EvC Forum: Finding God In The Waves

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Topic: Finding God In The Waves

ringo

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Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 9 of 105 (882504)
09-26-2020 12:30 PM

Reply to: Message 7 by Phat
09-26-2020 10:53 AM

Re: Leaarning From Others

Phat writes:

What if I told you that he once was a believer in the traditional apologetic sense that our jar from Texas hates so much, became an atheist,(thinking very similar to you and Tangle, and ringo...with some similarities to jar and stile, though absolutely NO similarity to myself(obviously), then he became a Mystic and "found God in the Waves....

I read the theism --> atheism -- > theism angle in the blurb on Amazon. No surprises there. Every fundy claims to have been an atheist once. Maybe they just don't understand what it means.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 22 of 105 (882531)
09-27-2020 3:26 PM

Reply to: Message 19 by Phat
09-27-2020 8:18 AM

Re: The EvC Fundamentalist's Peanut Gallery

Phat writes:

The faulty conclusion that many of you draw, however, is that *anyone* who honestly employs critical thinking skills will follow the conclusion that many (if not most) of you have followed.

I don't think anybody here expects that. Some people will remain deluded.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 24 of 105 (882533)
09-27-2020 3:57 PM

Reply to: Message 23 by Phat
09-27-2020 3:47 PM

Re: The EvC Fundamentalist's Peanut Gallery

Phat writes:

As ringo says based on his dimestore analysis from a quote on Amazon, McHargue did originally embrace Faith (faking it much of the way since he didnt allow his brain to be parked at the front door) primarily to get the girl...his future wife.

So the "dimestore analysis" was accurate.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 41 of 105 (882582)
09-29-2020 12:28 PM

Reply to: Message 37 by Phat
09-29-2020 11:41 AM

Re: Learning From Others

Phat writes:

To me, my internal feelings, perceptions and intuition are evidence.

You do not get to have your own private set of evidence. Evidence must be evident to everybody.

Consider the dead body on the floor and the suspect standing over it with a smoking gun in his hand.

The evidence is that the body is dead - no vital signs, etc.

If your intuition tells you the suspect is a murderer, that is not evidence.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 51 of 105 (882679)
10-04-2020 3:15 PM

Reply to: Message 50 by Phat
10-04-2020 3:07 PM

Re: Critical Analysis of this books CONTENT

Phat writes:

BTW ringo, I tried to find a transcript but there is none. Im working on it.

Don't worry about a transcript. Try to find your own words.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 54 of 105 (882744)
10-08-2020 12:20 PM

Reply to: Message 53 by Phat
10-08-2020 12:49 AM

Re: Critical Analysis of this books CONTENT

Phat writes:

And evidence should not be a necessary standard. Science Mike says as much.

Without evidence there can not be truth.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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	Message 53 by Phat, posted 10-08-2020 12:49 AM		Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 56 by Phat, posted 10-08-2020 11:45 PM	ringo has replied
	Message 87 by Phat, posted 11-24-2020 1:38 PM	ringo has replied

ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 61 of 105 (882757)
10-09-2020 12:15 PM

Reply to: Message 56 by Phat
10-08-2020 11:45 PM

Re: Critical Analysis of this books CONTENT

Phat writes:

The evidence was given.

That's what I keep telling you but you say, "evidence should not be a necessary standard."

Phat writes:

The mistake many of you make is listening to doctrines of demones....

The only demons are in your head.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 62 of 105 (882758)
10-09-2020 12:25 PM

Reply to: Message 58 by Phat
10-09-2020 5:05 AM

Re: A Handful Of "Science Mikes"

Phat writes:

I think we all understand what "being a Fundy" means. It means a Biblical Literalist, among other things.

I don't think so. I'd say that I'm much more of a literalist than you are.

It's just bizarre that you take the talking snake literally but you don't take Jesus' words literally.

Phat writes:

It is well documented that many people changed or were changed because of Jesus influence in their lives.

No it isn't. The evidence shows that there are more believers than unbelievers in prison.

Phat writes:

What was it about early Christians,for instance, that was perceived as a threat, apart from refusing to bow to some egotistical Caesar?

What makes you think they were perceived as a threat?

Phat writes:

Why were Christians used as human candles and burned?

Why did Christians burn heretics?

Phat writes:

What possible inner reason would the secular authorities---who were perceived as Deities themselves by the masses,have for this strong hatred of Christ, Christianity, and professing believers?

Again, what makes you think that "strong hatred" existed?

Phat writes:

The fact that so many people throughout time have spent so much energy attempting to discredit and disprove Christian beliefs and dogma.

And Christians have spent so much energy trying to discredit and disprove the beliefs of other religions.

Phat writes:

Do we see as much zeal aginst Buddhism? Judaism? Islam?

Yes.

Phat writes:

Now I will grant that some Christians themselves oppose Islam, though by and large seem more favorable towards Judaism. Why is that?

Because that's what the apologists tell them to think.

Come on. We've been through all of this over and over and over again. There is nothing unique about Christianity.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 73 of 105 (882796)
10-16-2020 12:09 PM

Reply to: Message 72 by Phat
10-16-2020 11:25 AM

Re: Basic Christian Philosophy

Phat writes:

Absolute Truth vs Relative Truth

If you believe in "Absolute Truth", you have to explain why different people embrace different "absolute" truths.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 88 of 105 (883273)
11-25-2020 11:14 AM

Reply to: Message 87 by Phat
11-24-2020 1:38 PM

Re: Critical Analysis of this books CONTENT

Phat writes:

There is no evidence anywhere in the woods apart from empty beercans, but all 4 of them would agree that they appeared to collectively see something unexplained. Based only on what evidence they have, can they deny (collectively) what they saw?

They SHOULD deny what they saw. For one thing, no two of them will have "seen" the exact same thing. They may actually try to get their story straight but they are just as likely to cling to their individual stories.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

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	Message 87 by Phat, posted 11-24-2020 1:38 PM		Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 89 by Phat, posted 11-25-2020 2:19 PM		ringo has replied

ringo

Member (Idle past 714 days)

Posts: 20940

From: frozen wasteland

Joined: 03-23-2005

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Message 92 of 105 (883304)
11-26-2020 11:41 AM

Reply to: Message 89 by Phat
11-25-2020 2:19 PM

Re: Critical Analysis of this books CONTENT

Phat writes:

My point is that they all saw the same event.

And your point is wrong. The same event happened - if indeed anything happened at all - but what the witnesses saw was in their individual minds. Which is why they all have different stories.

Phat writes:

There is One Spirit, not "many". To say there are many is to peddle a lie.

The snake started this lie by saying ye shall be as gods. There is only One.

That's a totally empty claim. it has no basis whatsoever in reality.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing