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Author Topic:   Exposing the evolution theory. Part 2
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2852
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 916 of 1104 (909671)
04-08-2023 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 910 by Kleinman
04-08-2023 8:39 AM


Re: problems with detecting design
Kleinman writes:
AZPaul3 has not done a physical examination or any laboratory tests on me and if he did, he would be charged with practicing medicine without a license.
However, I think APauling might be capable of conducting a psychiatric examination on someone, having been a psychiatric patient for most of his adult life.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 910 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 8:39 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 918 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 11:55 AM Dredge has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 448 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 917 of 1104 (909673)
04-08-2023 11:41 AM
Reply to: Message 913 by Dredge
04-08-2023 11:14 AM


Re: problems with detecting design
AZPaul3:
That you don't see these facts
Dredge:
They're not facts, con-man ... they're theories. Don't you ever get tired ???? of telling lies?

It isn't actually a theory. Here is the definition for "theory" from the American Heritage Dictionary:
Theory
A set of statements or principles devised to explain a group of facts or phenomena, especially one that has been repeatedly tested or is widely accepted and can be used to make predictions about natural phenomena.
AZPaul3 tries to include the concept of "universal common descent" with the concept of "evolution". There are no experimental tests that verify UCD. All evolutionary experiments contradict the notion of UCD.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 913 by Dredge, posted 04-08-2023 11:14 AM Dredge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 919 by Tangle, posted 04-08-2023 11:56 AM Kleinman has replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 448 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 918 of 1104 (909674)
04-08-2023 11:55 AM
Reply to: Message 916 by Dredge
04-08-2023 11:24 AM


Re: problems with detecting design
Kleinman:
AZPaul3 has not done a physical examination or any laboratory tests on me and if he did, he would be charged with practicing medicine without a license.
Dredge:
However, I think APauling might be capable of conducting a psychiatric examination on someone, having been a psychiatric patient for most of his adult life.

AZPaul3 may have had a lifetime filled with the inability of dealing with reality, but that only makes him experienced with that inability. Spending a lifetime being a psychiatric patient doesn't make a person any more knowledgeable about psychiatry than being a lifetime fan of baseball makes you a homerun hitter.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 916 by Dredge, posted 04-08-2023 11:24 AM Dredge has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9539
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.2


(2)
Message 919 of 1104 (909675)
04-08-2023 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 917 by Kleinman
04-08-2023 11:41 AM


Re: problems with detecting design
Kleinman writes:
It isn't actually a theory.
The Theory of Evolution, unsurprisingly, is a scientific theory and a scientific theory explains a set of facts. All of them, no exceptions. Exceptions disprove a theory.
The Theory is descent with modification.
The mechanism for modification is mutation followed by natural selection. The mechanism for descent is reproduction.
Do you accept these principles?
Common ancestry is a necessary conclusion from the above statements, it's NOT the theory.
To accept the theory but not the inevitable conclusion would be irrational, but since when has that been a problem for religionists?

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 917 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 11:41 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 921 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 12:10 PM Tangle has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8613
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 920 of 1104 (909676)
04-08-2023 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 913 by Dredge
04-08-2023 11:14 AM


Re: problems with detecting design
The facts of evolution are not hidden in a secret holy room in some church. They are available at museums and schools world wide for all to see and learn.
Religion lies about its gods and it's myths of creation and cannot produce any evidence for their fantasies.
Evolution has the facts and the evidence for all to see. All you need do, Dredge, is go see for yourself. I know schools, museums, knowledge in general scares you, Cracker muncher, but you can get through it. The knowledge is there for you. Let the scales fall from your eyes so you can see.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 913 by Dredge, posted 04-08-2023 11:14 AM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 922 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 12:15 PM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 926 by Dredge, posted 04-08-2023 1:16 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 448 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 921 of 1104 (909677)
04-08-2023 12:10 PM
Reply to: Message 919 by Tangle
04-08-2023 11:56 AM


Re: problems with detecting design
Kleinman:
It isn't actually a theory.
Tangle:
The Theory of Evolution, unsurprisingly, is a scientific theory and a scientific theory explains a set of facts. All of them, no exceptions. Exceptions disprove a theory.

The "Theory of Evolution" is not the "Theory of Universal Common Descent". They are two different things. So far, you and biologists have failed to explain why drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. You and biologists have gotten nowhere near verifying that the "Theory of Universal Common Descent" is a reasonable and rational theory. The fact is, all biological evolutionary experiments contradict this idea.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 919 by Tangle, posted 04-08-2023 11:56 AM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 925 by Tangle, posted 04-08-2023 1:08 PM Kleinman has replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 448 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 922 of 1104 (909678)
04-08-2023 12:15 PM
Reply to: Message 920 by AZPaul3
04-08-2023 12:06 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
AZPaul3:
The facts of evolution are not hidden in a secret holy room in some church. They are available at museums and schools world wide for all to see and learn.
Then it should be easy for you to explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. You won't because you don't have the ability to understand the evidence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 920 by AZPaul3, posted 04-08-2023 12:06 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 923 by AZPaul3, posted 04-08-2023 12:30 PM Kleinman has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8613
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.4


