Would you say that the Christian Nationalists are allied with the Jewish Nationalists in the formation of a Theocratic Israel and apocalyptic thinking? One of the verses in Revelation:
Rev 3:7-11:
"And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write,
'These things says He who is holy, He who is true, "He who has the key of David, He who opens and no one shuts, and shuts and no one opens": 8 "I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it; for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My name. 9 Indeed I will make those of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie -- indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you. 10 Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.
Assuming that the "Dusty Old Book" contains any truth in it, goes on to describe these latter-day Jews who lie and claim to be Jews but are not. Some say that the European Zionists, who became the leaders of modern-day Israel and who are allegedly committing genocide in Gaza, are the ones being described in this scripture. Together with the Christian Nationalists, both groups use apocalyptic thinking to justify military actions in the Middle East. Perhaps the scripture is speaking to the Christians in Gaza? Comments?
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy God alone is God *but* God is not alone~Ellis Potter We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
Critics would of course say that "God" is a product of human imagination...but then again God may well declare that all of creation is a product of His imagination! It is all in the perspective of the observer.~Phat
Would you say that the Christian Nationalists are allied with the Jewish Nationalists in the formation of a Theocratic Israel and apocalyptic thinking?
I would not say that.
People are complex, with complex motivations. Some Christian Nationalists are supporting Israel, but I would be cautious about jumping to broad conclusions about that.
I'm inclined to think of Revelation as fantasy rather than as prophecy.
Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity
I have a conservative Roman Catholic friend who is also my accountant. I have known this man since he was 15 (he now has kids older than that) and in the midst of our conversation the other day I brought up this latest book that I was listening to on Audible whereupon he instantly criticized the credibility of the author due to the very circumstances regarding his birth.(the parents sinned by breaking their vows to the church). I looked into this more once I saw Dwise1s reply Message 1268 and watched the excellent videos he had of Fugelsangs book tour and defense of his book. (Adding one from The Daily Show)
The more that I hear Fugelsang use scripture to challenge and dethrone Christian Nationalism,the more I am convicted that his way is right and my beliefs have been tainted and compromised over the years. In particular, I applauded the way that he mourned for Charlie Kirk and lamented that Kirk, now dead, will never get a chance to repent and grow in his ways.
Thank you, Mr. Wise. You and nwr are my voices of conscience here at EvC.
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy God alone is God *but* God is not alone~Ellis Potter We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
Critics would of course say that "God" is a product of human imagination...but then again God may well declare that all of creation is a product of His imagination! It is all in the perspective of the observer.~Phat
Given your reaction here, you may also be interested in this sermon. Apparently it's a couple years old, but I just saw it today.
Edited by Admin, : Fix YouTube code.
-->“The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.” - Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
“A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity.” – Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." - Barash, David 1995...
"Many that live deserve death. And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then be not too eager to deal out death in the name of justice, fearing for your own safety. Even the wise cannot see all ends." - Gandalf, J. R. R. Tolkien: The Lord Of the Rings
"The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." 1 Corinthians 15:26King James Version (KJV)
Somebody say "Amen!" Wait, somebody actually did in that video.
As I recently told Phat, a great many of us atheists were raised in a religion and were taught what it is supposed to be. I was raised Protestant and went to Sunday School and Vacation Bible School. I was baptized at 11 after having been taken to a Billy Graham event. A year later, I decided I needed to get serious about religion, so, proceeding from a naäve premise that I was supposed to believe what the Bible said, I started to read the Bible (KJV) from cover to cover. I only made it through about two-thirds of Genesis before I realized that I just could not believe what I was reading. Since I could not believe what the Bible said, the only thing to do was to leave. Subsequent learning about the bloody history of Christianity, learning from fundamenalists (ie, Jesus Freaks at Calvary Chapel, c. 1970), studying creationism (YEC "creation science" specifically), trying to converse with creationists (and becoming utterly disgusted by their dishonesty), and learning about Christian Reconstructionism (the forefathers of Christian Nationalism), and witnessing daily the crass hypocrisy of "true Christians" have all only served to strengthen my atheism and to prove out that I had made the right choice sixty (60) years ago.
