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Author Topic:   Coffee House Musings on Creationist Topic Proposals
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 235 of 1429 (895360)
06-23-2022 4:26 PM
Reply to: Message 183 by Tangle
06-06-2022 3:11 AM


Tangle writes:
This science = atheism thing though must be really hard to square in even an addled mind. It's just wrong isn't it?
The late science historian and atheist, Dr. William Provine, said,
"Evolution is the greatest engine of atheism ever invented".
According to you he was talking complete crap.
Atheism is a minority interest, most scientists - and that includes people working directly in areas such a evolutionary biology - are not atheists.
That is almost certainly bullshit.
"Nearly 95% of the biologists in the National Academy of Sciences describe themselves as atheists or agnostics, a far higher percentage than in any other scientific discipline."
[Larry Witham,
Where Darwin Meets the Bible (2002), pp. 271-273]"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 183 by Tangle, posted 06-06-2022 3:11 AM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 236 by Taq, posted 06-23-2022 5:00 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 237 by Tangle, posted 06-23-2022 5:36 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 244 by ringo, posted 06-24-2022 11:57 AM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 238 of 1429 (895368)
06-23-2022 10:48 PM
Reply to: Message 188 by AZPaul3
06-20-2022 6:50 PM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
AZPaul3 writes:
What we know is the ToE together with sister sciences like biology, genetics, paleontology and a whole host of others. And all that knowledge (note the root word of knowledge is to know) makes it plain to all but the most braindead that evolution made everything just as the theories predicted.
Please be advised that a theory is not knowledge.
We KNOW how an internal combustion engine works ... hence there is no Theory of Internal Combustion Engines.
We KNOW how to build a house ... hence there is no Theory of House-building.
Conversely, we DON'T KNOW what process was responsible for the fossil record ... hence there is a Theory of Evolution.
For your psychological well-being, you and your fellow atheists need to delude yourselves that ToE is a fact and is therefore "knowledge" ... which is actually oxymoronic ... if it were a fact it wouldn't be a theory.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 188 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2022 6:50 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 240 by nwr, posted 06-23-2022 11:16 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 241 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-23-2022 11:26 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 242 by dwise1, posted 06-24-2022 12:03 AM Dredge has replied
 Message 247 by Taq, posted 06-24-2022 5:07 PM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 239 of 1429 (895369)
06-23-2022 11:11 PM
Reply to: Message 188 by AZPaul3
06-20-2022 6:50 PM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
188
AZPaul3 writes:
What we know is the ToE together with sister sciences like biology, genetics, paleontology and a whole host of others. And all that knowledge (note the root word of knowledge is to know) makes it plain to all but the most braindead that evolution made everything just as the theories predicted.
Yep, you have so much knowledge about evolution that you can't describe how even one evolutionary transition evident in the fossil record happened.

Edited by Dredge, .


This message is a reply to:
 Message 188 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2022 6:50 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 245 by ringo, posted 06-24-2022 12:01 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 246 by AZPaul3, posted 06-24-2022 3:50 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 255 of 1429 (895418)
06-26-2022 4:24 PM
Reply to: Message 253 by Parasomnium
06-25-2022 4:47 PM


Re: Dredge thinks not knowing everything is not knowing anything
Dredge writes:
But Darwinists (esp the atheist variety) believe that ToE is more than a theory - they believe it is a fact.
Parasomnium writes:
No, they don't.
I think it's fair to say atheist Darwinists believe that the history of life on earth proceeded according to ToE ... ie, they believe ToE is a fact.
They do not conflate the body of knowledge about how life on earth changed over time (a.k.a. the Theory of Evolution) with the fact that it obviously did (as the fossil record shows).
Anyone who claims to know how ToE produced the history of life on earth is, in effect, claiming ToE is a fact.
Dredge, you must have seen it explained many times that the term 'theory' in this context is used to mean "the body of knowledge concerning the mechanisms behind evolution", but you choose to ignore it and keep insisting Darwinists are actually using the term to mean "hypothesis" in its quotidian sense. This is disingenuous conduct.
Please describe how the "mechanisms behind evolution" produced an amphibian's double-circulation heart from the single-circulation heart of a fish.
Please describe how the "mechanisms behind evolution" produced a whale's blowhole and tail from the morphology of a land mammal.
Please describe how the "mechanisms behind evolution" produced any evolutionary transition evident in the fossil record.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 253 by Parasomnium, posted 06-25-2022 4:47 PM Parasomnium has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 256 by AZPaul3, posted 06-26-2022 5:22 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 257 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-26-2022 5:27 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 258 by Percy, posted 06-26-2022 5:54 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 262 by Tangle, posted 06-27-2022 3:24 AM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 268 of 1429 (895566)
07-05-2022 11:59 PM
Reply to: Message 192 by Tanypteryx
06-21-2022 10:34 AM


