01 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2088
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1137 of 1249 (902458)
11-23-2022 6:16 PM
Reply to: Message 1133 by FLRW
11-23-2022 12:59 PM


What does any of that have to do with the discussion?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1133 by FLRW, posted 11-23-2022 12:59 PM FLRW has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 7324
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 1138 of 1249 (902459)
11-23-2022 6:19 PM
Reply to: Message 1135 by Dredge
11-23-2022 4:01 PM


Re: UCD evidence
In other words, you have nothing to support your claim ...
No. What I said, since your reading comprehension problem has arisen again, is this:
Fuck you. I am not going to waste my time duplicating the science that is out there on the net for your lazy ass to answer these questions in support of evolution and UCD.
The evidence is there for YOU to find, you anti-intellectual lazy fuck.
I want to know how the theory of UCD has made a practical contribution to medical or biological science.
Then go comb the literature you lazy dumb shit. The answers are there. You will find that you can try to punch holes in UCD and evolution but you can only fail.
If you want to know why and how UCD informes evolution, medical science and biology, you are not going to find it in the confession booth. Go learn, if you still have that capability.
More importantly, you have no alternative to UCD and the processes of evolution. Like the religious buffoons before you, you can only try to destroy, you cannot build. Your religious views are stillborn in stupidity and your meat-cracker gutter religion is useless to the human knowledge base.
You and your catholic church have no knowledge. You have nothing to offer humanity but delusion, propagation of ignorance and blood soaked evil.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1135 by Dredge, posted 11-23-2022 4:01 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2088
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 1139 of 1249 (902460)
11-23-2022 6:22 PM
Reply to: Message 1129 by AZPaul3
11-22-2022 11:47 PM


Re: UCD evidence
APauling writes:
No. Go find it yourself.
That's not how it works. You made the claim, so the onus is on YOU to provide evidence that supports it.
If you can't provide a scientific paper that supports your claim that Covid vaccines work because of UCD Message 1127, why should I believe you?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1129 by AZPaul3, posted 11-22-2022 11:47 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1140 by AZPaul3, posted 11-23-2022 6:44 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 1141 by AZPaul3, posted 11-23-2022 7:29 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 1142 by Theodoric, posted 11-24-2022 1:03 AM Dredge has not replied
 Message 1146 by ringo, posted 11-24-2022 11:33 AM Dredge has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 7324
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 1140 of 1249 (902461)
11-23-2022 6:44 PM
Reply to: Message 1139 by Dredge
11-23-2022 6:22 PM


UCD Is Not The Issue.
That's not how it works.
Yes, that is exactly how it works. You want to replace the edifice of evolution which is the established science. The evidence to support evolution, like UCD, has been known for more than a century and is available to all who seek it. And there is a hell of a lot of it.
You are the one who wants to replace evolution. Therefore, it is incumbent upon you to produce the evidence for your alternative and it has to be stronger than the evidence of evolution.
So stop asking about UCD. It is established reality as well attested by the facts. If you want to unseat it you need to provide two things: an alternative process and a stronger block of evidence to support it. You have neither.
Our understanding of evolution is vastly superior to any religious tripe you just pull out of your bible and you cannot touch it. You have no evidence. Hell, you can't even put forward any viable alternatives, evidenced or no.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1139 by Dredge, posted 11-23-2022 6:22 PM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1143 by Dredge, posted 11-24-2022 6:28 AM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
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