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Author | Topic: Corporatocracy Wins Again | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Jon Inactive Member |
Okay, then how would you change the text of the law? I imagine the law in question is several thousand pages long; editing the text itself is probably beyond my ability and patience. Nevertheless, I think we can still have a reasonable discussion about what laws are good laws, which laws are bad laws, and which laws need changing.
I thought the supreme court made an adequate argument, did you read it? Not entirely. Do you have a link?
What I said is that employers should be expected to treat their employees decently, and part of that involves paying them for the time they require them to be at work. I don't think anyone has disagreed with that. Then what are you getting at in this thread?Love your enemies!
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Jon Inactive Member
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I would take the queue time as an opportunity to hang out with my co-workers rather than as an inconvenience. I would take it as a half hour of pay I am losing from my other part-time job that isn't being compensated for by the employer demanding that I wait in line to satisfy their curiosity.Love your enemies!
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
I imagine the law in question is several thousand pages long; editing the text itself is probably beyond my ability and patience. Nevertheless, I think we can still have a reasonable discussion about what laws are good laws, which laws are bad laws, and which laws need changing. In my opinion, there's no point in discussing the quality of laws if we are not looking at the text of the legislation.
I thought the supreme court made an adequate argument, did you read it? Not entirely. Do you have a link? http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/14pdf/13-433_5h26.pdf Let me know which parts you disagree with.
Then what are you getting at in this thread? They ought to pay them, but they're not legally required to nor should they be.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
I would take the queue time as an opportunity to hang out with my co-workers rather than as an inconvenience. I don't want my employer scheduling mandatory fun for me. To be frank, this stuff matters primarily to hourly employees who may very well have second jobs. I find it absolutely bizarre that an employer would find ways to occupy an hourly employee's free time without compensating him. The statute as I understand it, is intended to identify things like walking to work or standing in a clock out line that are not productive for the employer. I have some sympathy for that. But I have no sympathy for an employer who occupies employees for activities that do benefit the employer without providing compensation.Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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petrophysics1 Inactive Member |
NoNukes,
I haven't been an employee since April 1985. I make contracts with people. Let's see how that works compared to you or others more or less. I only work by the day, the rate is $1250/day. No half days no standby no anything else. To come to the location you pay me $1.00/mile, at my present location I drove 876 miles to get here. You have to pay within 10 days of my invoice. I get no vacation...I don't work I don't get paid. No medical or other crap like retirement. I do that myself. You don't pay unemployment insurance or disability, that's all stuff I do. Either of us can cancel this contract at anytime for no reason. This is only for adults, if you are a child of the state, or need people to take care of you, get used to kissing someone's ass.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9197 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.2 |
That would be the difference than an employee and an employer. Do you expect your employees to spend uncompensated time at work?
I don't think you made the point you think you are making. Edited by Theodoric, : Employer should have been employee oopsFacts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
[qs=Jon]
ringo writes:
Well, I can see it wouldn't be much fun waiting in line with you. I would take the queue time as an opportunity to hang out with my co-workers rather than as an inconvenience.[/qs=ringo]I would take it as a half hour of pay I am losing from my other part-time job that isn't being compensated for by the employer demanding that I wait in line to satisfy their curiosity. Is your time really that valuable, Mr. Self-Important?
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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NoNukes writes:
I'm talking about making the best of a "bad" situation. I don't want my employer scheduling mandatory fun for me. You're probably the guy who waits five minutes in line at the supermarket and then wastes another five minutes whining to the cashier about it. And I'm always behind you. But I'm busy talking to the cute chick who's rolling her eyes at your antics.
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Jon Inactive Member |
http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/14pdf/13-433_5h26.pdf Let me know which parts you disagree with. It's one big rambling excuse for them not doing the right thing.
Then what are you getting at in this thread? They ought to pay them, but they're not legally required to nor should they be. Then that's the argument you need to make.Love your enemies!
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Jon Inactive Member |
I'm talking about making the best of a "bad" situation. That would be accomplished by either paying the people for waiting in line or hiring more screeners so that there isn't a line in the first place.Love your enemies!
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Given your response to the Supreme Court's argument, I'll refrain from making mine.
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Jon writes:
I'm talking about ME making the best of a bad situation. It's much more practical to change my own attitude than to try to change the company's policy.
ringo writes:
That would be accomplished by either paying the people for waiting in line or hiring more screeners so that there isn't a line in the first place. I'm talking about making the best of a "bad" situation.
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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petrophysics1 writes:
I presume you drove on roads that you built yourself? Or do you have a childlike dependency on the state's roads?
To come to the location you pay me $1.00/mile, at my present location I drove 876 miles to get here.
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Jon Inactive Member |
I'm talking about ME making the best of a bad situation. It's much more practical to change my own attitude than to try to change the company's policy. Personally I can agree. I am not one to push back. But I can easily understand others pushing back, and I even appreciate the fact that they do. Just because I am the bend-over-and-take-it type doesn't mean I expect everyone else to be. JonLove your enemies!
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Jon writes:
In the long run, the pushing back costs you just as much as what the company is doing. Ultimately, the individual pays for everything.
But I can easily understand others pushing back, and I even appreciate the fact that they do.
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