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Author Topic:   Phat Unplugged
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9697
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 6.2


Message 556 of 571 (922819)
04-11-2025 3:19 AM
Reply to: Message 555 by Phat
04-11-2025 2:06 AM


Re: The Art Of The Steal?
Phat writes:
Ukraine can never win that war.
Ukraine could have won this war had the NATO countries helped it fully and immediately instead of drip feeding help making it certain that they would lose slowly but in a limited way.
That wasn't Trump's fault but Trump is now making everything even worse.
I assume you voted for Trump to end the war overnight. Despite giving Putin everything he could and betraying Ukraine Trump has so far failed to end this war and done a lot of harm to them and your allies. There is now a spring offensive by Russia, a doubling of attacks not a lessening.
Your stock portfolio may have to take a hit because we are no longer perpetually feeding the military-industrial complex and chosen progressives worldwide. Quit making yourselves wealthy while blaming the billionaires and hiding behind the fake badge of democracy.
This, as usual, is wrong. Trump is now ramping up US military engagement with Iran and what is happening in the stock market is having large effects on everyone's pensions. It was the crash of the bond market that made Trump cave in and change his mind and that would have been even worse for ordinary people.
reuters.com

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 555 by Phat, posted 04-11-2025 2:06 AM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18761
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 3.5


(1)
Message 557 of 571 (922820)
04-11-2025 5:13 AM
Reply to: Message 554 by DrJones*
04-10-2025 9:46 PM


Re: The Art Of The Steal?
Because we would have spent more money than Europe itself would have had to do. The previous administration was not as proactive as Trump is. They cried about giving billionaires tax breaks, yet by supporting the military-industrial complex in the name of Democracy, they perpetuated a monied class getting wealthy through an overpriced market caused by continuing to kick the can down the road.
Never mind the debts. Modern Monetary Theory governed the previous administration.
Modern Monetary Theory explained
. I don't buy it.
AddByEdit: I'm rambling again. My blood sugar must be off.

When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
God alone is God *but* God is not alone~Ellis Potter
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
Critics would of course say that "God" is a product of human imagination...but then again God may well declare that all of creation is a product of His imagination! It is all in the perspective of the observer.~Phat

This message is a reply to:
 Message 554 by DrJones*, posted 04-10-2025 9:46 PM DrJones* has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10450
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 6.5


Message 558 of 571 (922827)
04-11-2025 11:11 AM
Reply to: Message 555 by Phat
04-11-2025 2:06 AM


Re: The Art Of The Steal?
Phat writes:
Ukraine can never win that war.
That's for Ukrainians to decide. It's their country that was invaded, and it's them who are putting their necks on the line.
Your stock portfolio may have to take a hit because we are no longer perpetually feeding the military-industrial complex and chosen progressives worldwide. Quit making yourselves wealthy while blaming the billionaires and hiding behind the fake badge of democracy.
So says the guy who wants to manipulate the gold market to get rich.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 555 by Phat, posted 04-11-2025 2:06 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 559 by Phat, posted 04-11-2025 1:30 PM Taq has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18761
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 3.5


(2)
Message 559 of 571 (922828)
04-11-2025 1:30 PM
Reply to: Message 558 by Taq
04-11-2025 11:11 AM


You and I Always Disagree
quote:
So says the guy who wants to manipulate the gold market to get rich.
The precious metals markets have been manipulated for years. No peon grocery clerk who cant even afford an ounce of gold or crypto is about to affect the market. I DO know how the markets have been manipulated, however. ETF's. For all your expertise on finance, you likely don't see paper gold and silver as a problem yet they are. The billionaire whales, the "bullion banks" (Especially JP Morgan Chase) have attempted to manipulate the Comex for years. They finally are losing their grip. Gold is going up because it is a tier one asset that is safer than T-Bills in today's economies. If any of you had any common sense at all, you would have long since allocated 5% of your portfolios to be invested in hard assets.
As for Ukraine:
Taq writes:
It's their country that was invaded, and it's them who are putting their necks on the line.
Had Zelensky been more humble and offered the US some mineral rights in return for our loans *Gifts* He would have put his country's welfare where his mouth is. The US will work with anyone needing our help who will work with us.

