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Author Topic:   Anti-theist
Phat
Member
Posts: 16087
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 676 of 728 (895201)
06-14-2022 2:30 PM
Reply to: Message 670 by ringo
06-08-2022 11:45 AM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
That's exactly what He said, "Sell what you have and give to the poor." That's exactly what His disciples did.
Not *everyone that He knew did this. Mary and Martha didn't. The Roman Centurion didn't.
YOU keep claiming that I want the government to seize everything you have, despite me telling you repeatedly that it's supposed to be VOLUNTARY.
Exactly! Voluntary. The disciples did it as did the widow and the followers in Acts. BFD. EVERYONE that He spoke to didn't do it.
Phat writes:
So what does this mean today?
rngo writes:
The same as it meant 2000 years ago.
So why is it necessary to become totally broke?

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 670 by ringo, posted 06-08-2022 11:45 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 680 by AZPaul3, posted 06-14-2022 4:38 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 686 by ringo, posted 06-16-2022 11:57 AM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16087
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 677 of 728 (895202)
06-14-2022 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 675 by Tangle
06-13-2022 2:24 AM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
The only interpretation is that you don't believe in him either.
Not true.
I believe that He wants me to be a cheerful giver and not begrudging or of necessity. The "certain" rich young ruler was aware that he lacked something. I do not feel that way.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 675 by Tangle, posted 06-13-2022 2:24 AM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 679 by Tangle, posted 06-14-2022 3:29 PM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16087
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 678 of 728 (895203)
06-14-2022 3:28 PM
Reply to: Message 669 by jar
06-07-2022 5:49 PM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
The difference is that you planned for your retirement. I didnt.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 669 by jar, posted 06-07-2022 5:49 PM jar has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8579
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.9


(2)
Message 679 of 728 (895204)
06-14-2022 3:29 PM
Reply to: Message 677 by Phat
06-14-2022 2:33 PM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
Phat writes:
I believe that He wants me to be a cheerful giver and not begrudging or of necessity.
You believe only what suits you. But you can't deny his words.
(Actually you DO deny his words, that's why you don't actually believe in him.)
The "certain" rich young ruler was aware that he lacked something. I do not feel that way
You can rationalise all you want, that's not your Jesus's teaching is it?

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 677 by Phat, posted 06-14-2022 2:33 PM Phat has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6835
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 680 of 728 (895205)
06-14-2022 4:38 PM
Reply to: Message 676 by Phat
06-14-2022 2:30 PM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
So why is it necessary to become totally broke?
Phat, please. You have been told why.
That's what your god said to do. Those were specific instructions.
You know this. If you're looking for a deeper "why" then you're going to have to ask him.
It's bullshit, of course. You know it. I know it. So why do put up the facade? You are not christian® TM © . That's ok. No one is.
I still have some rookie cards for atheists. Would you like one?

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 676 by Phat, posted 06-14-2022 2:30 PM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 683 by Dredge, posted 06-15-2022 9:48 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 1613
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.1


(1)
Message 681 of 728 (895214)
06-15-2022 1:34 AM
Reply to: Message 645 by ringo
06-02-2022 12:00 PM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
ringo writes:
The early church did exactly as Jesus said: Acts 4:34-35 Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold, And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need. From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.
When did Jesus tell his followers to live in the commune described in Acts 4:34-35?
How did you get from ...
Jesus telling the rich young to give away all his wealth to the poor
TO
Jesus (allegedly) telling all his followers to live in a socialist commune?
You seem to be conflating two different and separate matters.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 645 by ringo, posted 06-02-2022 12:00 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 687 by ringo, posted 06-16-2022 12:06 PM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 1613
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 682 of 728 (895215)
06-15-2022 9:39 AM
Reply to: Message 660 by AZPaul3
06-06-2022 2:49 PM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
AZPaul3 writes:
The infallible declarations of your pope add to the mountain of abuse humans suffer under your cult. This is one of the reasons humanity must be rid of you.
Good luck getting rid of the Catholic Church. Jesus promised that it will never be destroyed; that "the gates of hell will not prevail against" it (Matt 16:18-19).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 660 by AZPaul3, posted 06-06-2022 2:49 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 685 by AZPaul3, posted 06-15-2022 9:52 PM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 1613
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 683 of 728 (895216)
06-15-2022 9:48 AM
Reply to: Message 680 by AZPaul3
06-14-2022 4:38 PM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
AZPaul3 writes:
That's what your god said to do. Those were specific instructions.
How ironic ... the only people who listen to your idiotic interpretation of the Bible are your fellow atheists.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 680 by AZPaul3, posted 06-14-2022 4:38 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 684 by AZPaul3, posted 06-15-2022 7:41 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 688 by ringo, posted 06-16-2022 12:08 PM Dredge has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6835
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 684 of 728 (895224)
06-15-2022 7:41 PM
Reply to: Message 683 by Dredge
06-15-2022 9:48 AM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
How ironic ... the only people who listen to your idiotic interpretation of the Bible are your fellow atheists.
Hell, atheists know we can't influence you. You don't even listen to your own god.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 683 by Dredge, posted 06-15-2022 9:48 AM Dredge has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6835
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 685 of 728 (895225)
06-15-2022 9:52 PM
Reply to: Message 682 by Dredge
06-15-2022 9:39 AM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
"the gates of hell will not prevail against" it (Matt 16:18-19).
Oh, is that in the bible? Then it's rubbish as far as reality goes.
Your church's history of evil, pain, blood, and more evil has convinced a majority of this planet's people that the Gates Of Hell guard over your church.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 682 by Dredge, posted 06-15-2022 9:39 AM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 690 by Dredge, posted 06-18-2022 5:03 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 19752
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 686 of 728 (895232)
06-16-2022 11:57 AM
Reply to: Message 676 by Phat
06-14-2022 2:30 PM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
Phat writes:
Not *everyone that He knew did this. Mary and Martha didn't. The Roman Centurion didn't.
So... they weren't saved. *shrug* You can't negate what He said by pointing out people who didn't comply. Look at the ones who did.
Phat writes:
Voluntary.
Voluntary - but a requirement for salvation. Jesus won't save anybody against their will.
Phat writes:
EVERYONE that He spoke to didn't do it.
See above.
The rich man asked, "What MUST I do to be saved?" and Jesus answered, "Sell what you have and give to the poor."
It's a MUST if you want to be saved. Anybody who did not comply would not be saved.
Phat writes:
So why is it necessary to become totally broke?
Ask Jesus.

