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Author Topic:   Testing The Financial Apologists
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9257
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 271 of 563 (910664)
05-04-2023 8:50 AM
Reply to: Message 269 by Phat
05-03-2023 11:16 PM


Re: U.S. Debt Ceiling
Do you believe that there is any way that the US can or will EVER pay off the major portion of that debt?
Nope.
Should they?
Nope.
The economy tanks without debt. How do we pay for major infrastructure projects without debt?
Do you understand anything about economics?
All this debt hew and cry is just to get you rubes riled up.
Do you have a clue what govt debt really is?
Do you know who holds the vast majority of US debt? It ain't China. Do you understand how govt debt even works?

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 269 by Phat, posted 05-03-2023 11:16 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 272 by Tanypteryx, posted 05-04-2023 10:41 AM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 274 by Phat, posted 05-05-2023 5:05 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4473
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.3


(2)
Message 272 of 563 (910666)
05-04-2023 10:41 AM
Reply to: Message 271 by Theodoric
05-04-2023 8:50 AM


Re: U.S. Debt Ceiling
Do you understand how govt debt even works?
Nothing he has ever posted demonstrates understanding government debt or even general economics.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 271 by Theodoric, posted 05-04-2023 8:50 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9257
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 273 of 563 (910670)
05-04-2023 3:39 PM


BRICS lol
India and Russia can't even come to an agreement on currency.
India and China have regular border clashes in which many troops are killed.
Phat is a financial genius and thinks this collection of misfits is going to dominate world finance any say now.
Exclusive: India, Russia suspend negotiations to settle trade in rupees | Reuters

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


Replies to this message:
 Message 276 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 6:45 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18383
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 274 of 563 (910682)
05-05-2023 5:05 AM
Reply to: Message 271 by Theodoric
05-04-2023 8:50 AM


Re: U.S. Debt Ceiling
Do you know who holds the vast majority of US debt?
Yes. the Federal Reserve itself.
Krugman is a modern monetary theorist, which is not the final word.
The problem with you liberals is that you want the government to control the flow(and value) of money rather than the free market. Im not going to argue with you guys. We disagree. You think i'm stupid. I think you are all deluded.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 271 by Theodoric, posted 05-04-2023 8:50 AM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 275 by PaulK, posted 05-05-2023 5:40 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17831
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 275 of 563 (910684)
05-05-2023 5:40 AM
Reply to: Message 274 by Phat
05-05-2023 5:05 AM


Re: U.S. Debt Ceiling
quote:
Krugman is a modern monetary theorist, which is not the final word.
No, he isn’t. Really, why do you try to post this label on people when you have no idea of their views?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 274 by Phat, posted 05-05-2023 5:05 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18383
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 276 of 563 (910746)
05-11-2023 6:45 AM
Reply to: Message 273 by Theodoric
05-04-2023 3:39 PM


Re: BRICS lol
Dont play with issues that you know nothing (or very little) about.
From your very same source: Vast China-Russia resources trade shifts to yuan from dollars in Ukraine fallout
Of course I'm no financial genius, but all I have to do is to read more than you do.
Most experts don't see it happening overnight or within the next year, but if you look 5 years ahead, you will see a dramatically different situation.
quote:
The US is severely dependent on currency printing. Every issue they encounter will always be solved by printing dollars and pouring them on top of it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 273 by Theodoric, posted 05-04-2023 3:39 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 277 by Theodoric, posted 05-11-2023 9:39 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 278 by Omnivorous, posted 05-11-2023 11:10 AM Phat has replied
 Message 286 by Theodoric, posted 05-12-2023 10:02 AM Phat has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9257
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 277 of 563 (910747)
05-11-2023 9:39 AM
Reply to: Message 276 by Phat
05-11-2023 6:45 AM


Re: BRICS lol
Where does the ridiculous quote at the end come from?

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 276 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 6:45 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3998
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 278 of 563 (910748)
05-11-2023 11:10 AM
Reply to: Message 276 by Phat
05-11-2023 6:45 AM


Re: BRICS lol
You work. I assume you save and invest. Do you hold 1 oz krugerrands in your mattress?
If we're 5 years from currency apocalypse, I assume you don't keep soon-to-be worthless, fictional paper in banks or investment funds.
When I cruise right wing media (usually Sunday morning, when my small village's serene blend of sanctimony and hangover keep me calm), I see lots of gold: doomsayers saying it, show hosts hawking it, print ads for it sandwiched with survivalist gear.
Are you a gold bug, Phat? Is that where you place your faith?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 276 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 6:45 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 279 by Theodoric, posted 05-11-2023 11:45 AM Omnivorous has not replied
 Message 280 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 1:53 PM Omnivorous has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9257
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(3)
Message 279 of 563 (910749)
05-11-2023 11:45 AM
Reply to: Message 278 by Omnivorous
05-11-2023 11:10 AM


Re: BRICS lol
I only want to see an economic collapse to see the look on the faces of the goldbugs when they realize they have no access to the precious metals they supposedly own and that the gold, silver and platinum they do possess is worthless in acquiring food and shelter.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 278 by Omnivorous, posted 05-11-2023 11:10 AM Omnivorous has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 281 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 2:13 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18383
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 280 of 563 (910750)
05-11-2023 1:53 PM
Reply to: Message 278 by Omnivorous
05-11-2023 11:10 AM