When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
God alone is God *but* God is not alone~Ellis Potter
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
Critics would of course say that "God" is a product of human imagination...but then again God may well declare that all of creation is a product of His imagination! It is all in the perspective of the observer.~Phat

This message is a reply to:
 Message 558 by Taq, posted 04-11-2025 11:11 AM Taq has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 560 by Tangle, posted 04-11-2025 1:49 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 562 by Taq, posted 04-11-2025 3:45 PM Phat has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9697
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 6.2


(1)
Message 560 of 571 (922829)
04-11-2025 1:49 PM
Reply to: Message 559 by Phat
04-11-2025 1:30 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
Any truth in this?
Lily Levental
???? BILLIONAIRES RAKE IN BILLIONS AFTER TRUMP PAUSES TARIFFS — WAS INSIDER INFO IN PLAY? ????
Wall Street just handed the world’s richest people one of their biggest paydays ever—and it all happened within hours of Donald Trump announcing a surprise pause on his aggressive tariff plan.
The top 10 billionaires gained a combined $135.33 billion on Wednesday, according to Bloomberg’s Billionaire Index. Elon Musk alone made $35.9 billion in one day. It was a massive financial swing triggered by Trump’s announcement, which sent the markets soaring after weeks of turbulence.
But the timing has raised serious questions.
Just before the news broke, Trump posted the word “buy” on social media. Now, some are asking: did anyone have advance notice of the policy reversal? And if so, did they cash in?
Legal experts point out that trading on non-public information could constitute insider trading—a federal crime. Lawmakers are already calling for investigations into possible market manipulation tied to the sudden shift.
Even in a volatile market, a move this big—so fast—has people wondering whether the game is being played fairly. If billionaires were tipped off while everyday Americans were left in the dark, it’s not just unethical. It could be criminal.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 559 by Phat, posted 04-11-2025 1:30 PM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 561 by Percy, posted 04-11-2025 3:41 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 23330
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 6.1


(2)
Message 561 of 571 (922831)
04-11-2025 3:41 PM
Reply to: Message 560 by Tangle
04-11-2025 1:49 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
Tangle writes in Message 560:
Even in a volatile market, a move this big—so fast—has people wondering whether the game is being played fairly. If billionaires were tipped off while everyday Americans were left in the dark, it’s not just unethical. It could be criminal.
In the U.S., trading in securities using privileged and private information is definitely criminal. The only reason I have trouble believing any billionaires would do this is because it is so obviously criminal. A billionaire would have the means to fight the charges for years, but the possible penalties include prison time. They're already living the good life, why risk it?
But Martha Stewart (is she famous over there, too?) went to jail for only 5 months for insider trading combined with making false statements, conspiracy and obstruction. Maybe if you make a billion it's worth it.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 560 by Tangle, posted 04-11-2025 1:49 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10450
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 6.5


(2)
Message 562 of 571 (922832)
04-11-2025 3:45 PM
Reply to: Message 559 by Phat
04-11-2025 1:30 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
Phat writes:
I DO know how the markets have been manipulated, however. ETF's. For all your expertise on finance, you likely don't see paper gold and silver as a problem yet they are.
I do think paper gold is a problem. There's every indication that there is more than 10x as much paper gold as there is gold backing it. That's why I would never buy paper gold.
You said you want the US government to artificially increase the price of gold by 10x. Why?
Had Zelensky been more humble and offered the US some mineral rights in return for our loans *Gifts* He would have put his country's welfare where his mouth is.
Why mineral rights? That's just stupid. Hey, how about this. They just repay the loans the way they find best. In fact, why are we even worried about the loans? They are our ally. Why not just help them? Why does everything have to be so transactional?
Added in edit: Are you unaware of all the proxy wars the US has been involved in, and why we do it? We want a weakened Russia because they are our adversaries and the adversary of our European allies. If we can weaken them by giving another country military assets we were predominately going to be scrapped anyway, why shouldn't we? Seems like a really, really good idea to me.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 559 by Phat, posted 04-11-2025 1:30 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 564 by DrJones*, posted 04-11-2025 8:19 PM Taq has not replied
 Message 565 by Phat, posted 04-12-2025 2:55 PM Taq has replied

  
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2383
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 6.7


(1)
Message 563 of 571 (922834)
04-11-2025 8:18 PM
Reply to: Message 555 by Phat
04-11-2025 2:06 AM


Re: The Art Of The Steal?
Ukraine can never win that war
as others have said that's for the Ukrainian people to decide.
Quit making yourselves wealthy while blaming the billionaires and hiding behind the fake badge of democracy
oh get fucked Phat. I want the Ukrainian people to be free, you want to roll over and surrender to putin.
this is what you're endorsing by calling for the surrender of Ukraine.
but hey, you might have to pay a bit more in taxes so fuck those children
Dozens killed by Russian missile strike in Dnipro, Ukraine | CBC.ca
Russian missile strike kills 3 children, including twins, in eastern Ukraine | CBC.ca

It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 555 by Phat, posted 04-11-2025 2:06 AM Phat has not replied

  
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2383
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 6.7


Message 564 of 571 (922835)
04-11-2025 8:19 PM
Reply to: Message 562 by Taq
04-11-2025 3:45 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
We want a weakened Russia because they are our adversaries and the adversary of our European allies. If we can weaken them by giving another country military assets we were predominately going to be scrapped anyway, why shouldn't we? Seems like a really, really good idea to me.
and we can do it without risking the lives any western service members.