(1)
Message 923 of 1104 (909679)
04-08-2023 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 922 by Kleinman
04-08-2023 12:15 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
Idiot.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 922 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 12:15 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 924 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 12:34 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 448 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 924 of 1104 (909680)
04-08-2023 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 923 by AZPaul3
04-08-2023 12:30 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
AZPaul3:
Idiot.
That's AZPaul3's explanation of how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. He learned this from biologists. Their explanation is no better.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 923 by AZPaul3, posted 04-08-2023 12:30 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9539
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 925 of 1104 (909681)
04-08-2023 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 921 by Kleinman
04-08-2023 12:10 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
Kleinman writes:
The "Theory of Evolution" is not the "Theory of Universal Common Descent".
Correct and that is exactly what what I said isn't it?
They are two different things.
The UCA is a necessary conclusion of the ToE. It's is not the ToE.
You and biologists have gotten nowhere near verifying that the "Theory of Universal Common Descent" is a reasonable and rational theory. The fact is, all biological evolutionary experiments contradict this idea.
The fact that animals reproduce and have descendants provides the conclusion of UCD. It's logic and observation. But if you need experimentation why don't you map your family tree? See if you can find an error in it.
If you accept the ToE you MUST accept UCD* it's as simple as that. Otherwise you need to show how non-related animals can sit inside the same family tree. Go ahead, show us.
*there are some interesting exceptions at the single cell stage. There may be horizontal gene transfer in the very early stages of life.
Anyway here's a formal test of UCD for you to ignore and lie about not existing.
A formal test of the theory of universal common ancestry - PubMed

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 921 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 12:10 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 928 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 1:27 PM Tangle has not replied
 Message 930 by Dredge, posted 04-08-2023 1:34 PM Tangle has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2852
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 926 of 1104 (909682)
04-08-2023 1:16 PM
Reply to: Message 920 by AZPaul3
04-08-2023 12:06 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
You need to stop lying and making a fool of yourself by claiming that the theory of evolution is a fact. Your psychiatrist has on numerous occasions explained to you that it is your insecurity that compels you to tell that lie ... yet you keep doing it. You seem to be a slow learner.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 920 by AZPaul3, posted 04-08-2023 12:06 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 927 by Tangle, posted 04-08-2023 1:23 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9539
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 927 of 1104 (909683)
04-08-2023 1:23 PM
Reply to: Message 926 by Dredge
04-08-2023 1:16 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
Dredge writes:
You need to stop lying and making a fool of yourself by claiming that the theory of evolution is a fact.
ffs, get it into your dense skull, a scientific theory is a far higher level of knowledge than a simple fact. A theory explains facts, all of them.
But for your simple mind, the ToE IS a fact in the sense of common usage. It is in fact, a fact of life.
Enough trolling.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 926 by Dredge, posted 04-08-2023 1:16 PM Dredge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 929 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 1:30 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 448 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 928 of 1104 (909684)
04-08-2023 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 925 by Tangle
04-08-2023 1:08 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
Kleinman:
The "Theory of Evolution" is not the "Theory of Universal Common Descent".
Tangle:
Correct and that is exactly what what I said isn't it?
Kleinman:
They are two different things.
Tangle:
The UCA is a necessary conclusion of the ToE. It's is not the ToE.



You and biologists' inability to understand the physics and mathematics of descent with modification and adaptation does not make UCA or UCD or whatever you want to call it necessary or possible. Biologists' experiments show that UCD is not possible simply because of the huge populations required and rapid recovery rates necessary for descent with modification and adaptation to work. And these findings are when only one selection condition is used at a time in these experiments. The populations required are exponentially larger when two or more selection conditions are applied to a population for descent with modification and adaptation to operate. That is why 3-drug therapy (3 selection conditions) works for the treatment of HIV. You still have not learned how biological evolution works and neither have biologists.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 925 by Tangle, posted 04-08-2023 1:08 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 448 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 929 of 1104 (909685)
04-08-2023 1:30 PM
Reply to: Message 927 by Tangle
04-08-2023 1:23 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
Dredge:
You need to stop lying and making a fool of yourself by claiming that the theory of evolution is a fact.
Tangle:
ffs, get it into your dense skull, a scientific theory is a far higher level of knowledge than a simple fact. A theory explains facts, all of them.

Tangle will now explain to us how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. Nope, he won't and neither will biologists.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 927 by Tangle, posted 04-08-2023 1:23 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2852
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 930 of 1104 (909686)
04-08-2023 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 925 by Tangle
04-08-2023 1:08 PM


Re: problems with detecting design
Tangled writes:
Anyway here's a formal test of UCD for you to ignore and lie about not existing.
A formal test of the theory of universal common ancestry - PubMed
"Theobald recently challenged this problem with a formal statistical test, and concluded that the UCA hypothesis holds. Although his attempt is the first step towards establishing the UCA theory with a solid statistical basis, we think that the test of Theobald is not sufficient enough to reject the alternative hypothesis of the separate origins of life"
Was the universal common ancestry proved? - PubMed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 925 by Tangle, posted 04-08-2023 1:08 PM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 931 by Kleinman, posted 04-08-2023 2:11 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 933 by Tangle, posted 04-08-2023 2:53 PM Dredge has replied

  
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