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Author
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Topic: Is purposeless torture moral?
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 292 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 31 of 106 (660032)
04-20-2012 12:50 PM
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Reply to: Message 9 by ringo
04-14-2012 3:56 PM
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| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 9 by ringo, posted 04-14-2012 3:56 PM | | ringo has seen this message but not replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 292 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 32 of 106 (660035)
04-20-2012 1:10 PM
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Reply to: Message 17 by Phat
04-16-2012 4:04 AM
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Re: Topic Synopsis I
Phat Yes. Many human concepts have been built into God when man invented him. You are right in Guantanamo being interesting from a moral standpoint but it seems that most find some deterrent value in it’s existence. We do not want to place a limit on justice. I do not recall that you had a belief in angels and the other supernatural parts of the faith. Is that your firm belief? Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 17 by Phat, posted 04-16-2012 4:04 AM | | Phat has not replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 292 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 33 of 106 (660036)
04-20-2012 1:25 PM
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Reply to: Message 27 by jar
04-20-2012 12:37 PM
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Jar 1. "So you say but that is irrelevant to the topic. 2. Did you claim that hell "is used purely for revenge retribution and cruelty"? 3. If so, then even under your idea of what hell is, there is a purpose. 4. Is revenge a purpose? 5. Is retribution a purpose? 6. Is cruelty a purpose?" ----------------------------------------- Good grief. 1. No. Only that they do not speak to purpose. 2. Yes. Did I miss something? 3. We have conditions to date. No purpose. 4. 5. 6. No. What do they accomplish? Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 27 by jar, posted 04-20-2012 12:37 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 34 by jar, posted 04-20-2012 1:29 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 413 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Why isn't revenge a purpose? Why isn't retribution a purpose? Why isn't cruelty a purpose?
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 292 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 35 of 106 (660038)
04-20-2012 1:32 PM
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Reply to: Message 29 by Huntard
04-20-2012 12:42 PM
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Huntard Punishing sinners is not a purpose. To what end is the punishment given? You punish to change attitudes and actions. Hell does not. Even with a change, punishment goes on. We agree on reality. Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 29 by Huntard, posted 04-20-2012 12:42 PM | | Huntard has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 38 by Huntard, posted 04-20-2012 1:40 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Evlreala
Member (Idle past 3094 days) Posts: 88 From: Portland, OR United States of America Joined: 08-12-2009
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Greatest I am writes: Is purposeless torture moral?
Is it moral for God to use or let others choose to use his torture chamber called hell or the lake of fire? What is moral? Before I could attempt to address your question, I would have to understand what it is you're asking. In context to your question, what moral theory are you subscribing too?
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 292 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 37 of 106 (660040)
04-20-2012 1:35 PM
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Reply to: Message 34 by jar
04-20-2012 1:29 PM
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Jar If you think that they have purpose then state what that purpose is. Did you understand the reasons why you punish? Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 34 by jar, posted 04-20-2012 1:29 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 40 by jar, posted 04-20-2012 1:44 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Huntard
Member (Idle past 2314 days) Posts: 2870 From: Limburg, The Netherlands Joined: 09-02-2008
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Greatest I am writes: Punishing sinners is not a purpose.
How the hell (hehe) can that not be a purpose?
To what end is the punishment given?
To teach them that they shouldn't have sinned. So they serve as an example.
You punish to change attitudes and actions.
Or you punish as retribution.
Hell does not. Even with a change, punishment goes on.
So?
We agree on reality.
 Edited by Huntard, : Spellings
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 292 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 39 of 106 (660042)
04-20-2012 1:41 PM
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Reply to: Message 36 by Evlreala
04-20-2012 1:35 PM
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Evlreala My mortal system begins here. Jonathan Haidt: The moral roots of liberals and conservatives | TED Talk We will agree on most moral questions so let us not rewrite the dictionary definition of words. Jump in relaxed Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 36 by Evlreala, posted 04-20-2012 1:35 PM | | Evlreala has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 46 by Evlreala, posted 04-20-2012 4:33 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 413 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Why I punish is irrelevant. Punishment is not even mentioned in the questions I asked you. I asked:
quote:
Why isn't revenge a purpose? Why isn't retribution a purpose? Why isn't cruelty a purpose?
You keep moving the goal posts. Now it seems you are NOT asking if there is some purpose but rather "Is such behavior what YOU consider moral". That's an entirely different and somewhat pointless question. YOU are the best person to say whether or not YOU consider such actions moral; but that is unrelated to whether or not the actions have a purpose.
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 292 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 41 of 106 (660044)
04-20-2012 1:53 PM
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Reply to: Message 38 by Huntard
04-20-2012 1:40 PM
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How the hell (hehe) can that not be a purpose? Then, (hehe), name it. To teach them that they shouldn't have sinned. Education does that. So they serve as an example. To whom? Regards DL Edited by Greatest I am, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 38 by Huntard, posted 04-20-2012 1:40 PM | | Huntard has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 45 by Huntard, posted 04-20-2012 4:02 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 292 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 42 of 106 (660046)
04-20-2012 1:59 PM
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Reply to: Message 40 by jar
04-20-2012 1:44 PM
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Jar Of course punishment is related to hell. That is what hell is all about. You have yet to show the purpose of hell. Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 40 by jar, posted 04-20-2012 1:44 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 43 by jar, posted 04-20-2012 2:08 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 413 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Too funny. Did you even read Message 40? Revenge is a purpose. Retribution is a purpose. Cruelty is a purpose.
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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ringo
Member (Idle past 430 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Greatest I am writes: The good of the many in this case would need to be placed above the good of the one to be tortured and even above the good mental health of the one doing the torturing.
Is morality a quantitative science? It's easy to compare a million deaths with harm to two individuals but what if the victim is a kidnapped child? Does saving one life add up to "more moral" than torturing one person and risking the mental health of another?
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Huntard
Member (Idle past 2314 days) Posts: 2870 From: Limburg, The Netherlands Joined: 09-02-2008
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Greatest I am writes: Then, (hehe), name it.
What? The purpose? I already told you: punishing sinners.
Education does that.
Yes, and so does whipping them (for example). In fact, in this case, whipping them is the education.
To whom?
To those that might consider sinning against god.
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