Re: Dredge thinks not knowing everything is not knowing anything
My "inane questions" have demonstrated that your claim to "know how evolution works" is bullshit.
"Tanypteryx" writes:
Oh, really, how?
It has been explained to you numerous times. You just don't like the answer.
I have explained it to you numerous times. You just don't like the answer.
Regardless, I shall present my argument one more time:
1. You don't know how evolutionary mechanisms produced an amphibian's double-circulation heart from a the single-circulation heart of a fish.
2. You don't know how evolutionary mechanisms produce a whale's blowhole and tail from a land animal.
3. In fact, you don't how evolutionary mechanisms produced any evolutionary transitions evident in the fossil record.
1 + 2 + 3 = your claim to know how evolution works is clearly bullsh_t.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 192 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-21-2022 10:34 AM Tanypteryx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 269 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-06-2022 12:10 AM Dredge has replied
 Message 270 by dwise1, posted 07-06-2022 12:48 AM Dredge has not replied
 Message 271 by AZPaul3, posted 07-06-2022 1:14 AM Dredge has not replied
 Message 272 by vimesey, posted 07-06-2022 2:14 AM Dredge has replied
 Message 273 by ringo, posted 07-07-2022 12:48 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 274 by Percy, posted 07-07-2022 2:06 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 275 of 1429 (895636)
07-09-2022 9:55 PM
Reply to: Message 197 by ringo
06-21-2022 11:41 AM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
ringo writes:
When you live in the water, it's more efficient to breathe through the top of your head instead of the front of your face. Transitionals with their nostrils closer to the surface had a better chance of survival - they didn't have to stand on their tails to breathe. (Maybe that infamous "vertical whale" had his fatal accident while taking a breath.)
You have no way of confirming that a whale's nostrils evolved from the nosrils of a land mammal and you have no way of confirming any process that might be responsible ... therefore you cannot claim to know how that (alleged) transition occurred.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 197 by ringo, posted 06-21-2022 11:41 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 278 by AZPaul3, posted 07-09-2022 10:42 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 298 by ringo, posted 07-11-2022 11:57 AM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 276 of 1429 (895637)
07-09-2022 10:25 PM
Reply to: Message 198 by ringo
06-21-2022 11:48 AM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
ringo writes:
A theory is an explanation of a fact. So no, a theory doesn't "become" a fact. Never has, never will. Nobody but an illiterate anti-science dimwit would ever suggest that a theory "turns into" a fact.
... yet there are millions of Darwinists out there who believe the theory of evolution is also a fact. The atheist variety are especially devoted to this theory/fact belief system.
But evolution is a fact. And the theory of Evolution is an explanation of that fact.
What "evolution" are you referring to?
Nobody but an illiterate anti-science dimwit would ever suggest that a theory "turns into" a fact.
I hope you're not suggesting that I myself am "illiterate" ... I'm semi-illiterate.
As for being a "dimwit" ... yes, that's true; I am a dimwit (although I prefer the word, "halfwit").
As for being "anti-science" ... not me.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 198 by ringo, posted 06-21-2022 11:48 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 277 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-09-2022 10:41 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 299 by ringo, posted 07-11-2022 12:06 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 304 by dwise1, posted 07-11-2022 1:09 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 279 of 1429 (895640)
07-09-2022 10:48 PM
Reply to: Message 201 by AZPaul3
06-21-2022 3:21 PM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
AZPaul3 writes:
We produce new body plans and weird configurations of drosophila and other bugs in the lab every day.
What "new body plans" are you referring to?
And while you’re explaining, please explain why your catholic conception of a god is so murderous, blood thirsty and evil?
This would be funny if it weren't so sadly pathological ... completely and utterly off-topic, nevertheless you couldn't resist the urge to inject some hate-speech into the conversation.

Edited by Dredge, .


This message is a reply to:
 Message 201 by AZPaul3, posted 06-21-2022 3:21 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 281 by AZPaul3, posted 07-09-2022 11:06 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 280 of 1429 (895642)
07-09-2022 11:04 PM
Reply to: Message 203 by Tangle
06-21-2022 4:12 PM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
Tangle writes:
Your refusal to say whether you accept that evolution has happened means that's there's little point discussing how it happened.
Your refusal to describe how evolution happened means you don't know how evolution happened.
You're just another fake Christian
????

This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by Tangle, posted 06-21-2022 4:12 PM Tangle has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 300 by ringo, posted 07-11-2022 12:14 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 282 of 1429 (895644)
07-09-2022 11:38 PM
Reply to: Message 205 by kjsimons
06-21-2022 5:41 PM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
kjsimons writes:
Listen asshole, since you can't describe cell division by cell division how you came to exist, then you can't possibly exist!
Language is interesting, isn't it? In Australia, we don't say "asshole" ... we say "arsehole".
So just f off unless you want to have a reasonable discussion.
If you know how evolution works, please describe how an amphibian's double-circulation heart (allegedly) evolved from the single-circulation heart of a fish. What was the first step?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 205 by kjsimons, posted 06-21-2022 5:41 PM kjsimons has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 283 of 1429 (895645)
07-09-2022 11:59 PM
Reply to: Message 207 by nwr
06-21-2022 6:28 PM