But still, like many other atheists who had been raised in Christianity, I remember what I was taught Christianity is supposed to be, and Christian Nationalism and those churches that embrace it are anything but what Christianity had taught us Christianity is supposed to be. When James Dobson died, John Fugelsang said that his devoted his life to creating "Christ-free Christianity" and wished that he rest in peace (RIP), "though I doubt that that will be allowed where he's going."
It is therefore very refreshing to see a Christian preacher, Baptist I assume from his autobiographical references, have the courage to stand up before a congregation (again, presumably Baptist) and affirm what Christianity is supposed to be, what we had been taught it is and should be.
Not just refreshing, but also ... what is this that I'm feeling? I think, that it is Hope.
Presbyterian actually. Fun fact, I was raised Presbyterian too. And Fred Rogers was Presbyterian.
Looks like he's also a current Texas State legislator and running for a US Senate seat.
-->“The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.” - Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
“A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity.” – Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." - Barash, David 1995...
"Many that live deserve death. And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then be not too eager to deal out death in the name of justice, fearing for your own safety. Even the wise cannot see all ends." - Gandalf, J. R. R. Tolkien: The Lord Of the Rings
"The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." 1 Corinthians 15:26King James Version (KJV)
But still, like many other atheists who had been raised in Christianity, I remember what I was taught Christianity is supposed to be, and Christian Nationalism and those churches that embrace it are anything but what Christianity had taught us Christianity is supposed to be.
Yes, much the same here. But I became disenchanted when I saw all of the hypocrisy in the Church. I left once I realized that the churches were preaching a counterfeit Christianity.
It is indeed good to see some people (such as John Fugelsang and James Talarico) presenting the real deal.
Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity
Wiki:Fred McFeely Rogers (March 20, 1928 – February 27, 2003), better known as Mister Rogers, was an American television host and author. He was the creator, showrunner, and host of the preschool television series Mister Rogers' Neighborhood, which ran from 1968 to 2001.
I don't know where you got that Texas legislator stuff.
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy God alone is God *but* God is not alone~Ellis Potter We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
Critics would of course say that "God" is a product of human imagination...but then again God may well declare that all of creation is a product of His imagination! It is all in the perspective of the observer.~Phat
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy God alone is God *but* God is not alone~Ellis Potter We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
Critics would of course say that "God" is a product of human imagination...but then again God may well declare that all of creation is a product of His imagination! It is all in the perspective of the observer.~Phat
Ohhhh ok! A legislator who is also a preacher! We need more of those.
Not if that preacher leans Christian Nationalist, opposes the Constitution and good governance, and wishes to impose their own beliefs on the whole of society, especially their unbiblical beliefs.
Rather, what we need among preachers is more of them who actually follow Jesus and understand Church State Separation. Ones who actually the Christian dictum, The Golden Rule, which they borrowed from the Pharisees.
I don't know where you got that Texas legislator stuff.
It's a little hard to follow. Rahbin posted a sermon by James Talarico in Message 889:
Dwise1 commented in Message 890 that "It is therefore very refreshing to see a Christian preacher, Baptist I assume...", and Rahvin responded in Message 891:
Presbyterian actually. Fun fact, I was raised Presbyterian too. And Fred Rogers was Presbyterian. Looks like he's also a current Texas State legislator and running for a US Senate seat.
Perhaps too many pronouns and side references across the messages, but in those portions Rahvin and Dwise1 were referring to James Talarico who is a Democratic state senator in Texas running for a national Senate seat.
I came across this gem which shows Talarico at work.
He asks pointed questions such as "Do you believe schools are for education rather than indoctrination"?
The Christian Nationalist opponent (Rep.Noble) was flustered and considered Talarico to be a thorn in her flesh, in my opinion.
I would vote for Talarico in government in a heartbeat. He is going into the Lions Den.
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy God alone is God *but* God is not alone~Ellis Potter We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
Critics would of course say that "God" is a product of human imagination...but then again God may well declare that all of creation is a product of His imagination! It is all in the perspective of the observer.~Phat
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