Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
4 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,818 Year: 3,075/9,624 Month: 920/1,588 Week: 103/223 Day: 1/13 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   The Brand New Birther Thread
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 211 of 218 (795793)
12-15-2016 7:46 PM
Reply to: Message 208 by Faith
12-15-2016 6:55 PM


Re: The Kenyan grandmother's story
And here's a mistake even earlier than the one Modulous found.
https://file.wikileaks.org/...t-from-honolulu-advertiser.pdf
Now, how did the Honolulu Advertiser, way back in 1961, well before Obama was in the public eye, make such a bizarrely specific mistake as to say that the Obamas lived at 6085 Kalanianaole Highway, when in fact they were somewhere in Kenya?
How did the Star Bulletin make exactly the same mistake?
Boy, I bet their faces are red!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 208 by Faith, posted 12-15-2016 6:55 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 217 by Faith, posted 12-24-2016 1:42 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 212 of 218 (795797)
12-16-2016 12:32 AM


The Mailman Thing Redux
It occurred to me, looking over this mailman thing ...
In the early 1990s, I spoke with Mary Ayers who told me she was impressed with a foreign, black student. I do not recall from what country she said he was. I recall that the student had an unusual, foreign sounding name.
If this was Obama, why in the world would she call him a foreign student? Remember, the birther nonsense depends on the legally dubious proposition that although Obama is certainly a citizen by virtue of being his mother's son, being born in Kenya would make him not "natural born". But either way, he was born an American. Moreover, the earliest date he could have been at the Ayers house was 1989. At that point it had been 14 years, half his life, since his return to America, and he had of course been raised by his American mother prior to that. My point being that he wasn't going around saying "Me gonna be big fella President, ooga booga."
So, it would be kind of weird for Ayers to call him a foreign student, since he was an American citizen by birth who spoke, dressed, and behaved exactly like any other American. But for the Birther interpretation to bear any weight, we have to believe not only that she called him "foreign" but that when she did so she meant exactly that he was born abroad, no more and no less.
'Cos if she meant any less than that (e.g. that he'd spent much of his youth overseas, or had a foreign father, or a vestige of an Indonesian accent) it would be no use to Birthers, and if she meant any more than that (e.g. that he wasn't a citizen) then she'd just be making a silly mistake which would be no more evidential than if she'd called him a horse. Therefore, for Birther purposes, she had to know the exact circumstances of Obama's birth and citizenship and then she had to use "foreign" exactly in the sense of "a person who is an American citizen by birth and who spent most of his life in America and appears to be a totally normal American, but happened to be born overseas."
But no-one ever does use the word in that sense. That is not a sense that it has. For example, John McCain was born in Panama, a fact that is known to millions of people, and yet a google search on the phrases "John McCain is foreign" and "John McCain is a foreigner" shows that no-one on the entire Internet has ever said either of those things. I am the first, and I'm explaining how dumb it would be.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 213 of 218 (795798)
12-16-2016 12:34 AM
Reply to: Message 207 by Faith
12-15-2016 6:47 PM


Re: The Kenyan grandmother's story
quote:
I get criticized for everything I do, right or wrong. My arguments on this subject are really really good. Doesn't stop the Choir of Criticizers. And I do check on most things anyway.
Just a few posts above you quoted a foolishly wrong argument from Tom Lipscomb. One you should have known was foolishly wrong Message 203
Now either you foolishly thought it was good (foolish because even you know perfectly well that Kenya was not a random choice) or you knew it was no good and decided to use it anyway.
Neither speaks well of you and your case.
It doesn't really matter whether you are biased to a completely ridiculous degree or just plain flat-out lying. But the fact remains that you call bad arguments good and complain that other people dare to point out the flaws in them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 207 by Faith, posted 12-15-2016 6:47 PM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 214 of 218 (795799)
12-16-2016 4:22 AM
Reply to: Message 207 by Faith
12-15-2016 6:47 PM


Re: The Kenyan grandmother's story
And I do check on most things anyway.
You do a fairly poor job of checking things. Getting most things right (anything over 50 percent) is not a good track record. You've had to back off of any number of assertions in this thread alone. If you want an accounting, I'd be happy to provide one.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 207 by Faith, posted 12-15-2016 6:47 PM Faith has not replied

  
14174dm
Member (Idle past 1109 days)
Posts: 161
From: Cincinnati OH
Joined: 10-12-2015


Message 215 of 218 (795804)
12-16-2016 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 181 by Faith
12-15-2016 4:04 PM


Re: Denying the facts means imputing false personal motivations to knowers of the facts
The RCC murdered something like fifty million Protestants over the six hundred years of the official Inquisition
Fifty million? Quick internet search gives multiple sources of numbers in the tens of thousands. You'll have to come up with reliable sources before I believe a number that enormous.
The Protestants did some indefensible things too but on a minuscule scale by comparison
Seriously? Native Americans? African slaves? Irish Catholics? Especially during the Potato Famine?
This string of posts is off-topic and should be in another thread.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 181 by Faith, posted 12-15-2016 4:04 PM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 216 of 218 (795809)
12-16-2016 6:02 PM
Reply to: Message 203 by Faith
12-15-2016 6:11 PM


Re: The Kenyan grandmother's story
Dr Adequate writes:
Rather than, say, relying on her unreliable memory, which you do all the time?
Faith writes:
Yes, I do, because it's too hard to keep looking things up in a debate with half a dozen people who wouldn't appreciate the effort anyway.
Lol! And even when you do look things up, you come up with fakes and misreadings a high percentage of the time. So you are right... why even bother to make attempts at accuracy if you are going to fail much of the time when you do some research.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by Faith, posted 12-15-2016 6:11 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 217 of 218 (796191)
12-24-2016 1:42 PM
Reply to: Message 211 by Dr Adequate
12-15-2016 7:46 PM


Re: The Kenyan grandmother's story
Computer is down, using a borrowed laptop.
It's not hard to fake any of that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 211 by Dr Adequate, posted 12-15-2016 7:46 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 218 by Dr Adequate, posted 12-24-2016 1:55 PM Faith has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 218 of 218 (796192)
12-24-2016 1:55 PM
Reply to: Message 217 by Faith
12-24-2016 1:42 PM


Re: The Kenyan grandmother's story
It's not hard to fake any of that.
Really? How would you go about doing so?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by Faith, posted 12-24-2016 1:42 PM Faith has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024