Gold Bugs and Political Thugs
Omni writes:
You work. I assume you save and invest. Do you hold 1 oz krugerrands in your mattress?
I can't afford to buy gold. I have very little, but I do not keep it around the house, despite living in a relatively safe neighborhood.
If we're 5 years from currency apocalypse, I assume you don't keep soon-to-be worthless, fictional paper in banks or investment funds.
Most sources whom I trust say that it wont likely be an outright collapse but, rather, a hyperinflationary (or perhaps even deflationary) scenario. The US dollar, despite its problems, remains the primary global reserve currency and is far ahead of its rivals. The entire issue is one of trust. If the world-at-large loses faith that the debt that they hold in treasuries and other assets cannot be repaid, the result will be a collective dumping of inflated US dollars back on our country.
Omni writes:
When I cruise right wing media (usually Sunday morning, when my small village's serene blend of sanctimony and hangover keep me calm), I see lots of gold: doomsayers saying it, show hosts hawking it, print ads for it sandwiched with survivalist gear.
Granted the idea takes on a conspiracy theorist fringe element, and my critics are right in that many shysters profit off of fear. That being said...
Patrick Bet David (himself worth 200 million...look it up) sums the situation up in this short video.
And just so you know, these videos are well made and explain the situation as well as any economics professor could. I know many will disagree, but the information is out there.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 278 by Omnivorous, posted 05-11-2023 11:10 AM Omnivorous has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 282 by Theodoric, posted 05-11-2023 3:25 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 283 by Omnivorous, posted 05-11-2023 3:32 PM Phat has replied
 Message 284 by Tanypteryx, posted 05-11-2023 6:51 PM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18383
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 281 of 563 (910751)
05-11-2023 2:13 PM
Reply to: Message 279 by Theodoric
05-11-2023 11:45 AM


If That Day Ever Comes
Theo writes:
I only want to see an economic collapse to see the look on the faces of the goldbugs when they realize they have no access to the precious metals they supposedly own and that the gold, silver and platinum they do possess is worthless in acquiring food and shelter.
If that day ever comes, I would like to see the look on the face of progressives when they realize how much of an idiot Joe Biden was (36% approval rating and dropping) when he spent all of this money on green new deals,shut down the US petroleum industry, and sanctioned Russia by using the US dollar as a weapon. You may even find Jesus during such a time.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 279 by Theodoric, posted 05-11-2023 11:45 AM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 285 by Percy, posted 05-12-2023 8:58 AM Phat has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9257
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 282 of 563 (910755)
05-11-2023 3:25 PM
Reply to: Message 280 by Phat
05-11-2023 1:53 PM


Re: Gold Bugs and Political Thugs
​Patrick Bet David (himself worth 200 million
Irrelevant. Many people that know little about the economy and international finance have lots of money. What are his credentials? Does he have any degrees? Why should I trust him more than Paul Krugman, who does not put out sensationalistic videos? Tell us what he claims. We are not going to watch his video. You realize that is how he gets paid?
And just so you know, these videos are well made and explain the situation as well as any economics professor could.
Well-made is irrelevant and actually a red flag. No, they cannot explain it better than an economics professor. They are feeding your biases.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 280 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 1:53 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3998
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 5.9


(2)
Message 283 of 563 (910757)
05-11-2023 3:32 PM
Reply to: Message 280 by Phat
05-11-2023 1:53 PM


Re: Gold Bugs and Political Thugs
Let me ask again: Do you save and invest in dollar-denominated funds and accounts?
As for the rest, I don't interrupt conversations to watch videos. You shouldn't, either -- it's rude.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 280 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 1:53 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 287 by Phat, posted 05-12-2023 12:31 PM Omnivorous has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4473
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.3


(2)
Message 284 of 563 (910759)
05-11-2023 6:51 PM
Reply to: Message 280 by Phat
05-11-2023 1:53 PM


Re: Gold Bugs and Political Thugs
Phat in Message 280 writes:
The entire issue is one of trust. If the world-at-large loses faith that the debt that they hold in treasuries and other assets cannot be repaid, the result will be a collective dumping of inflated US dollars back on our country.
OK, so by "collective dumping of inflated US dollars back on our country" do you mean they are buying something from us "with inflated US dollars" or do you mean they are sending shiploads of U.S. currency and dumping it in our harbors kind of Boston tea party style? Can you clarify?
Phat in Message 280 writes:
Most sources whom I trust say that it wont likely be an outright collapse but, rather, a hyperinflationary (or perhaps even deflationary) scenario.
Nice prediction covering all your bases...according to Phat sooner or later there is going to be some kind of economic disaster.
I would say the most likely event will be directly caused by those fucking idiot GOP in the U.S. House of Representatives that are going to intentionally cause the United States to default on its debt for the very first time ever.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 280 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 1:53 PM Phat has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22554
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.7


(5)
Message 285 of 563 (910761)
05-12-2023 8:58 AM
Reply to: Message 281 by Phat
05-11-2023 2:13 PM


Re: If That Day Ever Comes
Phat writes:
If that day ever comes, I would like to see the look on the face of progressives when they realize how much of an idiot Joe Biden was (36% approval rating and dropping) when he spent all of this money on green new deals,shut down the US petroleum industry, and sanctioned Russia by using the US dollar as a weapon. You may even find Jesus during such a time.
I remain baffled that you're still such a rube for slick videos, that you think insults convey any useful information, and that you can't get basic facts straight. There's no point in engaging with you because the flow of nonsense is unending. There's no point in providing accurate information because you'll either ignore it, not understand it, or forget it by tomorrow.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 281 by Phat, posted 05-11-2023 2:13 PM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 289 by nwr, posted 05-12-2023 12:50 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
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