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Author | Topic: The Power of the New Intelligent Design... | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
AZPaul3 Member Posts: 7857 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 2.9
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So the claim of observing nested hierarchy is doubtful at best. No. The data is well documented, the models are well tested and the nested hierarchy is a reality. The only ones who question this are the nut cases seeking to advance their gods. In other words, stupid ID/Creationists.
Then you need to specify before looking at data, what is a hierarchy, in the first place. No, fool! That is exactly what you DO NOT do. You let the data show what is there. In the case of evolution what we found in the structure of the data is what we have called a nested hierarchy. You, on the other hand, want to pre-judge the results so you can further your false religious fantasy.Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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Tangle Member Posts: 8946 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 3.9 |
This new idea of common descent and nested hierarchies.
1837
Anytime you want to start showing us where this is wrong, we're all ears. Just at the moment you're being very boring.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine. "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
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sensei Member Posts: 343 Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
A prediction is done before observation, dumb ape!
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sensei Member Posts: 343 Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
That hand writing is hard to read.
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Taq Member Posts: 9666 Joined: Member Rating: 3.2 |
sensei writes: Observing patterns in one group of species is hardly sufficient evidence for the nested tree that you draw from your universal common ancestry hypothesis. You can predict a nested hierarchy from first principles, just as Darwin did. It is no different than Einstein's thought experiments that were used to create predictions of what we should see if relativity is true. If you think we are wrong, then show us why vertical inheritance, common ancestry, speciation, and mutation should not produce a nested hierarchy.
So no, we have not observed nested hierarchy anywhere higher up, anywhere at significant high enough levels where it really counts. We do observe a nested hierarchy higher up. It is found in all complex life.
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Taq Member Posts: 9666 Joined: Member Rating: 3.2
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sensei writes: A prediction is done before observation, dumb ape! Postdictions are just as valid in science. For example, one of the strongest initial pieces of evidence for Einstein's theory of relativity is that it accurately predicted the the already known precession in Mercury's orbit. Newton's laws were not able to explain the precession in the orbit, but Einstein's equations were able to explain it. It didn't matter that the precession was already known.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 7857 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 2.9 |
A prediction is done before observation, dumb ape! Once we have a model, yes. The part you forget is you let the data build the model, then you test the model by making predictions. Predictions of new data come after the model. Initial data, observation, comes before the model. So you didn't know this either. You really do know nothing. This dumb ape is smarter than you. No surprise. Edited by AZPaul3, . Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5596 Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
Emphasis added by me:
There is evolution from common ancestor by natural processes alone, there is theistic evolution (the idea that evolution was helped along or guided by a deity) and there is seperate creation, where species have not crossed boundaries. And there is Dawkins outer space theory. If we would find and record species in a lab or on another planet, crossing boundaries that were forbidden by seperate creation, from single cell all the way to variety of complex life forms, then that would be falsification, for example. What are you talking about? Are you saying the same thing as your fellow creationist here, candle2? -- from his Message 189:
candle2 writes: True evolution would for example be a cat evolving into adog. You don't have this. Also in his Message 43:
candle2 writes: For example, a pig's offsprings will, and alwayshas been pigs. The same is true for humans. Over the decades, I've seen many other creationists repeat that interpretation, usually claiming that evolution would depend on a dog giving birth to kittens or a chimp giving birth to a human. Since you're a creationist, is that your position too? Why? If that is not your position, then why not? Your description is telling us that you do indeed think that evolution would require such "crossed boundaries". That tells us that you do not know what evolution is nor how it works.
So what the hell are you talking about?
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Granny Magda Member Posts: 2415 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.7 |
Observing patterns in one group of species is hardly sufficient evidence for the nested tree that you draw from your universal common ancestry hypothesis. It is if that "group of species" is all life.
So no, we have not observed nested hierarchy anywhere higher up, anywhere at significant high enough levels where it really counts. Can you tell us where it breaks down then? Which group of species is such a poor fit for a nested hierarchy? Is there any example which would falsify the notion? Mutate and Survive On two occasions I have been asked, – "Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?" ... I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question. - Charles Babbage
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sensei Member Posts: 343 Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Dumb ape thinks he's smart.
You evolutionist claim that nested hierarchy is predicted by evolution. Worthless claim if you cannot define hierarchy even, before making the prediction. Still a dumb ape you are.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 7857 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 2.9
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Worthless claim if you cannot define hierarchy even, before making the prediction. We have. You are just too stupid to comprehend.Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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sensei Member Posts: 343 Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Says the troll
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 7857 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 2.9 |
Yes, I did say that. And I'll say it again next time you say something stupid.
But, I like the new topic proposal. You draw pretty pictures and all but I'm more interested in what interpretations and conclusions you draw from each chart and from the aggregate. I look forward to your broadside shot at evolution through manipulation of genetic probability numbers. Of course it's all been tried before and failed but your tack seems interesting. I await its promotion.Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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Dredge Member Posts: 2541 From: Australia Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
Dredge writes:
you know how evolution works, choose one evolutionary transition from the fossil record and describe how it happened.Taq writes:
You're getting a bit ahead of yourself, old chap .... "evolutionary mechanisms" is the best scientific explanation, but you can't prove that that explanation is correct. Claiming, as you do, that your explanation is a proven fact is typical of the lies that Darwinoids tell.
So the physical differences between humans and chimps is due to evolutionary mechanismswe can even see the transitional steps in the fossil record.
The array of skulls depicted in the image you supplied is meant to portray the"transitional steps in the fossil record" , but all you've done is provide yet another shameful example of Darwinoid dishonesty. What Darwinoids don't tell readers about that image is that: 1. Not all the skulls are not found in the fossil record in the same (alleged) evolutionary sequence depicted in the image. The (alleged) evolutionary sequence is therefore patently fraudulent. 2. Some of the skulls are tiny relative to the size of some of the other skulls. It's like comparing the skull of a marmoset to the skull of a gorilla. 3. There is nothing remotely "evolutionary" about the skeletons belonging to any of the non-human skulls in that image ... skeletons that are no closer to human than any of the non-human primates we see today.
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Dredge Member Posts: 2541 From: Australia Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
unwise1 writes:
I accept the scientific evidence that suggests life on earth has gone thru dramatic changes ... that it has "evolved".
BTW, in that video she states outright that the reason she accepts evolution is because of the data -- the data that Dredge keeps trying to deny.
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