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Author Topic:   The Sudden Dawn of the Cosmos and the Constancy of Physical Laws
jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(2)
Message 8 of 244 (821973)
10-16-2017 5:39 PM


Another YAWN topic
The Laws of Physics are simply human creations and of course did not exist before humans created them fairly recently.
Before the Big Bang really is another one of those fun games but doesn't have much validity or use. But it was not an explosion or an object but rather simply the point where our current descriptions break down and stop making sense.
There are lots of kids that say "well something can't come from nothing" but the correct answer at this time is "We don't know that." and NOT try to stick some unevidenced favorite fantasy in as an answer.
And can laws change?
What we can say is that there is direct and conclusive evidence that for at least the last 14 billion years the properties and processes have remained the same even though the laws do change as we learn more and more about reality.
Remember the "Laws" are absolutely nothing but human created and verifiable descriptions of what is seen in reality. The Laws do absolutely nothing but allow us to discuss what is seen.
AbE: Also, the idea that constancy might result from acts of some God, particularly the God of the Bible is just silly. The Bible is filled with examples of that God changing her mind or behaving irrationally or changing the rules of nature.
No reasonable person would ever trust an existence where the properties and performance were at the whim of anyone so unstable.
Edited by jar, : see AbE:

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Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Christian7, posted 10-16-2017 6:56 PM jar has replied
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 10-17-2017 4:41 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 10 of 244 (821979)
10-16-2017 7:48 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Christian7
10-16-2017 6:56 PM


Re: Another YAWN topic
Guido writes:
How can we rely on the scientific method to conclude anything about nature, if cause and effect being unnecessary, nature is not constant.
Yup, another big YAWN.
We can look at past experience as I already pointed out to you and see that for at least 14 billion years the processes have been going on pretty much as they do today.
Guido writes:
So far the God of the Bible has a perfect track record of keeping His promises and fulfilling prophecy
Bullshit.
That is utter nonsense as you well know. We have examined Biblical Prophecy numerous times here at EvC and so far almost none have been supportable.
Guido writes:
Hebrews says, "Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and forever."
Which again is one of those loved quote mined lines taken out of context that has absolutely no value or meaning.
Edited by jar, : appalin spallin ee in hr

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 17 of 244 (821991)
10-17-2017 7:36 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Phat
10-17-2017 4:41 AM


Re: The YAWN and the RESTLESS
Phat writes:
Doesnt this imply that the law of gravity existed before humans invented the words to call it a law and the experiments to verify the behavior?
The property we call gravity is part of the universe itself. The "Law of Gravity" has changed many times in the past as we learn more about the property that we call gravity. But gravity is simply a property of this universe. There is no evidence that it was created or that it could exist separate from this universe itself.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 19 of 244 (822004)
10-17-2017 10:56 AM
Reply to: Message 18 by Phat
10-17-2017 10:43 AM


Re: The YAWN and the RESTLESS
Phat writes:
Which in one sense is arguably true but in another sense obviously ludicrous.
Is Ganesha obviously ludicrous and Jesus not obviously ludicrous?
Is Jesus obviously ludicrous and Ganesha not obviously ludicrous?
Reality does not originate with humans but Gods, laws and wisdom do.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 25 of 244 (822022)
10-17-2017 4:22 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by Phat
10-17-2017 4:11 PM


Re: Predictable Behavior?
Phat writes:
Yellowstone could blow up, too. The chance of that happening is likely greater than the laws of Physics changing.
There is a near certainty that there will be another Yellowstone Mega eruption. It almost certainly WILL happen since the evidence is that it is a recurring even that has happened many times in the past.
A map of prior hotspots with numbers equal date of eruption in millions of years ago from History of Yellowstone Caldera.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 30 of 244 (822075)
10-18-2017 4:17 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by ringo
10-18-2017 3:24 PM


Re: Predictable Behavior?
Or, like the God in Genesis 2&3 telling you only partial truths, setting you up to fail and lying to you as well.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 32 of 244 (822081)
10-18-2017 7:16 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by Taq
10-18-2017 5:37 PM


Re: Another YAWN topic
Plus we have the evidence of Science being self correcting and searching for places where it is wrong while the Biblical Christianity is factually wrong and has a history of not ever correcting factual errors and even denying the obvious factual errors exist.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 40 of 244 (888144)
09-06-2021 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Christian7
09-06-2021 11:39 AM


Re: Actual Big Bang Theory
Guido writes:
Therefore, it must have been made by a faithful God, one who upheld it for thousands of years.
Good grief Guido; haven't you learned anything at all?
Are you still simply set on posting silly assertions that are not just wrong but sophomoric?

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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 76 of 244 (888380)
09-17-2021 11:22 AM
Reply to: Message 74 by Percy
09-17-2021 10:18 AM


Re: Paul Steinhardt on Dark Energy.
Percy writes:
Christian7 writes:
Nothing can begin without a cause; the beginning of something is not in itself, therefore an outside being or object began it.
What's makes you think this? We know of no causal event for the Big Bang, for virtual particles, or for the time when a radioactive atom decays. Our observations of the natural world reveal some phenomena with causes and some without.
What is so funny and typical of the Christian Cult of Ignorance is that if they truly believed such nonsense they also make the God they market irrelevant and impossible.

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Replies to this message:
 Message 77 by Christian7, posted 09-17-2021 1:34 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 79 of 244 (888383)
09-17-2021 2:12 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by Christian7
09-17-2021 1:34 PM


Re: Paul Steinhardt on Dark Energy.
Yup.
The Christian Cult of Ignorance loves to wallow in such fantasies.

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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 98 of 244 (888402)
09-17-2021 6:52 PM
Reply to: Message 97 by Christian7
09-17-2021 6:11 PM


Re: Bad Philosophy
Guido writes:
Maybe you're not an atheists, but many atheists affirm that God is a logical impossibility.
Not quite Guido but speaking not as an atheist but as a Christian the God you try to market is both a logical and factual impossibility; it is but the creation of either ignorant or dishonesty or deluded humans.
Edited by jar, : appalin spallin

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This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 147 of 244 (888453)
09-18-2021 8:15 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by Christian7
09-18-2021 8:11 AM


Re: Bad Philosophy
Guido writes:
True or false: The universe conforms to what our logic tells us when the arguments are sound?
Often false. Often true. More often unknown.

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This message is a reply to:
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jar
Member (Idle past 370 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 158 of 244 (888464)
09-18-2021 11:25 AM
Reply to: Message 157 by Percy
09-18-2021 10:40 AM


It's hilarious when folks like Guido point to the Pharaoh without admitting that that story shows God to be capricious, evil, and cruel beyond any possible redemption.

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This message is a reply to:
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