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Author | Topic: Is the Bible the inerrant word of God? Or is it the words of men? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Zift Ylrhavic Resfear writes:
That's it exactly.
If he truly cares about us, then he would rather have us do it without believing in him than not doing it but believing in him.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Actually, there are two separate questons: "Were they inspired by some outside source?" and if so, "Did that source have knowledge and insight superior to themselves?" The Bible is obviously words of men. The question is whether or not these men were inspired from a source of knowledge and insight superior to themselves. It's clear that the Bible is not inerrant, so either the inspiration was faulty or the message itself was faulty. Either way, the problem appears to be at the source.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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GDR writes:
It's pretty simple, isn't it? If it goes well, you give God the credit. If it goes badly, you give people the blame. It's a flawless copout.
We should accept the fact that the Bible is subject to the cultural and personal biases of the authors. Frankly it is only in that context that you can actually get a coherent narrative of God's interaction with us.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
GDR writes:
It was people who captured Long John Silver and it was God who helped him escape. It was people who crucified Jesus and if Jesus was resurrected then it was God who resurrected Him. No, wait. It was Jim Hawkins. That would be more plausible, wouldn't it?
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
GDR writes:
Then who inspired Long John Silver?
As I understood the story it was that God inspired Jim Hawkins to make it all possible. That is the most plausible of all.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Ossat writes:
Science is basically a matter of one step forward and two steps back; every question we answer provokes two more questions. That's why science-minded people tend to be leery of any claims that a book has all the answers. I know you don't believe in anything of this and think that mainstream scientist have everything figured out. I used to have as my signature, "People who have all the answers usually don't understand the questions." That's the problem with the Bible.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
djufo writes:
How do you know the intentions of the authors? The ancient texts were never written in "belief". Why did Ian Fleming write Casino Royale? Did he need the money? Was he trying to prove he could write as well as Tolstoy? Did he do it on a bet? I'm sure he told people why he did it in interviews, etc. but how do we know he was telling the truth? He was a fiction writer, after all. How do we know that anything he said wasn't fiction? And if we can't tell the intentions of somebody in our own lifetime, how much harder is it to tell the intentions of somebody thousands of years ago?
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
djufo writes:
Similar is not the same as "the same". There are similarities between myths around the world but there are also great differences.
The mayans depicted the same deities depicted in mesopotamia, as the ones in ancient India and Peru. djufo writes:
There is a variety of evidence that George Washington et al. existed. Volumes were written about them during their own lifetimes and shortly after by people who actually knew them. No single piece of evidence is conclusive but the body of evidence is persuasive.
Also based on your logic, why should we believe that Washington and the founding fathers really existed? djufo writes:
That seems to be your logic, that the gods "must" be real because people all over the world believed in them.
just because everybody believes the story means is truth and I am forced to believe it too? djufo writes:
The bottom line is that they didn't know "the truth". They only knew what they believed to be true. That's why beliefs all around the world are different, because nobody knows "the truth".
Bottom line, why in the world ancients civilizations would base their existence in writing our origins the best they could to pass it onto us other than the truth?
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
If somebody else knew "the truth", how would you know they knew? If you could know that what they know is "the truth", wouldn't you know "the truth" too?
Its quite a blanket assertion to declare that--just because we don't know the truth that nobody does.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
So you need to know the answer before you can read the question correctly? You need to know whodunit so you can decide what clues to look for? ... you have to understand the concept to know how to read these things. You need to know that the Bible is inerrant before you can sweep the errancies under the rug?
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
Who sez so? The Bible? If you have to assume the truth to conclude the truth, that isn't just circular; it's a maelstrom.
We are to understand the Bible by the light of the Bible.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
That's what I said. And we are to understand oxygen by breathing. It's a lot cheaper than those pesky laboratories.
I think what she means is that in her belief, we (humans) are to understand truth through the light of the truth. Phat writes:
And His name is Allah.
Proponents would claim that there is one truth, one light, and one God. Phat writes:
For whatever reason, this God appears to have made you a contrarian who questions not only God but human logic, reason, and belief.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
It's a pyramid.
Does it look like an M.C. Escher sketch?
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
The problem is that your theology implodes if it is nothing but self-reference. You could build such a theology on any book.
It is a standard rule of Biblical exegesis to interpret Bible by Bible because you risk developing a false theology based on partial concepts taken out of context if you don't.
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ringo Member (Idle past 670 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Faith writes:
You don't know the Bible.
Anyone who knows and believes the Bible and represents it correctly speaks for God, sorry.
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