It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 562 by Taq, posted 04-11-2025 3:45 PM Taq has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18761
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 3.5


(2)
Message 565 of 571 (922841)
04-12-2025 2:55 PM
Reply to: Message 562 by Taq
04-11-2025 3:45 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
Taq writes:
Why mineral rights?
Ukraine has minerals that we need and dont have. Why should we be dependant on China...for ANYTHING?
That's just stupid. Hey, how about this. They just repay the loans the way they find best. In fact, why are we even worried about the loans? They are our ally. Why not just help them? Why does everything have to be so transactional?
I can't believe that you even said this. So you admit (and advocate) that the US simply give away stuff. THATS just stupid! Thats also your answer as to why *we* didn't elect Harris.
If you need help, you should be prepared to reciprocate in any way possible. Or do you expect your wealthier friends to buy lunch every time you meet?

When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
God alone is God *but* God is not alone~Ellis Potter
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
Critics would of course say that "God" is a product of human imagination...but then again God may well declare that all of creation is a product of His imagination! It is all in the perspective of the observer.~Phat

This message is a reply to:
 Message 562 by Taq, posted 04-11-2025 3:45 PM Taq has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 566 by Percy, posted 04-12-2025 3:13 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 567 by DrJones*, posted 04-12-2025 5:12 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 568 by Taq, posted 04-14-2025 11:34 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 569 by Zucadragon, posted 04-15-2025 8:00 AM Phat has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 23330
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 6.1


Message 566 of 571 (922842)
04-12-2025 3:13 PM
Reply to: Message 565 by Phat
04-12-2025 2:55 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
Phat writes in Message 565:
I can't believe that you even said this. So you admit (and advocate) that the US simply give away stuff. THATS just stupid! Thats also your answer as to why *we* didn't elect Harris.
Have you ever perhaps heard of the Marshall Plan?
Did the U.S. demand war reparations of Japan after WWII?
Once you've obtained the answers to those questions, here's another one: How did that work out for us?
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 565 by Phat, posted 04-12-2025 2:55 PM Phat has not replied

  
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2383
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 6.7


(2)
Message 567 of 571 (922850)
04-12-2025 5:12 PM
Reply to: Message 565 by Phat
04-12-2025 2:55 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
So you admit (and advocate) that the US simply give away stuff.
you're buying the destruction of one of your largest rival's military and economy without risking the lives of any of your service members, it's a bargain.

It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 565 by Phat, posted 04-12-2025 2:55 PM Phat has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10450
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 6.5


(1)
Message 568 of 571 (922882)
04-14-2025 11:34 AM
Reply to: Message 565 by Phat
04-12-2025 2:55 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
Phat writes:
Ukraine has minerals that we need and dont have.
No, they don't.
Cowboy State Daily: Rare Earths Discovery Near Wheatland So Big It Could Be World Leader – American Rare Earths
We have plenty of access to rare earth deposits here in the states. The only part people don't like is the processing which is really nasty for the environment. That's why we continue to let China produce rare earths, because they are willing to destroy their environment to produce them cheaply.
I can't believe that you even said this. So you admit (and advocate) that the US simply give away stuff. THATS just stupid! Thats also your answer as to why *we* didn't elect Harris.
Yes, it's called foreign aid. We do it all of the time. It's called "building alliances". Perhaps you should look into it.
This is how the US becomes a world leader, by helping out our allies.
If you need help, you should be prepared to reciprocate in any way possible. Or do you expect your wealthier friends to buy lunch every time you meet?
I buy lunch for friends who aren't well off as I am, I do it quite a bit. Isn't that what friends should do?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 565 by Phat, posted 04-12-2025 2:55 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Zucadragon
Member
Posts: 168
From: Netherlands
Joined: 06-28-2006
Member Rating: 6.2


(2)
Message 569 of 571 (922900)
04-15-2025 8:00 AM
Reply to: Message 565 by Phat
04-12-2025 2:55 PM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
If you need help, you should be prepared to reciprocate in any way possible. Or do you expect your wealthier friends to buy lunch every time you meet?
When I was going through a financial hard time, friends helped keep me on my feet without asking for anything in return.
Now I'm more comfortable and I in turn have helped those who I consider friends in troublesome situations, because their comfort is worth more to me than having a few hundred euro more.
I don't ask for them to pay me back, that's a personal choice, but really, they know they can trust in me and not have that stress, and I know I can trust in them if I were to stumble and require aid.
I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 565 by Phat, posted 04-12-2025 2:55 PM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 570 by Tangle, posted 04-15-2025 8:58 AM Zucadragon has not replied
 Message 571 by Taq, posted 04-15-2025 10:00 AM Zucadragon has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9697
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 6.2


(2)
Message 570 of 571 (922901)
04-15-2025 8:58 AM
Reply to: Message 569 by Zucadragon
04-15-2025 8:00 AM


Re: You and I Always Disagree
You're wasting your time, those are Christian values, Phat is not interested in those.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 569 by Zucadragon, posted 04-15-2025 8:00 AM Zucadragon has not replied

  
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