"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man!"
-- Lucky Ned Pepper

This message is a reply to:
 Message 676 by Phat, posted 06-14-2022 2:30 PM Phat has not replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 19752
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 687 of 728 (895233)
06-16-2022 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 681 by Dredge
06-15-2022 1:34 AM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
Dredge writes:
When did Jesus tell his followers to live in the commune described in Acts 4:34-35?
It doesn't mention when He told them. It also doesn't mention His shoe size or His favorite pizza topping.
The point is that THEY thought He told them. Why do you think you know better than the church in Acts?
Dredge writes:
How did you get from ...
Jesus telling the rich young to give away all his wealth to the poor
TO
Jesus (allegedly) telling all his followers to live in a socialist commune?
Jesus told the rich man he MUST sell what he had and give to the poor. It was a requirement for salvation.
Why would there be different requirements for different people?
Dredge writes:
You seem to be conflating two different and separate matters.
How is it possible to separate them?

"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man!"
-- Lucky Ned Pepper

This message is a reply to:
 Message 681 by Dredge, posted 06-15-2022 1:34 AM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 689 by Dredge, posted 06-18-2022 1:48 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 19752
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.9


(3)
Message 688 of 728 (895234)
06-16-2022 12:08 PM
Reply to: Message 683 by Dredge
06-15-2022 9:48 AM


Re: Whose Money Is It Anyway?
Dredge writes:
How ironic ... the only people who listen to your idiotic interpretation of the Bible are your fellow atheists.
It is ironic isn't it? The people who refuse to follow Jesus' explicit instructions - and call His instructions "idiotic" - call themselves "Christians".

"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man!"
-- Lucky Ned Pepper

This message is a reply to:
 Message 683 by Dredge, posted 06-15-2022 9:48 AM Dredge has not replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 1613
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 689 of 728 (895254)
06-18-2022 1:48 PM
Reply to: Message 687 by ringo
06-16-2022 12:06 PM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
Dredge writes:
When did Jesus tell his followers to live in the commune described in Acts 4:34-35?
ringo writes:
It doesn't mention when He told them.
In other words, you have zero evidence that Jesus said all his followers must live in socialist communes. Therefore your claim is baseless.
It also doesn't mention His shoe size or His favorite pizza topping.
A devastating argument, to be sure.
The point is that THEY thought He told them.
The Holy Spirit told them (after the day of Pentecost), not Jesus.
Dredge writes:
How did you get from ...
Jesus telling the rich young to give away all his wealth to the poor
TO
Jesus (allegedly) telling all his followers to live in a socialist commune?
ringo writes:
Jesus told the rich man he MUST sell what he had and give to the poor.
Jesus instructed the rich man to give away his wealth to the "poor" ... which has got nothing whatsoever to do with donating all his wealth to, and then living in, a socialist commune.
It was a requirement for salvation.
It was a requirement for the Jewish Christians in Jerusalem at that time, not for all Christians. There is no evidence that Gentile Christians were commanded to live that way, let alone told that it is necessary for salvation.
Why would there be different requirements for different people?
I don't know.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 687 by ringo, posted 06-16-2022 12:06 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 696 by ringo, posted 06-18-2022 9:25 PM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 1613
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 690 of 728 (895256)
06-18-2022 5:03 PM
Reply to: Message 685 by AZPaul3
06-15-2022 9:52 PM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
AZPaul3 writes:
"the gates of hell will not prevail against" it (Matt 16:18-19).
Oh, is that in the bible? Then it's rubbish as far as reality goes.
Paradoxically, most of Satan's servants on earth don't even believe he exists.
As for knowing what reality is, you would know, being the Omniscient Master of All Reality.

Edited by Dredge, .


This message is a reply to:
 Message 685 by AZPaul3, posted 06-15-2022 9:52 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 691 by dwise1, posted 06-18-2022 5:26 PM Dredge has not replied
 Message 692 by AZPaul3, posted 06-18-2022 6:27 PM Dredge has not replied

  
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