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Author | Topic: Are Atheists Mentally Ill | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Percy Member Posts: 22393 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2
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Jon writes: How do you actually measure the strictness with which a religion adheres to its holy book(s)? What are 'traditional rules and roles'? Are Muslims really less conservative than Jehovah's Witnesses? Are secular folk more conservative than Hindus? Seriously? Hard to believe, but briefly in case you're serious, conservative religions are those with greater religiosity. Examples of traditional roles and rules would be where a wife is expected to submit gracefully to her husband's bidding, or where marriage can only be between a man and woman. About judging whether any specific religion is more conservative than another specific religion, I wouldn't know how to do that. The x-axis is not a stand-in for religious conservatism and I didn't say it was. What I said was that the graph shows that the more conservative religions, those with greater religiosity, have lower income and lower education. --Percy
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marc9000 Member Posts: 1509 From: Ky U.S. Joined: Member Rating: 1.4 |
Your NY Times link didn't work for me. I'll check it again some other time.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
Was I wrong to read "Once X then Y" as saying that X is required for Y? Once I turn left on D Street, I find myself at my house. Does that statement imply that turning left on D is the only way to get to my house? Clearly not.Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I believe that a scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy.Richard P. Feynman If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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Jon Inactive Member |
The x-axis is not a stand-in for religious conservatism and I didn't say it was. Exactly. Conservativeness isn't on the graph at all.
What I said was that the graph shows that the more conservative religions, those with greater religiosity, have lower income and lower education. Well, no, by your own admission the graph says nothing about conservativeness at all.
Seriously? Hard to believe, but briefly in case you're serious, conservative religions are those with greater religiosity. Examples of traditional roles and rules would be where a wife is expected to submit gracefully to her husband's bidding, or where marriage can only be between a man and woman. Well; that didn't answer my questions at all. Love your enemies!
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Once I turn left on D Street, I find myself at my house. Does that statement imply that turning left on D is the only way to get to my house? Clearly not. Sure, but its saying to me that if you hadn't turned left on D street, then you wouldn't have found yourself at your house. You might be able to get to your house through another route, but the statement is implying that you're on the one that requires a left turn on D street.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
As you approach the more conservative religions, you approach lower incomes and education.
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Jon Inactive Member |
As you approach the more conservative religions, you approach lower incomes and education. The graphic doesn't show this. It doesn't even address the issue of which religions are more conservative. Love your enemies!
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7
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No it doesn't but observation and evaluation of the data and comparing it with other knowledge did. The graphic does not exist in a vacuum. We can, and should, bring other knowledge and data when we look at and analyze the graphic.
You posts are becoming inane and trollish.Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
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Jon Inactive Member |
No it doesn't but observation and evaluation of the data and comparing it with other knowledge did. The graphic does not exist in a vacuum. We can, and should, bring other knowledge and data when we look at and analyze the graphic. And that's all fine and well. My question to Percy was for clarification on what 'knowledge and data' were used in determining the conservativeness of a religion. Are there any outliers or anomalies on the graph in terms of what can be said about religions based on their conservativeness?Love your enemies!
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Percy Member Posts: 22393 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
Jon writes: The x-axis is not a stand-in for religious conservatism and I didn't say it was.
Exactly. Conservativeness isn't on the graph at all.
What I said was that the graph shows that the more conservative religions, those with greater religiosity, have lower income and lower education. Well, no, by your own admission the graph says nothing about conservativeness at all. I never said the graph provided information about which religions are conservative. We already know that the Baptists, Pentecostals and Jehovah's Witnesses are very conservative, and I noted that those religions are on the part of the graph with the lowest incomes and education. --Percy Edited by Percy, : Spelling.
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Percy Member Posts: 22393 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
Apparently the NYT site was the victim of a DOS attack yesterday. It seems to be up now.
--Percy
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
My question to Percy was for clarification on what 'knowledge and data' were used in determining the conservativeness of a religion. See this is you trolling. There are commonly accepted definitions for a conservative religion. You might want to try, google, bing, or my fave duckduck go, and do some research. It might take you 10 seconds. Also, if that is the question you wanted to ask Percy maybe you should have just asked him.
Are there any outliers or anomalies on the graph in terms of what can be said about religions based on their conservativeness? I am not sure what this beast of a question is even asking. Are there any conservative religions that are outliers from the rest?Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
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As you approach the more conservative religions, you approach lower incomes and education.
The graphic doesn't show this. Sure it does. Look at the religions that we know are the most conservative; They fall on the bottom left side of the graph.
It doesn't even address the issue of which religions are more conservative. It doesn't need to. We already know which ones are the conservative ones.
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Jon Inactive Member |
We already know that the Baptists, Pentecostals and Jehovah's Witnesses are very conservative, and I noted that those religions are on the part of the graph with the lowest incomes and education. That's it? Three of the eighteen fit your pattern? What about the Muslims? What about the secular folk? How are you determining which religions are conservative when you admittedly aren't able to judge the conservativeness of one religion against the conservativeness of another? Are those the only three conservative ones? Are there others? How do you decide?Love your enemies!
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Jon Inactive Member |
Nonsense. The secular group falls in the lower halfbehind Conservative Jews. And we cannot even guess at the conservativeness of the 'unaffiliated religious' because we don't have a clue in hell as to what they believe or practicethey are essentially an 'others' category.
Look at the religions that we know are the most conservative; They fall on the bottom left side of the graph. Yes. But look at all of theminstead of just the conservative onesand we see a distributional pattern completely divorced from the conservativeness of the belief system. You are doing what Percy is doing: picking and focusing on only the data sets that fit your predefined pattern while ignoring the others. That don't work.Love your enemies!
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