Re: Dredge thinks not knowing everything is not knowing anything
nwr writes:
Gunter Bechly came up with a similar challenge. And several biologists answered it. But, of course, Bechly rejected all of their answers, because what he was really asking was a matter of his subjective opinion. And he was not about to accept any responses to his challenge.
Dr. Gunter Bechly is one of my heroes! .. and evolutionnews.org has long been my favourite science website.
See the discussion here:
Bechly’s “Species Pairs” Challenge
Thanx for the link ... I love to read Bechly's stuff.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 207 by nwr, posted 06-21-2022 6:28 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 387 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-22-2022 2:04 PM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 284 of 1429 (895646)
07-10-2022 12:34 AM
Reply to: Message 208 by Tanypteryx
06-21-2022 6:50 PM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
Tanypteryx writes:
I don't know any Darwinists, but I know what all scientists mean when they talk about theories, which you irrationally think is a wild assed guess.
Deary, deary me - that's not even close to what I said. I said it's delusional to equate the theory of evolution with knowledge (aka fact).
your catholic cult actually is a fairy tale.
Here you go again ... claiming to know things that no one can possibly know. First you claimed to know how evolution works ... now you claim to know that Catholicism is a fairy tale.
We've told you what we know, microevolution, descent with modification, repeated each generation
In that case, please describe the microevolutionary steps involved in the (alleged) evolution of an amphibian's double-circulation heart from the single-circulation heart of a fish.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 208 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-21-2022 6:50 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 301 by ringo, posted 07-11-2022 12:19 PM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 285 of 1429 (895647)
07-10-2022 12:51 AM
Reply to: Message 211 by Stile
06-22-2022 8:42 AM


Re: Dredge Doesn't Think
Stile writes:
I don't know the step-by-step process involved in climbing Mt. Everest (or any specific, individual mountain, really...)
But I know how people climb mountains.
I don't know the step-by-step process involved in getting a 747 jet to take-off.
But I know how airplanes fly.
I don't know the step-by-step process involved in most of my colleagues' drive to work.
But I know how people drive from point A to point B.
You can't describe the step-by-step process of even one evolutionary transition evident in the fossil record ... which means you can't claim to know how evolution works.
You're lost in your own panic.
Like an adult desperately flailing their arms in 2 feet of water crying out that you can't swim... everyone around you is just so confused and thinking... why don't you just stand up?
I sincerely thank you for your wonderful words of wisdom, which are ... so profound ... that I don't think I will ever understand them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 211 by Stile, posted 06-22-2022 8:42 AM Stile has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 302 by ringo, posted 07-11-2022 12:20 PM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 286 of 1429 (895648)
07-10-2022 12:57 AM
Reply to: Message 212 by dwise1
06-22-2022 10:37 AM


Re: Dredge thinks not knowing everything is not knowing anything
Meanwhile, you can't describe the process involved in even one evolutionary transition evident in the fossil record ... yet you claim to know how evolution works.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 212 by dwise1, posted 06-22-2022 10:37 AM dwise1 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 288 by Theodoric, posted 07-10-2022 1:34 AM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 94 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 287 of 1429 (895649)
07-10-2022 1:14 AM
Reply to: Message 212 by dwise1
06-22-2022 10:37 AM


Re: Dredge thinks not knowing everything is not knowing anything
dwise1 writes:
Stupid is as creationists do.
Yep, no doubt about it ... Dr. Gunter Bechly is definitely stupid ...
He worked from 1999-2016 as scientific curator for amber and fossil insects in the paleontological department at the  State Museum of Natural History (SMNS) in Stuttgart (Germany), which is one of the five biggest natural history museums in Germany.
He also held a teaching assignment at the University Hohenheim in Germany on insect systematics and phylogeny.
He has authored or co-authored more than 160 scientific publications, including a co-edited and co-authored book published by Cambridge University Press and a German popular science book on evolution, as well as several book chapters (including three chapters in the latest and largest monograph on the Solnhofen fossil locality and the chapter on insect evolution and systematics in Grzimek's Animal Life Encyclopedia). 
He pioneered the phylogenetic re-classification of the insect order Odonata (dragonflies, damselflies, and their fossil relatives), made substantial contributions to the question of the evolutionary origin of insect wings, and ranks among the world leading experts on fossil dragonflies and on fossil insects from the Solnhofen and Crato limestones.
He has discovered and described more than 180 new species (incl. three new insect orders), and 11 biological groups have been named as eponyms by other scientists in his honor.
 He served on the editorial boards of five scientific journals (Petalura, Odonatologica, Archaeopteryx, Palaeodiversity, and BIO-Complexity).
What a moron!!

Edited by Dredge, .


This message is a reply to:
 Message 212 by dwise1, posted 06-22-2022 10:37 AM dwise1 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 294 by kjsimons, posted 07-10-2022 7:28 AM Dredge has replied
 Message 297 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-10-2022 10:48 AM Dredge has not replied

  
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