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Author Topic:   Do the Right Thing Tomorrow, Yanks
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


Message 7 of 203 (678150)
11-05-2012 4:36 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Tangle
11-05-2012 1:35 PM


I'm in California...my state is a foregone conclusion.
I'll be trying to do some good on the other items up for a vote tomorrow, though.

The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.
- Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of
variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the
outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Tangle, posted 11-05-2012 1:35 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


Message 53 of 203 (678269)
11-06-2012 12:19 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by dronestar
11-06-2012 12:01 PM


If you are NOT in a swing state, there ARE other options: Green Party presidential candidate Jill Stein
I like her, what little I know of her.
But not enough to help split the vote. That can only help Romney.

The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.
- Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of
variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the
outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by dronestar, posted 11-06-2012 12:01 PM dronestar has not replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


Message 93 of 203 (678383)
11-07-2012 1:41 PM
Reply to: Message 85 by Percy
11-07-2012 8:46 AM


Re: On the election...
I like that a bit better than the old "When the poor starve, they will eat the rich."

The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.
- Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of
variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the
outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 85 by Percy, posted 11-07-2012 8:46 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


Message 123 of 203 (678649)
11-09-2012 4:49 PM
Reply to: Message 122 by Percy
11-09-2012 4:26 PM


Re: Nate Silver Is A Witch
The question on Fox News to Karl Rove was telling: "Is this just math you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better?"
On FOX NEWS!
I had to watch it twice just to be sure of what I was seeing!
When Fox News tells you that you, as a conservative, are likely to be delusional, it's time to seek professional help.
ABE: Also, regarding the subtitle - wouldn't Nate technically be a Warlock, since he's male? These are important distinctions.
Edited by Rahvin, : No reason given.

The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.
- Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of
variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the
outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 122 by Percy, posted 11-09-2012 4:26 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


Message 172 of 203 (682213)
11-30-2012 2:35 PM
Reply to: Message 165 by foreveryoung
11-30-2012 2:16 PM


Re: Facing Up to the Enormity of Our Problem
The article is talking about the type of life conservatives enjoy living
I'm curious, FEY - what does this refer to, specifically?

The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.
- Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of
variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the
outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 165 by foreveryoung, posted 11-30-2012 2:16 PM foreveryoung has not replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


(13)
Message 191 of 203 (682267)
11-30-2012 6:39 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by foreveryoung
11-30-2012 6:03 PM


Re: liberty
I also believe in limits to liberty only in those cases where it is in the best interests of the majority of the population.
If Jane Smith wants to marry her girlfriend, how does it affect the "best interests of the majority of the population?"
How does a marriage affect anyone at all other than the people who marry?
If Jane and Judy marry, it takes not one dollar from your wallet. It causes you not a single injury to your person or property. Your choices are not limited in any way.
I understand the abortion argument from your perspective, and honestly the pro-life position is entirely reasonable - if you consider a clump of fetal cells to have the same moral weight and social interest as a toddler. That is where the contention lies, it's what the Supreme COurt decided against, yadda yadda....
But when it comes to the "best interests of the majority of the population," there are some realities you need to consider that you might not realize, having never been alive when abortion was outlawed.
When abortion is illegal, women still get abortions. They are simply forced to do so through alternate means - if you can''t go to a proper medical facility, you'll use a coat hangar, or pay a man with a knife, or beg your boyfriend/husband to brutally beat your abdomen, or drink poison.
These are all real things that happened regularly prior to Roe v Wade. Society suffered, in the form of our mothers, our daughters, our sisters and our wives.
Beyond that, there is the simple reality of unwanted children. A mother who is unprepared for raising children will often be forced to abandon dreams of college and success, and will require government aid to survive and feed the family she wasn't yet ready for. There are social costs to disallowing that choice; the issue of abortion is not only about whether you attach moral significance to a fetus. If you complain about welfare moms, ask yourself how many more there will be if women cannot choose abortion.
Pregnancy itself is also a major biological event - it's not like a day at the gym. Pregnant women go through many physiological changes while pregnant, including all of the visible growth, but also hormonal changes. These have a lifetime effect on her body...and when complications arise, there is a chance of death.
Is it right for the government to be able to force a woman to undergo a medical procedure? You have the right to refuse medical care - if a doctor says you need an amputation, you can say "no." But if abortion is illegal, you are forcing a percentage of women to undergo caesarian births - would you be able to forcibly restrain an unwilling woman so that a doctor can cut her open?
This is a case where restricting liberty actually affects the "best interests of the majority of the population" negatively.
The "personal responsibility" schtick doesn't really fly, either - yes, people should take responsibility for their children. But some, like me, never want to have any children. I and my partner use birth control, and I'm considering a vasectomy...but even when being responsible, birth control sometimes fails. Sex is a normal and healthy part of any committed relationship...and even behaving responsibly can result in an unwanted pregnancy through dumb luck. Should simple misfortune doom a couple's life plans, and condemn their child to being born to parents who never wanted a baby?
Your arguments are short and simple - you're taking a stand on principle, and you aren't conveying any argument regarding the goal that you wish to serve with those principles. You're basically arguing via soundbyte.
I'm a social libertarian, FEY. I believe that a capitalist society requires government regulation to protect the people from the amoral profit-centered actions of unrestrained corporate policy, and I believe that a strong social safety net is necessary to preserve the freedom of everyone and guarantee at minimum the rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness...but like you I also believe that the government should be strictly "hands off" when it comes to personal life. I don't want the government telling me I need to be a specific religion, or that I need to support a specific policy, or that I can't say something, or that I can't marry someone, or that I can't do something with my own body.

The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it.
- Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of
variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the
outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." Barash, David 1995.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by foreveryoung, posted 11-30-2012 6:03 PM foreveryoung has not replied

  
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